Rebalancing classic and most importantly basic

Multiplayer Discussion
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Greetings my fellow Hearthstone players.Today I am here to talk about arguably the 2 most useless sets to ever exist in the game.Classic and basic.Now as someone who plays classic decks even I think both of these sets are very weak and most cards in these sets don’t even have a chance to compete with the expansion cards.While I am writing this I also have Hearthstone open in the background and I will go over the cards that need re-balancing by the way they are placed.from left to right,starting from the basic set and onto the classic set.
Druid:
Starfire: Buffed to 5 mana.
Ironbark Protector: Only useful in wild where recruit exists but other than that garbage.It should be reduced to a 6/6 and battlecry:"Give all your treants +1/0 for this game or give all your treants +0/1 this game.It would make treant decks a lot better and the card would be more useful and interesting in general.
Hunter:
Starving Buzzard: Should be buffed to 3 mana but reduced to a 2/2 and should draw a card when a friendly beast dies,not when you summon a beast.
Mage:
Fireball: Should be nerfed to 5 damage.Again,minor change but the card has too much value for its cost in the state it is.
Paladin:
Guardian of Kings: Should heal 5,be able to choose what to heal,should give taunt to the healed target and be buffed to a 6/7 with taunt.Amber Watcher is 10 times better than Guardian cause of its stronger battlecry and stats matching its cost but it also has the Dragon tag.This would make Guardian a lot better an atleast be able to compete with him.
Priest:
Priests basic set is probably the most balanced in the game.No changes needed.
Rogue:
PlagueBringer: Buffed to a 3/4
Shaman:
Windspeaker: Buffed to a 3/4.
Fire Elemental: Deals 4 damage instead
Warlock:
Drain Life: Deal 3 damage,restore 3 health to your hero.
Warrior:
Charge:Name changed to Rush,gives rush.
Warsong Commander: Gives rush to minions with 3 or less attack,gives rush minions +2 damage for the turn they are played.
Neutral:
Bloodfen Raptor: Added battlecry “Summon 2 Eggs.”.The eggs have the deathrattle:“Summon a 1/1 Bloodfen Hatchling.”.
Frostwolf Grunt: Added deathrattle “Summon a 0/2 Dying Grunt with taunt”.
River Crocolisk: Added battlecry “Deal 1 damage to a random enemy minion.”
Ironforge Rifleman:Buffed to a 2/3
Ironfur Grizzly: Added deathrattle “Summon a 1/2 Defensless Cub”
Magma Rager: Stats changed to a 4/2 with battlecry and deathrattle “Deal 1 damage to all minions.”
Razorfen Hunter: Now summons 2 1/1 boars with rush,nerfed to a 1/3
Shattered Sun Cleric: Battlecry buffed to give +1/2
Silverback Patriarch: Buffed to a 2/4,added battlecry “Add a banana to your hand.”
Chillwind Yeti: Added battecry “Attack a random enemy minion with 3 or less attack.”
Dragonling Mechanic: Added new battlecry "Summon 2 Dragonling Mechaeggs with deathrattle “Summon a 1/2 Mechanic Whelps” ,nerfed to a 2/3.
Oasis Snapjaw: Added battlecry “Summon a Snapjaw nest.”.Snapjaw Nest has the deathrattle “Summon 2 1/3 Baby Snapjaws”.Nerfed to a 2/4.
Stormwind Knight: Added effect “When this minion attacks and kills a minion,it summons a 1/2 Inspired Soldier with rush.”
Booty Bay Bodyguard: Added the effect “Everytime this minion survives damage add a coin to your hand.”
Darkscale Healer: Nerfed to a 3/5,now heals 3 health to all friendly characters.
Boulderfist Ogre:Buffed to have +1 health,has taunt.
Lord of the Arena: Buffed to a 6/7 and added deathrattle “Summon a 3/2 Injured New Champion with poison for your opponent.”
Reckless Rocketeer: Added deathrattle “Shuffle an Unstable Rocket Engine to your opponents deck.”(Unstable Rocket Engine:Deal 2 damage to all enemy minions.)
Core Hound: Added deathrattle “Summon 2 random 1 cost minions for your opponent.”,buffed to a 9/8.
Stormwind Champion: Removed effect,added battlecry "Give all your minions on the board +1/2 ,nerfed to a 4/5
War Golem: Added deathrattle “Become Dormant.After 2 of turns summon a War Golem.”,nerfed to 8 mana.
Now its finally time for classic.My fingers are getting numb but I must continue.
Druid:
Druid of the Claw:Charge option now a 5/4 with stealth.
Starfall: Damage of the “Deal 2 damage to all enemy minions” is increased to 3 damage.
Ancient of Lore: Nerfed to a 3/4,now draws 2 cards.
Gift of Wild: Buffed to 7 mana.
Hunter:
Hunters classic set is pretty balanced.
Mage:
Sorcerers Apprentice: Nerfed to a 2 mana 2/2.
Paladin:
Sword of Justice: Buffed to give +1/2.
Equality: Buffed to 3 mana.
Righteousness: Buffed to 4 mana.
Priest:
After the HOF his classic set is pretty balanced.
Rogue:
Headcrack:Buffed to 2 mana.
Defias Ringleader: Summons a 2/2.
Edwin VanCleef: Nerfed to a 1/1.
SI:7 Agent: Combo damage buffed to 3.
Blade Flurry: Buffed to 3 mana.
Shaman:
Dust Devil: Changed to a 2/2.
Forked Lightning: Buffed to overload (1).
Stormforged Axe: Changed to a 3/2 with overload (1).
Far Sight: Nerfed to 5 mana,now draws 2 cards and reduces the cost of the most expensive one by (3).
Feral Spirit: Buffed to overload (1).
Lava Burst: Buffed to overload (1).
Lightning Storm: Buffed to overload (1).
Earth Elemental: Buffed to overload (2)
Al’Akir the Windlord:Buffed to 5/7,changed charge to rush (Charge is a stupid mechanic in general.)
Warlock:
Pit Lord: Buffed to deal 4 damage.
Siegebreaker: Buffed the attack increase to +2,nerfed attack to 4.
Warrior:Also mostly balanced.No change necessary.
Neutral:
Bloodsail Corsair: Nerfed to 3 mana.
King Mukla: Buffed to a 5/6.
Hogger: Summons a 2/3 now.
Priestess of Elune: Restores 5 health,costs 5 instead.
Sunwalker: Costs 5 mana.
Black Knight: Buffed to 6 mana
Barrens Stablehand: Buffed to summon a 4 mana beast
Nozdormu: Buffed to make your enemies turn last 15 seconds and changed to a 4/12
Ysera: 1 new cards to her spawn pool.A 7 mana 5/7 Eternal Dream Guard with lifesteal.

