Uther's latest changes

General Discussion
1

Greetings.

Wanted to take a look on Uther and the recent nerfs he got due to being played as a solo tank.

Post is long so
tl;dr - what do you think about Uther’s nerfs?

First of all, here are the patch notes:

Base

  • Health reduced from 2075 to 2000.
  • Health Regeneration reduced from 4.316 to 4.168.
  • Hammer of Justice [E]
    • Cooldown increased from 8 to 10 seconds.

Talents

  • Level 4
    • Holy Shock [Q]
      • Damage reduced from 50% to 40% of Holy Light’s Healing.

Developer Comment: Uther has recently risen to the top of the ranks as the most powerful Healer in the game. Whether he’s played as a Healer or a Tank, he has proven to be a too effective at his role, so we’re reducing some of his overall power.

I will be making comparisons between the other 3 melee healers - Reghar, Kharazim and Stukov*.

*-not necessarily melee
**-Deckard not included since his kit does not require him being close to the enemy

Let’s talk base stats

  • HP
    • Now, 2 nerfs later his base hp was brought 2156 → 2075 → 2000 which is in line with Reghar (2000) and Kharazim (2027) and more than Stukov (1765)

His HP is pretty solid for a melee hero.

  • AA range
    • Uther - 1
    • Reghar - 1.5
    • Kharazim - 1.75
    • Stukov - 1.5

Uther has single lowest AA range in game – 1 (only 4 out of 87 heroes have range of 1)

  • DPS
    • Uther - 75
    • Reghar - 132.5
    • Kharazim - 128
    • Stukov - 174.9

Uther has the weakest melee AA of the 4 by far. To compare, Murky also has 75 DPS, even Erik the swift has 93.

So far not looking too good for Uther.

Let’s talk heals.

Disclaimer. These comparisons are not 100% accurate as each healer has different utility and talents. Look at the data as a more general comparison of base stats.

  • Base (main heal source)

    • Uther’s Q 362 + 181 (self) = 543
      • even if adding W, 177 * 5 = 885, Q + W = 1428
    • Reghar’s Q 260 * 3 = 780
    • Kharazim W 276 * 5 = 1380
    • Stukovs D 450 * 5 = 2250

  • CD

    • Uther’s Q 12s ( W also 12s)
    • Reghar’s Q 8s
    • Kharazim W 10s
    • Stukovs D 16s

  • Mana

    • Uther’s Q 80 mana ( + 70 mana if adding W)
    • Reghar’s Q 55 mana
    • Kharazim W 65 mana
    • Stukovs D – (lets say 40 for the Q cast)

Is this even fair?

As you can see, considering base stats only, Uther sucks.
Considering heals only, Uther sucks.
What makes up for it is the stun.

Now the stun got nerfed without any compensation in any other field.
Just a straight nerf.

It is too early to call Uther useless or anything like that.

All I am saying is that noone in the forums ever complained about Uther. What people complained about was Auriel’s Ressurrect. Yet Uther also got his share of nerfs which basically came only because some people started playing him as a main tank.

For a really long period of time Uther stayed almost the same. Just now some players invented a new strategy without other changes to the hero.

I personally liked that Uther was the tanky healer, though I have never seen a solo tank Uther in my games. Must be a phenomenon in certain ranks.

Ultimately, I have nothing against the base HP nerf if that was what allowed him to solo tank, but I see no explanation to +25% increase in stun CD and -20% reduction of Holy Shock damage when it already did half of the heal amount.

Uther really lacks in base stats and his heals cannot keep up with constant poke damage until very late in game. Now they laid a big nerf on what was essentially the only thing that Uther has - stuns.

Rant over

What are your thoughts?

4 Likes
2

You can’t play Rehgar or Kharazim as a tank. Uther’s armor, HP and Holy Shock build let him be a main tank who can peel for teammates, save them and fight in the front line all at once.

That can’t possibly be an intended role for a healer so it’s logical they nerfed his numbers.

9 Likes
3

So the logical thing was to reduce its damage not the self heal or the lvl 16 talent that lets you heal 3 times as much?

4

RIP tank Uther 2019-2020 :shield:

8 Likes
5

I don’t like the changes but I understand them. It was awesome picking a healer as tank without your teammates blinking an eye, while it lasted.

1 Like
6

I dont like the direction, and dont like it since the first nerf.

First and foremost, tank/bruiser Uther heals too much for a tank/bruiser.
Solution - remove baseline W healing.

Secondly, he is lagging behind at healing unless his comp doesnt need much healing to begin with.
Solution - buff W quest, A LOT (healer build).

If Blizz is fine with the idea of tank/bruiser Uther, revert hp nerfs.
Would even revert E nerf as well, although keep an eye on it.

Seriously, stop with the mana meme.

2 Likes
7

Passive armor on heals?

4 Likes
8

You only get that bonus healing when healing others, so you won’t get the benefit when using Holy Shock.
And if you heal someone else you don’t get the CDR of Holy Shock Which is why I’m hesitant to use Q on allies when I pick Uther. :stuck_out_tongue:

I think nerfing the damage is fine.
Holy Shock heals Uther, provides armor, and does damage.
That’s healing, tanking, and dps all in one.

