Doesn’t Zealot Charge plus blades of a templar mean Artanis is extremely hard to kite?
I think the point of the talent is for when you have trouble staying in AA range, unlike Plasma Burn which is for when you want to just deal more damage.
If you think about it as a defensive talent, your W will almost always be in range to hit someone on cooldown, I think it has its place.
I don’t think it’s true, it help vs mobile targets like tracer/ming. But I agree that it’s not a huge power spike. Maybe they could combine the old talent Psionic Wound with it?
Twin Blades final strike lowers a Hero’s Armor by 25 for 2 seconds, increasing all damage taken by 25%
Still not worthy of being a level 20 talent though, which is the problem.
I could easily see it as a level 7 talent even!
Yeah, it may help vs mobile targets but will completely useless against non-mobility heroes. Plus, intentionally pick Zealot Charge so you can hit a mobile enemy slightly easier seem pretty wasteful for me when Heroic upgrade and Plasma Burn are better for most of the situation.
Although I do like your suggestion to add - armor debuff on that talent.
It’s a situational talent. Artanis level 20 has always been a fairly weak row, with the old Force of Will being an exception.
Zealot Charge makes Artanis unkiteable and effectively means that the likes of Tracer and Li Ming isn’t playing HotS anymore. The main reason this isn’t a larger spike than you would think is because Artanis scales off heavily from level 21 and onwards due to damage levels being so high that Artanis gets killed during focus fire much easier than at any other point in the game.
It comes with it’s pros and cons. Artanis has very powerful talent rows especially inside his 13 - arguably the weakest talent row for the majority of heroes in the game with limited customization. Artanis level 16 is also a very powerful talent row so it makes sense that he has to lose some power in a different row.
Also I want to address your most recent reply - it’s not uncommon at all for talents to be very strong in certain situations and weak in others, that’s the whole point of picking your talents according to what you face.
If you face heavy mobility heroes pick Zealot Charge. If this isn’t an issue you’re free to take a Heroic Upgrade (Target Purified is one of the strongest snowball and “win more” talents in the game) and Plasma Burn is a decent talent into bulky melee teams and/or core rush DPS.
While I do agree that Zealot Charge is on the weaker side of Artanis available talents, primarily because it’s such a late talent. However I think it’s very unfair to say that it brings “nothing to the table” in the right situation.
Zealot Charge should be the reward for a reworked Seasoned Marksman.
I do think it could use a buff, especially at level 20, but I do agree that it does bring a few things to the table. In addition to helping against high mobility heroes, I also use it as an escape, because in the late game, Artanis is more prone to being exploded, just by the way most assassins scale. Since W can be used on anything that can be targeted, heroes, buildings, walls, minions, etc., you can often use it to dodge skill shots, or just get out of a dogpile.
Well, you guys said that Zealot Charge could be used to catch up a mobile hero or using it as unreliable escape, but from what I have seen or tested, Zealot Charge brings more harm to Artanis than help, especially in the late game when everything can outburst your Artanis before the shield kick in, so having Zealot Charge plunging your Artanis to enemy before your team is just too dangerous.
Just as some of you guys said, either move Zealot Charge to lower level, or buff Zealot Charge to the respectable Lv20 Tier talent.
If it brings you more harm than good you’re either using it very awkwardly or it simply isn’t a talent that suits your playstyle. As Hoku said it can also be used as an escape which isn’t as unreliable as you might think, you just have to be creative about it.
Zealot Charge is typically seen in an AA focused build with Shield Surge, and it is especially needed for reliable uses of Blades of a Templar to catch up to enemies and apply the slow. Compared to Heroic Upgrades that typically works better in Q or E focused builds.
It’s impossible for me to tell what your personal issue is with Zealot Charge as I don’t have gameplay from it, but I can safely assure you that the talent is good in the right situations, you just need some practice with it.
The talent is on the weaker side as a Storm talent and yes I agree it could see a buff but I don’t think the talent itself should be buffed but rather replace as a quest reward in Seasoned Marksman (like suggested by Kith). However you have to also factor in that Artanis level 13 is incredibly powerful where many other heroes lack and Artanis typically has to make things happen between 13-19 as those levels is where he’s at his strongest scaling.
Beside this if you really dislike the talent that’s fine and you’re free to use the other options.
Nope, Artanis is not more prone to being exploded and is very hard to kill, at level 20 he is a constant and frequent Shield & Armor spammer. Zealot charge helps him spam more Shields by applying AA.
