Are you Lyrasona by any chance?
Im amazed that its always people who make these subtle insults, that suggest these changes. It simply weakens the entire post. Even if the rest of it was actualy quite decent (its much better than those rage threads on that, as i couldnt find a lot of other disrespectful lines in your text).
But outside of that, I also think that things you say can drag on for too long. An insult 1 year ago should have no influence on the reports at all. Everyone can have a bad day, and its no indication of having behaved bad the past month. It makes people vulnerable to get report bombed.
There is also the issue, that sometimes players need to get the harsher treatment. You sometimes need to get put on your level. Being called the weakest link in the team is on that part not an insult. If it was, teachers at school are constantly insulting their students.
Its just that some people keep yelling that at everyone. And in that case, even if they were correct, they need anger management. If people want to do those things, then they must at least try to get it into feedback that is useful for players to improve. And i thing that for example these things should be allowed as positive feedback:
- Talent X is garbage
- Stop diving into Y
- Stop knocking people away
- Dont 1v1 with Z if you cant kill him.
All these things indicate a clear issue in someones playstyle after all. It gives them a point to improve at. Even if they can sound negative.
And for that, i think that reporters themselve also need to obtain some reputation. Those who spam reports are simply not as valuable at reporting compared to those who occasionaly report. The spammer simply just has a lower treshold of what he accepts, while the more careful one is more likely to only consider the biggest abusers.
That alone should make the silence system better, as it at least promotes communication.
Defining a clear standard doesnt work, because with language you can never set a hard border as things like sarcasm can be misunderstood. Language is dynamic. And even if there are some borderline cases that should be banned but arent, its often better to still take the safer side. Eventualy those people will get tilted over the edge anyway.
2 Likes
the other day someone said they reported me for abusive chat when i said âthere is some good Rexxar guides on youtube so you can improveâ i said this after he was losing top lane on D shire
1 Like
What you just did is meandered without coming up with any ideas to actually rectify the system. This is exactly why clear standards are necessary. Games are played by many people who are genuinely confused. If standards arenât defined they will wreak havoc on the system and the community itself, which is exactly what has happened. Itâs Blizzardâs fault that the people responsible for the system were indulgent and pretty silly themselves.
The point of clear standards isnât to snuggly fit a chastity belt around your sensitive little buttholes. The point is to penalize the clear stuff, which can be quite restrictive. For the rest you use Mute. If this isnât good enough for some people they can go look for a safe space in another game.
Category renamed to Disallowed Chat
Insults directed at a person
- trash, idiot, you suck, you canât play, uninstall, x-league player, etc.
No vulgar language
- including sexual, racial, etc.
Everything else goes
- use the Mute button
This is a solid start. May be all that is needed. You penalize the purely derogatory and inappropriate stuff, leave people to talk otherwise. If someone still offends you or annoys you you can mute them. Even literal kindergartens are more permissive than the Heroes of the Storm status quo. What an embarrassment this company and its players have turned into. Something that should be an afterthought has been weaponized against the community and no one knows what to do. Over-sensitivity has hollowed out your brains and no adults seem to be in charge.
1 Like
I found this article in battle net: https://us.battle.net/support/en/article/72214
The first point says: " Abusive chat reports will fall off after a predetermined amount of time."
I think this is not true, My last suspension for abusive chat was 2 years ago, changed my conduct since then, but I got salty sometimes just like many others in some games. I never received a warning about my conduct in the game, I just got a email yesterday telling me that my account was closed due abusive chat.
If the reports fall after predetermined amount of time, I think I should received a warning or temporal suspension, not a ban.
1 Like
The duration of your silence increases each time we apply it to your account.
But we have a legal gap there, how many silences or suspensions they are going to give you before the perma ban? Should be like the 3 strikes with the police in the USA, thats why I think that you can ask for a second chance if you have a considerable amount of time without a silence.
Yea, I think what you listed is pretty good. There clearly needs to be a penalty for someone just going ham on someone and making their day miserable, and the sexual and racial stuff of course, but otherwise people need to just mute.
