Increase the damage of the bounces from 12 to 20 and also Increase numbers of stacks from 30 to 20.
Rolling Thunder
Increase the healing and damage amount from 3% of the target maximum health to 5% of the amount.
Level 4 Talents
Mana Tide
Increase mana restoration from 15 to 25 and cooldown reduction from 0.5 seconds to 0.75 seconds.
Level 7 Talents
Maelstorm Weapon
Quest is no longer unlimited and so the final reward:
After hitting enemy heroes 100 times, gain 50 bonus attack damage.
Ancestral Wrath
Increase number of Frostwolf Resilience required from 8 to 10 but Increase damage done from 15% of the target maximum health to 20% of the amount.
Level 16 Talents
Tempest Fury
After the final strike of Wind fury, the strike hit for 3 additional time with 70% of main damage.
Alpha Wolf
Increase damage done from 3% of target maximum health to 5% of the amount.
Increase the Feral Spirit root duration to 2 seconds.
Level 10/20 Talents
Earthquake// Earthen Shield
Reduce Earthquake’s delay time between each plus from 4 seconds to 3 seconds. or
Increase shield amount of Earthen Shield to 20% of the allies maximum health.
Wind Rush is Removed, new talent is Rewind.
Active it to reset the cooldown of Thrall’ s basic abilities.(70 seconds cooldown).
I replace rewind with windrush, because of its effect on Frostwolf Resilience and also having a second time to use the abilities, it is actually buffer than or maybe I miss something.
He is a warrior, need more to use of his damage and abilities, rewind can be a good choise both in term in stability and mobility and also damage done.
Actually I don’t think a short range teleport will be Insane powerfull for storm talent.
Increasing implies the resulting number is larger than the original number. As such you are saying that they should decrease the number of stacks from 30 to 20.
The amount per stack would need to be significantly nerfed below the current in order to permit that. This talent is already high tier in ARAM purely due to how easy it is to complete. As such it would be at best 15 damage per stack if the quest ran for 20 stacks.
This buff seems unnecessary. This talent is already strong, especially for poke or caster based builds.
This talent already wins games by itself. It does not need a buff.
Ranked game is in first place rather ARAM, the quest need this change to being complete sooner and so we can gain its utility and benefit as soon as it possible, this change is almost right.
About Mana Tide I disagree, the 0.5 seconds cooldowm reduction for the abilities that have at least 8 seconds cooldown is not enough, and if we want to define rewind for him or at least we want to work with talents that are based on cooldown reduction or additional charge system, we need to restore more mana and 15 amount is not enough.
Earthquake in my idea is not strong, the slow features are strong in the most situations but can be broken easily.
And the Earthshield shield point can not hold strong amount of damage special brust damage, of course Thrall is not a support hero, maybe we need to empower the damage done and slow amount replace of defining shiled point.
The Earthquake is same Strong at first view but in its contain this is not very strong, It has more of a scare aspect, as its name suggests!!
It was nerfed to its current state due to competitive games. Doing so benefited level 1 talent diversity. It also still stacks pretty fast as long as there is more than 1 hero in the same area. Strong on two lane maps where there will always be more than 1 enemy hero to fight, bad on 3 lane maps with most time spent soloing.
It applies to all abilities. Hence if all 3 abilities are on cooldown it gives a total of 1.5 seconds worth of cooldowns all at once.
Its main strength is due to what else is available at that talent tier. One talent ups toughness against auto attacks, the other reduces cooldown and mana cost of a specific ability while this helps mana sustain and all basic ability cooldowns. Sure it is not much, but if you use Chain Lightning or Windfury it is enough to justify its use.
15% health worth of shield for all allies 3 times is not trivial. That is 45% life worth of bonus in total coming over 12 seconds on a high damage hero that also benefits from every enemy hero Earthquake hits due to procing Frostwolf Resilience. This is why Earthen Shields is considered one of the more powerful level 20 talents, and also why it really does not need a buff.