Yes, he is more prone to being blown up and it’s not even a debate. By the time lategame hits it’s possible for Artanis to get destroyed inside a Muradin stun if the enemy team is decently coordinated. (example Nano boost Li Ming + Kerrigan, 2 common picks nowadays)
Artanis has his strongest point between 13 to 19 because it’s at this point bruisers durability is the absolutely strongest since the real damage scaling hasn’t kicked in (16+20+scaling), this is also evident in heroes such as Sonya and Leoric who tends to die very quickly post 20 if they’re not very careful.
Yes, if you do not do your job, try not to reach the enemy backline and attack the enemy tank all the time; you will be get bombarded by the enemy’s backline and blow up.
The point of Zealot Charge is preventing the enemy backline’s bombardment by zoning and sticking to the backline of the enemy, thus giving your team a chance to attack the squishies.
To do that, the hero have to already be designed as tough as the job requires you to be, which is the Bruisers’ job.
It is a matter of how skilled you are.
Uhm no, you’ve got it completely wrong.
If you recklessly dive the enemy backline at level 20 you’ll die in literally 2 seconds. You will eat an Anub stun, Diablo combo, Muradin stun, whatever. Even reaching the backline requires you to use Q+E and then follow into a Zealot Charge to reach them. Now you’re overextended, I wish you luck.
Zealot Charge is an excellent poke talent / skirmish talent when fights are chaotic. Tracer and Li Ming causes the game to be chaotic naturally, promoting skirmishes. Zealot Charge gives Artanis a way to deal with that.
If you even for a second believe Zealot Charge will provide enough AA’s to reset your trait in a teamfight you’ve either 1: never played Artanis or 2: never played Artanis into enemies that knows what priority targets are.
I am inclined to believe you’re the latter based on your Hotslogs, and it also shows me you have no idea how to pilot Artanis which suggests a lack of experience and knowledge.
LOL, thats why it is:
as I said.
I never looked at hotslogs in my Artanis discussions, however hotslogs is there for a good reason. I am 60 level Artanis, I know him enough to put & defend ideas about him.
Zealot charge is good, as a level 16 talent.
It comes too late for my liking.
Alright, humor me since you like to edit your post smugly.
https:// www.hotslogs. com/Player/Profile?PlayerID=9343288
Confirm/deny if this is you. However based on your Zeratul AA threads I have a hard time seeing many active Zeratul players picking Darkness Descends and Master Warp-Blade this much.
Even if I assume you’re not actively uploading your games I can get a rough idea of your skill level based on this information alone.
Furthermore, of the uploaded games you have a 40% winrate on Artanis over 97 games. Let’s assume you’ve played twice this amount for sake of argument combined with a winstreak you’d hardly average a 50% winrate with him.
I find it very amusing you find yourself in a position to “defend ideas about him”, considering your understanding of bruiser scaling is so wrong. Even if I also assume the HL rank shows you slightly below your actual in-game rank it’s not even in the actual ballpark of the type of opponents I’m talking about.
In the rating of Gold-Plat I kept a 70% winrate while still learning the game, that is to say I didn’t know every hero and their abilities at the time.
Currently I’ve averaged 60%+ winrate in Master during my 3 most active seasons. This is to say that your argument of “skill” isn’t really applicable since you’ve never played in the rating I play at which means our opponents are very different.
This means that you require a different mindset when you go up against opponents that will actually pay extra attention to Artanis because they know the level of threat he can have on the enemy since he is the highest DPS bruiser in the game. When he’s ignored he can easily destroy full teams which is something I have fun with in QM sometimes, which is where I’m assuming you’ve gotten your Artanis “experience”.
Nope this is not me. I play with Dr.Logan here from forums, he can also confirm that it is not me.
LoL, the world doesn’t only consisted of people who talks native english. Everyone edits for better understanding, but mine are generally for fixing grammar, fixing wrong writtenwords & punctuation.
This forum and thread is not a place to discuss personal things.
I flagged you for offensive language.
Move on, son…
Ooooooh, I like this A LOT! 
Keep the damage quest, but replace the active with increased W charge; perfect!
It’s ironic you would flag me considering you’re the one coming to the thread just to be provocative, which is also breaking the rules (aka trolling). It’s quite sad how oblivious you are but you’re quickly killing my patience.
Beside this I’m not a native english speaker and you edited your post with a third paragraph, not to correct grammar (aka smug, google it).
Since you’re not cappable to have a conversation without getting childish about it (cheap “skill” insults) nor can you respond to my arguments properly I’ll simply have your posts ignored from now on.
No provocation is meant. “You” refers to “all Artanis players”, not specfically to someone.
You wrote this, but I forgot to answer that so:
So I edited and answered it with this, it is not being “smug”, I forgot to answer your agression:
Calm down and move on…