We all know the nature of online games. Iâve been with this one since alpha, and it always strikes me how passionate this community can be. Iâve met some of the coolest people here but also some of the nastiest, and unfortunately as the game has continued to shrink after 2018, a lot of the remaining people just seem⌠really really mad. Like if things donât go swimmingly for your team in the first minute, everything is gg and youâre <insert awful name here or some variation of âbadâ>.
I mean, you wanna talk about new players not sticking with the game⌠there ya go. But as mentioned, the abusive chat report and people being angry and driving away new players are one big, ugly circle.
1 Like
Language is dynamic, what is an insult today, can tommorow be common. Just look at the evolution of curse words on that.
The only standard is the rate at which people consider it insulting. For generic cursing, plenty do not realy care, and wont consider it offensive. And that is what you can measure, and thats why those who spam reports should be valued less on that.
An example with 25 people:
- 3 of them curse regularly, 7 of them occasionaly.
- Lets say that of those 3, the reports values are spreaded out like:
- A receives 6 reports
- B receives 4
- C receives 4
- The rest received 3, 2 or 1
This now looks very much like A is a problem, and B very likely also is as they have a higher value that is double that of the rest.
However, if we look into details into how the reports are formed. It might be that A and C reported B, while B was just using some generic cursing (as in you did an f-ing great job). If the treshold would have been 4. He might have faced an incorrect ban. And with it, most of the 1 and 2 reports could simply just have been A and C spamming those reports.
By balancing out report spammers and then still taking excessives, you can create a high hit rate based on which players take a lot of reports from people who rarely report. In this case, after filtering out the spammers (A and C), it might be that A and C are both still having 5 and 3 reports, while the rest is at most getting just 1.
But even that treshold on that doesnt have to be static. You could check the top 1% of players on that, and check their report rate compared to the rest, and figure out a treshold of reports that might be similar to them. This way you ensure only the worst get purged. And the treshold can dynamicly adjust.
A fixed treshold can still be used as a minimum on that, and some monitoring still has to be placed to avoid report bombing. But it shows how dynamic even such system can be.
1 Like
^
Thatâs an example of someone who might annoy you and would be tempting to report with impunity but under clear rules allowing people to say whatâs on their mind, even if itâs critical of you, as long as they donât directly insult you you have to mute rather than report.
Do you know what the scary thing is? It wouldnât shock me if the developers think in precisely such a pretentious manner. Imagine the rabbit holes, wasting of time, and lack of real productivity. Would explain much.
You got any math there, Alias? Only thing thatâs a little lacking. A spreadsheet would be most impressive.
I dont give a spreadsheet because i am not the person to decide the actual math to be needed. And on that, it often isnt needed as acros many stats, trends do occur.
For example you can quite effectively say:
- 1% causes problems 99% of their games
- 20% causes problems 80% of their games
Edit: wrong example, so adjusted the text
Sure, these numbers arent accurate, but show standard distributions and show up very often. And these stats are the ones which you can act upon. Which exact point you take would be down to blizzard as they actualy have the accurate numbers anyway.
And with reports, you could also expect 1% to send 99% of the reports (they use alt accounts for this). And the 20% is just tilted fast. Again, no need to be accurate, but trends seem to match this behaviour.
That was the point i was trying to make.
1 Like
Sophistry aside, whenever a violation occurs anyone has a right to report it.
Reports will fall off but account actions wont.
Which is not really a justifiable system, you say your last suspension was 2 years ago. I think thatâs enough time in a game world to expect someone to reform and reset the penalty back to zero.
Unfortunately, even if your last suspension was 6 years ago, it keeps ramping up despite the next action being in 2021. I wouldnât call that justice.
In the real world, you expunge someones record once a certain number of years have passed. If youâve played regularly for the last two years with no account actions, that should give you a fresh slate.
3 Likes
The penalty duration persisting is not the central problem.