so saw someone in battlegrounds got an infinite combo with onyxia power [avenge (4), summon a 3/1 whelp. it attacks immidetly] , and the lesser [avenge(5) summon a 2/2 beetle and give it taunt] and greater beetle band [avenge(6) summon two 2/2 beetles. give them taunt] and with all that that specific avenge it starts and endless cycle of summoning beetles and whelps
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From what you describe it’s not infinite since it is not enough to feed itself, so they’d need some other minion to help with the summoning
I assume the beetles are always summoned on the far-right, which means any helping minion should die eventually by attacking into yours
But yeah until that they may have gotten big buffs from all that got summoned, that’s still an impressive synergy
TLDR: i think it does go infinite cause avenge creatures help feed their own avange meaning the whelp+3 other creatures that spawn feed the whelp to go off again making the 2nd whelp spawned the 5th creature to die but also the 1st one to die for the whelp to trigger again
starting with a full board 4 creatures get killed summoning a whelp, the whelp attacks and dies triggering the avenge 5, summoning a taunt beetle, one of those taunt beetles dies or another one on their board triggering the avenge 6 to go off making it summon two more taunt bettles to go off, and since the whelp dying help triggers the whelp to go off again it needs those 3 bettles to die to trigger another whelp and that makes the avenge 5 to go off again and one of those beetles dies triggering the avenge 6 to go off yet again, i may be wrong but from just seeing it happen it seems to be
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thank you, thats good to know!
I mean yes of course they feed themselves, but they are not enough to automatically trigger themselves in an infinite cycle
If you only have 3 effects to summon 1 minion at minimum each 4 avenges, then they are not enough to trigger that avenge (4) infinitely
The smallest common multiple of 4, 5 and 6 is 60
In 60 deaths of minions (including the ones summoned by those effects), there would have been 15 whelps from avenge (4), 12 beetles from avenge (5) and 10 beetles form avenge (6)
That’s 37 out of 60, those 3 effects are enough to trigger half of them but not infinitely
That is definitely a lot, but it still requires additional fuel and eventually their warband will wear off
With any minion allowing to double the number of minions summoned, it would become infinite, but as infinite as it is, the minion doubling the summonings would eventually attack and kill itself (which obviously requires that your board is able to tank all the whelps and beetles)
Something that would truely be infinite simply Onyxia with any minion doubling the summons, like Khadgar. 2 of them on board (not even golden) would allow for an infinite loop of 4 whelps attacking and suiciding at once
Your math here is wrong and it was going infinite with three spawns and a whelp.
It kills four minions, spawns a whelp. The first whelp counts as one, the three beetles makes four and another whelp is spawned, and the next whelp counts as five (spawning new beetles) restarting from the beginning with one whelp and three beetles.
It was hotfixed so it was clearly an infinite loop.
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In fairness most forget that the first whelp spawn effectively turns the HP into Avenge (3).
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ok one point I missread : the avenge 6 summons 2 beetles, I thought only one, which brings the total to 47/60, which is still not infinite
0/4 | 0/5 | 0/6
4 minions die
4/4 | 4/5 | 4/6
Whelp is summoned and dies
1/4 | 5/5 | 5/6
Beetle is summoned and dies
2/4 | 1/5 | 6/6
2 beetles are summoned and die
4/4 | 3/5 | 2/6
Whelp is summoned and dies
1/4 | 4/5 | 3/6
End of the loop, you need a new input for it to keep going
Nope, that’s a falacy
It was way too strong, that’s why it got hotfixed, it doesn’t mean it was infinite
I took that into account in the calculation
This is the part where they are failing to understand how it worked, exactly.
Is the math here.
This is not how this count goes. Forget the board you started with and just start with a whelp and three beetles on the board.
Board has whelp, and three beetles. That is four units. It makes another whelp come, which makes another beetle (because the first whelp was one and the second is five avenge), which makes two more beetles come (because the avenge five dies for avenge 6).
The whelp and three beetles makes a whelp come, which makes a beetle come, which makes two beetles come, which makes a whelp come…
It is clearly and infinite loop because the whelps count in the avenge count as one and five and the beetles are the remaining avenge.
If the greater trinket only spawned a single beetle it would end.
Whelp, beetle or any other minion it does not matter for the initial trigger since what I listed after that is only taking the effect itself into account…
0/4 | 0/5 | 0/6
4 minions die
4/4 | 4/5 | 4/6
So far so good
Whelp is summoned
0/4 | 4/5 | 4/6
and dies
1/4 | 5/5 | 5/6
Beetle is summoned
1/4 | 0/5 | 5/6
and dies
2/4 | 1/5 | 6/6
2 beetles are summoned
2/4 | 1/5 | 0/6
and die
4/4 | 3/5 | 2/6
Whelp is summoned
0/4 | 3/5 | 2/6
and dies
1/4 | 4/5 | 3/6
END
If you just sommed the 4 minions, then before they die all your avenges are at 0/X
If no other effect comes into play, the avenge 5 can’t trigger twice
It’s not really hard to understand mathematically
If you can only summon 4 minions maximum per cycle, that your lowest avenge requirement is 4, and that you have higer requirements than 4, it’s mathematically impossible to go infinite
Let’s say we go through the death of 12 minions, that’s 3 whelps, 2 lesser beetles and 4 greated beetles, 9 minions total, 10 if we’re generous and imagine that the lesser trinket triggered a third time as it was only partially completed
You clearly see that we’re still missing 2 minions from an external source before we can loop back to the beginning
I visually and mathematically demonstrated how it can’t go infinite
What you described matched what I demonstrated until you stopped using numbers
If you still think it was infinite, please demonstrate it mathematically until you can prove it loops back to the original position, because so far I proved it stops after 9 deaths
A cycle that only generates 4 minions can’t infinitely feed a cycle that requires up to 6 deaths
You are counting wrong.
As long as whelp spawns a single beetle then the beetle will spawn two more and that will spawn a whelp.
And you did it wrong. You keep restarting the count instead of seeing how they all overlap.
And you are not counting at all
If you want to say that my math is wrong, please either use math to prove it or link to a tangible example, stop just saying I’m wrong without giving a single factual argument
Because when you’re at 4/4 you go back to 0/4, then 1/4 when the first minion dies, including the one you just summoned. How is that wrong ? What are you trying to gaslight me into ?
Just mathematically explain to me how the greater trinket can trigger at least twice with no minion dying from outside the effects, using actual avenge counts.
Because for it tro trigger twice, you need 12 deaths, and you are not able to summon even 11 in a row
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the fact that
happened, im gonna go ahead and say it does in fact go infinite
or it did, but now it cant
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Just because it got removed does not mean it was infinite
Having an avenge synergy feed itself at 80% is broken enough to be removed from the game
Small indie company, can’t do math, what else is new.