Thornmantle musician and crater experiment ordering

When you play Thornmantle Musician as a ‘finale’ to activate the keyword buff, the next beast you play gets +1/+1.

When you play Crater Experiment, it has the keyword “Kindred” with “summon a copy of this minion”.

When used together over 2 turns, the order of execution does not work correctly or at least not logically (maybe by coding it does?).

When you summon Crater Experiment, it executes its “summon a copy of this minion”; however, after it is played it does not receive the +1/+1, instead, the animated copy generated after playing this minion gets the +1/+1.

Visually it is out of order and does not represent the actual execution of the keyword actions.

Logically, I would expect there to be a floating “next beast played gets +1/+1”, literally lasting turns until your next beast is played… THIS GAME. Since it floats, it sits there ‘after end of turn’ and is there before ‘start of turn’. The next point of something always wrong somewhere in Hearthstone with this: battlecry. The battlecry (executed when a card is played) happens first unless there is another mechanic in play/floating (i.e. secret, previous battlecry combo, etc.).

It kind of makes sense and it doesn’t, because in order for this cards battlecry to take effect, the minion has to have already been summoned (it cannot summon a copy of itself if itself never makes it to the board). I would expect with this ordering, that the minion could be played through Objection, where the copy is summoned, but the first minion is not (of course this isn’t the case), so something is broken here.

Either the ordering is off OR the copy with that buff is off (so only the summoned minion gets the buff and not the copy).

Arena run as Hunter

Played over 2 turns (Turn 5 and Turn 6)

https://replays.firestoneapp.com/?reviewId=027fb483-548f-47aa-a69c-c4671be53cc9&turn=0&action=0

I’m replying because you mentionned objection which is a false good example
there will be a tl;dr as I’m explaining more than just that interaction

From what you described, Thornmantle Musician’s technical behavior corresponds to “after you summon your next beast, give it +1/+1”

In order to buff the first crater experiment, it would be an effect like “whenever you summon your next beast, give it +1/+1”

If it was a whenever effect, it would trigger instantly as the minion hits the board, but since it’s an “after” effect, it has to wait, because “after” it has been summoned is only after all of its effect have fully resolved, including its kindred.

The minion summoned by its battlecry however is considered fully summoned sooner, which triggers an “after summon” phase which consummes the effect

I could try to elaborate more or better if this isn’t clear

HOWEVER, objection is unique in the game, it has a specific trigger phase dedicated for it set even before the “whenever you summon” check

So let’s imagine a scenario where your opponent has objection and snipe

You have a Spirit of the Lynx and an Addled Grizzly in play

You will play 2 Crater Experiments with kindred enabled

  • manually play crater experiment 1
    • crater experiment 1 leaves your hand
      • Objection-check triggers and counters the card
  • manually play crater experiment 2
    • crater experiment 2 leaves your hand
      • Objection-check is there but there’s no objection in play
      • trigger “whenever you play a card”
    • crater experiment 2 hits the board
      • trigger “whenever you summon a minion/beast”
        • Spirit of the lynx gives +1/+1 to crater experiment 2 (now 4/5)
    • crater experiment 2 triggers its kindred
      • crater experiment 3 appears on board (4/5)
        • trigger “whenever you summon a minion/beast”
          • Spirit of the lynx gives +1/+1 to crater experiment 3 (now 5/6)
        • crater experiment 3 has no additional effect when summoned
        • trigger “after you summon a minion/beast”
          • Addled Grizzly gives +1/+1 to crater experiment 3 (now 6/7)
    • crater experiment 2 has no additional effect when summoned
      • trigger “after you summon a minion/beast”
        • Addled Grizzly gives +1/+1 to crater experiment 2 (now 5/6)
    • crater experiment 2 has no additional effect when played
      • trigger “after you play a minion”
        • Snipe deals 6 damage to crater experiment 2 (now 5/0)
    • crater experiment 2 dies
      • death triggers and so on…

The 2 framed lines are where Thornmantle musician can trigger depending on what is intended, the line in bold is where it currently triggers

It may not be perfectly accurate (and is ignoring a lot of triggers) but can give an understanding if you’re brave enough to have read until there

tl;dr since it’s not explicit wheter it’s an “after” or “whenever” trigger, both behaviors could be intended even though it lacks clarity and intuitiveness