If anything Worldbreaker and Nexus Blades need a buff as they are some of the most unpopular talents at the moment. If one looks at stats from sites like heroes profile they have under 10% pick rate at high leagues, with Worldbreaker being under 5%. These stats also show my point earlier in that Mana Tide has the highest pick rate and win rate of the tier and hence why that also does not really need a buff.
I agree. The earthquake upgrade at 20 is extremely powerful. Its like an alex W but with none of the down sides and it happens 3 times with a strong slow attached to it. The only other 20 talent that even comes close is tje teleport but even that is only rarely considered.
Yes.and my Idea will increase this amount to 2.25 seconds in total, ever in this new state this is just 2.25/21~10.71% amount of the total cooldown and it is very powerfull that’s seemed and already the current power of Mana Tide is 1.5/21~7.1% that is actually low amount.
Maybe we Imagine to using talents to making a combo to powering the Frostwolf Resilince at level 13 talents that:
For example If we want to work on windfury Build we almost have a strong Thrall that maybe does not need buff but I have another Idea.
We will use wind fury Build plus mana Tide then with a cast of wind fury we will have 10 stack plus a chain lightning cast and feral spirit, in totall we will have 3 Mana Tide that give us 45 mana and 1.5 seconds cooldown reduction for each abilities.
The mana restored can satisfy almost 1/3 of the total mana cost
Special about wind fury we will have 1.5/12~ 18% that this numbers (amount) will not help us actually, maybe we imagine windrush that make us 5 stack of mana tide that is more powerfull which show us the high win rate and pick rate of these talents.
About the win rate and pick rate of the level 20 talents:
Nerf windrush, get the bonus of windfury and decreas the cooldown or do a same.
World Breaker is also powerfull and don’t need buff.
About Bexus Blade increasing the numbers to 25% is good that I mentined it on my past topics.
Important Note that you and ever system most times missing it that you must not only consider the Rate parameters for make a buff or Nerf, the people who don’t want to pick Worldbreaker or Nexus Blade are actually noob, really what is the sweet is between other talents and Worldbreaker & Nexus blade that people most time want to pick them?
Being extremly powerfull is not all thing, don’t miss the point!!
Yes all those diamond and master players are “noobs”…
The reasons why have already been stated in this thread. Teleport is very strong for Thrall, especially since it comes with buffed movement speed afterwards as well. Like wise giving your entire team 15% maximum health shield 3 times over a long period is also strong as that results in a lot of absorbed damage on top of the already very strong Earthquake effect that allows all allies to easilly combo and land skill shots.
Worldbreaker has uses as an escape enabler or denier tool. However denying enemies from escaping all the other level 20s allow anyway so that aspect is not much value. Enabling your allies escape is more about mitigating a bad situation, something the other ultimate abilites can help combat directly. The extra cooldown reduction is useful for using it as a disruption (stun) tool to interrupt enemies, but that is more the job of your tank and the un-upgraded form of the ultimate is often good enough at that anyway.
Nexus Blade boosts damage but does not necessarily enable more damage or secure kills. It slows enemies, but you already have slowed enemies from Earthquake, or rooted enemies from his wolf which are far stronger than that effect. It also raises damage by 20% when you hit but that does not allow you to hit more often than you already do. This is where Wind Rush is good as the teleport and speed boost can enable additional hits on enemies Thrall would not other wise be able to get to and so enable him to secure more kills or land more damage when it matters while also being a backup escape option to deny kills. Of course if you took Earthquake then it is having to compete with the very powerful Earthen Shields which might not increase damage but with so much additional toughness to your team during a fight it does not have to.
I think thrall should get back his self sustain numbers, he was a bruiser that could go in the fight heal and get out if someone was skilled enough, after his rework he a ranged poke melee hero, they completely destroyed him, i completely stopped playing him when they reworked him. The only thing to balance its his sustain, it needs a buff.
