Butcher E build

General Discussion
1

Butcher going E build (dive) against:

Arthas

Zarya

Valeera

Jaina

Illidan

WHAT’S WRONG WITH THIS PICUTRE

:thinking:

2

It’s apparently a VERY wrong time to pick Butcher in the first place, but what else could he have picked ?

The poor thing got hard countered SO HARD that he wouldn’t be able to hit auto to anyone lol… The only alternative might’ve been going for Q build for the multiple Qs on a short CD without slow decay, but yep, there’s no way in hell auto build would’ve worked in this

4 Likes
3

I mean Q build is legit useless. At least you get some burst with E build :confused:

3 Likes
4

We almost won the game tho because the enemy overextended and we killed them all. About 2/3 through the game I saw that Butcher finally had 181 meat so I assumed he would be able to finish his quest. He didn’t.

Then he starts blaming the team when he had the most deaths and I was too busy trying to keep us in the game that I never looked at the stats the rest of the game. I thought “this bastard went E build right?” I look after the game sure enough it was E build (mostly).

I’m crying rn Rick Walking Dead style cause it’s so painful sometimes.

5

Again he was completely and absolutely hard countered. Sucks but imo E build is still the build to go

2 Likes
6

I had a similar situation with a Butcher, who wasn’t bad but went the wrong build.

He went up against an Artanis / D.va combo and the enemy team loved to group up. If he had not gone Lamb to the Slaughter he’d have performed better.

7

I like reading posts like this, it makes me a little prouder of myself. The Butcher does get countered a lot.
Also, yes his kit needs to be looked at. Just because it looks good on paper, doesn’t always mean it’s good in practice.

*looks disgusted at the butcher cleave talent :eyes:

8

The good news is that where good E talents are there aren’t good Q talents and vice-versa, so that’s basically kind-of same

1 = Q [either CD/mana or chop-meat, usually chop-meat gets greater value but if able to get some good clear from other teammates can take Q cd red. and mana return for later in game]
4 = Q [cheap shot = y, double the DAMAGE on Q to a target that’s slowed/stunned = i.e. right after E is a rather noticeable burst increase]
7 = E [50% spell red. may not be quite good vs those heroes but it’s still there to make him more tanky in the thick-of-things]
10 = This is where the problem comes in = with a burst build normally would prefer going the Blast ult, but since 4/5 opponents are tanky and the only “reliable” victim sort-of is Jaina (and when she gets ice-block it’s gg), you’d probably just go “standard” in this
13 = E = 10% max HP on collision = high burst, along with cheap-shot
16 = Q = if picked Q before, it’s still the go-to (i.e. non-alternative) in a situation where opponents have such hard-counters as they did

So that’s basically it = by going Q build you also kinda go also with E, the only difference/collision-spot is the lvl4 E cd red. on collision or Q crit, I’d rather go the Q crit route in this… Long-term late game maybe Q range would do some work but usually you want the burst build before all those slows/cc/shields hit

And that’s still a big IF, it’s simple case of Butcher being 100% outdrafted in this particular case as is

9

E build wasn’t wrong.

The mistake was picking Butcher.

4 Likes
10

Since the enemy has no healer i assume this is QM

it makes more sense that way

I mean the Butcher got screwed in MM

Butcher has like 1 viable build and if that doesn’t work he is worthless, especially with 3 of his counters on the enemy team

11

But you’re almost always going to have a counter.
You need to play against a team that has no :

Blinds
Stuns
Slows
roots
sleep
Stasis

I mean, against such a team, any hero would do.

12

Butcher. Butcher is what is wrong with that picture. Not his build, but he himself. Sometimes, MMing just screws you like that.

Against something like that, E build was the best option hands down. It’s not a good or even okay choice, but it was still his best choice.

3 Likes
13

Going to have to jump on the bandwagon, no build would have saved B here.

At absolute best, if he got fed he could have played a decent distraction depending on your team.

And getting fed would have involved pure minion farming and hoping to meatGod that they didn’t catch on or steamroll the 4v5s. Which, well, then your enemy is incompetent.

There’s simply nobody on that team he can reliably beat even 1v1, much less in a teamfight.

Sometimes the MM just puts you against the worst possible team.

In this case, his only option would be to get in the squishies faces and stay there. It’s not a good option, not even a passable one, but his other options were simply worse and would result in an even lower chance of contributing anything at all.

14

FRESH DEATH

2 Likes
15

Really don’t see what you expect Butcher to do? Best he could do was to go E build so he could provide at least some damage and survive with the spellshield he got from it. He is just a bad hero.

1 Like
16

OK since you don’t see why here’s why Butcher got screwed by MM in this game BIG TIME:

Arthas: High HP, perma-slow, ATTACK SPEED slow. IF by some chance things start going wrong = W-root Butch until W of Butch expires
Hard-counter rating vs Butcher = 7.5/10

Zarya: Anyone Butch tries to dive for the kill she’ll shield them, not only that but she’ll get A LOT of dps uprise if the shield is timed right and almost no Butcher player can react to stop the burst on attacking, basically Zarya will have a field-day with the farmed-dps from shielding teammates… And EVEN IF Butcher gets close to kill someone she can still use ULT (which ever from the 2) for the peel/save
Hard-counter rating vs Butcher: 8.5/10

Valeera: OK, this may not be his worst nightmare but chances are battles are gonna happen when Valeera wants them to happen, not the other way round… She also has the self-cleanse ult if timed right would never allow Butch to stun her or Lamb
Hard-counter rating vs Butcher: 6/10

Illidan: Butcher use W ? = time for evasion to kick in, simple as that, a good/decent Illidan will NEVER EVER lose to a Butcher, it’s simply not happening… If Illidan may have been smarter a bit he’d have taken the block on dive and 6th sense to prevent even Butcher’s successful hits
Hard-counter rating vs Butcher: 9.5/10

And lastly but not the least = Jaina, pretty much THE ONLY TARGET Butcher could afford to kill, and even THAT is questionable post lvl16 cause Jaina can Root chilled targets and also Ice-block out her way
Hard-Counter rating vs Butcher: 5/10

So yes, talk about Butcher’s NIGHTMARE of team to play against rly

1 Like
17

I don’t get your ratings VArsovskiSC.

Jaina and Arthas clearly counter the Butcher way harder then those others you have ranked above. Butcher literally can’t kill Jaina without her screwing up or help from the team. She just strait up counters him especially with water elemental. Arthas also strait up counters him but to a lesser extent but not by much.

18

Yeah his assessment of Illidan is very poor.

1 Like
19

E build at least gives him a bit of spell armor against those heavy hitters (like Jaina).

1 Like