Orphea - Easily countered

General Discussion
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So because Blizzard managed to make an assassin that ACTUALLY sparked my interest (Something which hasn’t been the case since Rags was revealed back in 2016) I decided to go full nuts when it came down to Orphea and have pretty much played her non-stop with what sparetime I have had since the EU Servers came up - This amounts to me having played her in 50+ games as for now and I can say without a shadow of a doubt that anyone who cries out that Orphea is broken and can’t be dealt with are absolute buffoons.

Illidan beast Oprhea: You need to hit him with Q (Or W with Backbiter) in order too escape but his flips and jumps makes it f***ing impossible to land - So you gotta wait out his abilities. If Illidan is then played by someone who at least have the brain capacity of a monkey; he will just NOT use his abilities as he does not need to do it VS you, auto attack and moving works just fine - This leaves you dead anyway as if you do nothing: you die. If you now cast abilities first - He uses his to just dance around them. Either way you lose.

Pretty much all Stealth heroes gives you issues. Snipe Nova’s cant reliably be reached with Q, Zeratul can blink around and destroys you if you EVER stack with an ally if he’s gone for Cleave build. Valeera pops out of nowhere, takes away mostly all of your health by the time you can move / cast abilities and even then she TOO can dash around just enough to at least dodge your Q.

Genji destroys Orpha - He too like Valeera comes out of nowhere and is all like “OMAE WA MOU SHINDEIRU” or for the less cultured of people - He is all like “Heh, nothing personel kid” and you will mostly die before evne realizing that a Japanese Cyborg-Ninja was just behind you.

Now this is the part where people turn on their capslock and starts playing the cool guy by saying “BUT THIS NEVER WORKS IF YOU JUST HUG YOUR TEAM”

Firstly: Illidan can mostly ignore this: He can legit Hunt you and get you down as long as your team fails to land stuns on him - He may die AFTER this but who cares as long as the NEW hero died, am I right?

Cleave Zeratul thrives with you stacking up.

And generally speaking in group situations, Opreha is as easy to blow up as any caster so there is not really much of an argument to be had in these regards besides “As long as someone peels off her she is fine” which is the case for every ranged hero.

A Quest Completed Butcher sorta kills you on impact just to put that on the table.

So Orpeha is as easy to kill as any squishy hero caster. She lacks the “guaranteed hit” Shotgun potential that Jaina has, the Stun baseline which Kael’Thas but she do have the “Wombo combo” potential like Kel’Thuzad does with some right talent setup - Kel has less DIRECT escape options when compared too Orphea but he has a root, a chain that can yank and some neat talent options in the form of Frost Armor and “Back from the dead baby” so all in all when it comes to how easily countered Oprhea is: she is just another caster. Once people realizes how predictable her Q slips are and takes 1 second to check her talents to understand how she most likely will play the game: you will find nothing hard when it comes down too countering Orphea.

So what about her damage, is this busted? No. Not at all. KT, KT, Jaina and mostly all other ranged caster like Mephisto, other heroes that certain people don’t consider to be casters like Fenix and Lunara can give Orphea a run for the money.

Oprhea only dominates DPS in games where she specs around W and is allowed to chomp lanes (Meaning her team must lack effective laners / people who benefit from lanes like Azmo, Zebro, Murky with bribe, so on and so forth) WHILE having team fights around objectives that is done fast and easy so that she can stack W of heroes or lanes faster. She also thrives when playing alongside CC heavy heroes considering her Ancestral Strength level 1 talent. But to reliably land this with W which IS her highest damaging ability: she needs at least 1 tank to peel some of her as she WILL be punished.

All in all Opreha after the nerfs from PTR too live is a well shaped hero. But because people are people: they will look at hots logs and see her winrate be high the first week due to people not being willing to learn and adapt to new heroes so that they instead can complain and whine over that something which is not broken is apparently broken and history will repeat itself and Orpeha will be demolished by nerfs. Or maybe not - considering how Mal’Ganis is not OP but people still whine and want him nerfed - yet he has still to receive substantial nerfs; mayhaps Blizzard has learned and will look at statistics when it comes to heroes instead of just blinding bowing too the community’s cries of despair.

PS: It’s not unfair that she has self sustain. A great deal of heroes can talent for that: in more effective ways than Orphea has baseline: that someone else than Illidan can heal up from basic attacks is something that were too happen SOME day.

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Thanks dude, now I want to get her more. I love playing with heroes wich dosen’t get advantage by stunning sleep… the enemies and easily killable. It’s make the gameplay more interesting.

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Ophea biggest counter is not landing Q.
And having a hero countered as struggling hard against and not minor inconvenience to face is a sign of better design.

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Yeah, i had a little problem with that in the Try mode. It’s not really a quick cast.