Uther is the model “Paladin” role, where Paladin is the tank/healer hybrid like bruisers are tank/dps hybrids.
So reducing dps makes sense, it’s the area he’s not supposed to exceed in.

It’s still not going to lower his strength too much, as late game Benediction-Divine Storm stun chains aren’t affected at all by the base Hammer cooldown change.

That’s literally why you pick Holy Shock.
Shock them to heal and gain armor, then tank the poke.
181 base healing and 25 armor for 0 mana every 6 seconds is pretty damned strong.
Which is why the changes aren’t how I would have handled the situation, and I don’t think they’ll amount to much at all.

2 Likes
9

I did.
And I’m pretty sure others as well. He was banned a lot recently at high of the ladder.

He also provides a lot of Armor, so yea.

I’m so glad they finally nerfed Uther (I don’t have a problem against him, I play him, others have problems with my Uther, and I knew it was just not fair).

4 Likes
10

That is an error in the description. It should state “when not self casting”, because Holy Shock synergizes with that talent.

I was referring to healing teammates. His strength is burst heal. But that also means he cannot solo heal vs poke heavy enemies or teammates with low self sustain.

11

No, that looks like a bug to me.
The wording is correct, because your explanation ONLY works with Holy Shock. They try to avoid talents like that.

I’ve avoided picking it because I went by the description.
Benediction is strong, but that looks to make him unkillable with Holy Shock…
So I’d assume it’s a bug.

And like I said, Holy Shock partly counters poke by allowing you to tank shots meant for your allies so you don’t have to heal them as often.
He has bad sustain healing EXCEPT for self healing through Holy Shock (and Blessed Champion but that’s later and requires melee range)

*nevermind I read your description wrong I think, will have to fix later

12

Where the hell is this Uther healer/tank meta? in QM? OMEGALUL?

13

Basically I went through a lot of the older threads about Uther and came to these conclusions:

  • In higher ranks he is more likely to be played as a tank or bruiser than a healer
  • He sucks at being the main healer
  • The reason why he can be a bruiser is spamming Holy Shock

(Source for one of the threads: Please look into Uther (Ranked Mode, Diamond/Master/GM))

What can I add to this:

  • Uther has no real alternative at lvl4. Holy Fire is like a garbage version of Burning Rage. 13 dps, really? Really?
  • It also a necessity to pick Holy Shock due to overall lack of damage that Uther has (talked about damage in my main post) and that extra half-Q comes really handy.
  • Healing allies costs a lot of mana and puts you on 12 second CD which further incentivizes Holy Shock spamming playstyle and getting a real healer instead.

It has worked that way since the lvl16 talent was introduced (a long time ago). I am sure it is intentional.

14

Here are my thoughts as an uther player

Uther was a niche solo healer before these changes and he will be a niche healer after them. He’s still going to be great on certain maps.

Main tank uther will still be viable in niche situations but will be much less common

Bruiser/solo lane uther is still fine and will continue to be picked by uther players

Tldr uther’s still going to be a fine pick he just wont be instabanned as often nor will he maintank as frequently.

1 Like
15

JAJAJA CUAL PRIMA ??? ESA PERRA NOO ES NADA DE MI :rofl:

16

I had somewhat similar experience from the few games I played now. My playstyle and talent picks did not change one bit, I was just weaker at doing the same things as before.

1 Like
17

Mostly above Master. Maybe occassionally in mid-high diamond?

Pre-nerf I saw him a lot on GM streams, at least every second or third game had a team with him as a solo tank and nobody said a word.

3 Likes
18

He does not. He’s just not ideal [he’s niche], because his heals are very limited especially in uncoordinated teams.

Developer Comment: Uther has recently risen to the top of the ranks as the most powerful Healer in the game. Whether he’s played as a Healer or a Tank, he has proven to be a too effective at his role, so we’re reducing some of his overall power.

I’m pretty sure they talk about soloheal Uther there as well, since I used him like that a lot, and I also saw others do the same.

What most ppl fail to realise, that as soloheal Uther, you should not fear death.
Going in, getting 1+ kills and dying is totally fine as Uther, because he is the strongest Healer there is while he’s dead thanks to his trait.

Holy Fire is 13 dps which gets increased by 20% up to 3 times if you AA. That makes it 21.
At lvl 13, where most Heroes get their burning rage at full stacks it does 35 dmg. For comparison, Anub’s deal 38. Mura’s deal 33 (67 to a single target if they’re stunned, rooted or slowed). Johanna deals 28 (with her “situational” extra dm).

You just got confused because he gets it earlier, but he’s close to the others.

3 Likes
19

PUES TENGO EL ROSTRO Y EL CULO DE PRINCESAAA :rage:

20

Yea solo heal uther is insane in certain comps and on dragonshire. He excels at keeping 1-2 other targets alive and divine shield has some nasty synergy with some assassins. He’s just not a generalist hero like brightwing.

(Lol jk *johanna)