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Orphea is just like Kel’thuzad imo. It will take a while for players to get good at her (especially on an average level) before she’ll really pick up pace.
She shares the same “delay into oneshot potential” gameplay with Kel’thuzad. Initially KTZ was basically a liability for a long time as people weren’t very good with him. Nowadays players are much better with him on an average level and it shows in his popularity and winrate. (sidenote: I wouldn’t be surprised if KTZ ends up in the patch notes soonish. He’s been doing really well in high ranks)

My view on Orphea is that she’ll most likely receive buffs/targeted talent nerfs (if they overperform) because of this. So far I have won nearly all games matched against Orphea because the player can’t really pilote her yet (as expected).
Oh, and also Zeratul destroys her pretty quickly. laughs in Nerazim

Mage releases will always take longer for people to get accustomed to because they rely on combos with low AA impact and skillshot dependant. Anyone can rightclick and get decent success with Fenix or cause a lot of disruption with a tank.
However their skill ceiling is arguably much higher and once the average gets good enough they will see quite heavy nerfs, such as Chromie or Li Ming.

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So ez to counter if you miss ur q then u are useless ,and if you dive in to w ,they just stun you becuse takes eternity to cast chomp .And if you play with diablo etc or some tanks that can push enemy u will miss q most of time . I guess i will stick with kael and jaina do same amout of dmg without hard work :D.

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Kel has the advatage to do all his stuff from safe range+extension with spike. Try that with her W even when you have Backbiter.

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The range of his W cast isn’t extended through Glacial Spike which means he has to be relatively close regardless.

Simillar to Orphea if he misses his combo he’s way too close and likely to take a lot of damage/die without back-up. You can also argue that it’s harder to combo onto an outside object (simillar to people who aren’t very good with Scatter Arrow) rather than on enemy heroes.

But I think Orphea will pick up just fine down the line. She seems like a fun addition but I’ve not gotten around to play her more than just some Try Mode shenanigans.

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She may be easy to counter, but she is also incredibly easy to enable. KTZ can wipe out two heroes with his combos, especially if he has team mates who help set him up. Orphea can wipe the entire team. Any decent AoE lockdown can really make her scary. I faced a nasty Leoric/Orphea combo last night, and any time you are forced through a choke point or on a small objective area, it can be very difficult to deal with. In addition, Leoric’s slows really make it easy for her to land combos, and empower her level 1 talent.

There are a number of other strong partner heroes for her, such as Arthas or Jaina.

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Same goes for a Circle Jaina.

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Oh, I wasn’t suggesting that Orphea is the only hero who can single-handedly wipe out an enemy team, I have seen Alarak do that often enough, but was commenting on a big difference between Orphea and KTZ, since that was the current comparison.

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I’m sure it goes without saying that Tracer eats her alive as well. She has so many blinks, plus movement while autoing; Orphea can’t land anything on you.

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Heroes you list generally counter casters, I don’t see anything wrong with them being effective against her. Mages usually shine in team fights not in 1v1 situations. I’m not saying Orphea is broken, they probably released her weaker than planned, being afraid of another backlash.

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Orphea is a teamfighter from what I’ve seen from her kit. You are not supposed to solo melee assassins because the numbers of your skills are balanced to be in 3vs3 or larger kind fo fights.

Having her safeguarded by a team is what wins fight and makes her a solid and really hard to put down character.

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A non-assassin main describes the intricacies of Orphea, a ranged assassin against Illidan. “Dude he flips and stuff which make it hard to do the d.”

NEXT!

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It almost sounds this is an 1v1 game :stuck_out_tongue: Of course she will lose to many other heroes in a duell plus Genji/Tracer/Illidan/zeratul are basically good vs most mages… it’s almost like they are designed to assassinate squishy backline heroes that can’t peel for themselves. Try dive her with those when there is a team that can protect her with heals and cc… that’s just how the game is played and has nothing to do especially with Orphea.
The best counter to Orphea is her own lack of skill :smiley:

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One who masters Orphea can potentially counter Tracer with her level 20 talent. But generally Orphea should rely on her team so she can take another.

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For average players like me Li Ming is just way better, if you miss one orb thats fine if you miss with Orphea you are dead. She may be good on master but in normal modes she wont make it

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I got ROCKED by Alarak and Stukov last night. Silences are always brutal, but I’d say they are particularly punishing for the long cast times on Q and W.

Also, considering her trait/sustainability is so heavily dependent on landing autos – blinds, are also brutal! Cassia, Artanis, Lili can make Orphea’s life rough.

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I wouldn’t think much of it as that is obviously one of the alts of a certain user that had been posting in that vein (hint the “robot” remarks :wink: ) , especially given the other topic that he made.

That aside, Stukov is one of the biggest banes to Orphea since his out prioritizes Orphea’s casts, which is a pain when you’re getting that juicy chomp.

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