These are all the balance changes I see to make classic and basic actually good but also not have a gigantic impact on the meta.I hope if a Hearthstone employee sees this they take into consideration these balance changes and the crimes I have commited on my eyes,fingers and brain.Thank you for reading up until here and subjecting yourself to this torment too. =^)
Edit:If there is any spelling mistakes dont even bother writing it in the comments.My fingers are in enough pain.
Edit 2:I have made multiple balance changes according to comments.I hope this is better.I agree I went overboard on some buffs and made some things too complex but I think with this edit i fixed that.I did keep a few stuff that I thought wasnt too complex for a new player to understand.

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A complete rotation of the entire Classic/Basic set is long overdue in Hearthstone. CCGs are not games that are supposed to have permanent Classic/Basic sets. Magic the Gathering figured out over 30 years ago that you have to rotate the Classic set every couple of years or the game gets stale. Why Blizzard has been so stubborn in this regard is beyond me. They need to broom their wrong-headed decision to keep the C/B sets “evergreen” and accept reality.

It could be argued that with their Hall of Fame rotations they are engaged in a sort of “soft reset” of the Classic set… But it isn’t going anywhere near fast or broad enough.

Blizzard needs to broom the entire C/B set in its entirety and rotate in cards from discontinued sets to replace them. And they need to make this a regular practice that they perform every 2 years at least. That’s what needs to happen … period.

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Before I go for an individual critic, I’s like to remind you that, in essence, Hearthstone is a simple game, made to be easily understood. The basic and classic cards have simple effects because they represent this the most. It is important to remember that those are the first cards beginners will see.
Ok let’s go.

The card was nerfed for a reason. Tho it’s pretty obvious it’s too weak now.

Understandable.

The card is made so that Druid always have a big minion (because that’s part of their identity). They already have enough swarm cards in basic/classic.

Interresting enough, this card was nerfed a lot during the beta. I don’t think Blizzard want to ever hear about it again.

I disagree (but maybe it’s just that I’m a mage main), but I see where you’re coming from (with the hunter spell, the frostbolt and the warlock spell that hit a minion for 4 damage). However cost-stats isn’t as easy as a straight line (example : for a small minion, stats are the most important; for a big minion, effect is the most important).

That card has seen lots of play, tho. Even in recent decks like mecaladin.

I won’t try to balance it, because I find weapon balancing horribly hard.

That sounds too much. However I agree it needs a buff.

What ? No ! That would be a straight up better arcane explosion ! (ie a basic card you didn’t think needed to be improved).

Maybe. Think poisonous cost enough to have him like this.

Drawing 1 card cost 1, drawing 2 cost 3, drawing 3 cost 5, drawing 4 cost 7.
The main reason it isn’t played today is because rogue doesn’t need a huge card to draw a lot.

Terrible idea. With only 3 cards to support it, totems were able to be strong for a few days (until everyone started killing totems as soon as they saw one). A 0-mana AOE basic buff would make them broken forever.

I think those cards are fine as it is. Windfury is a pretty strong keyword as a finisher.

Too strong. A 3-4 mana effect on a 3-4 mana stated minion for only 6 ?

Yeah this card needs a buff.

I think it’s fine as it is, mainly because this way, all infernals are 6/6.

And kill the Maiev Three-turn kill ? Out of question !

Card was nerfed for a reason.

Just ‘whenever you summon a minion with 3 or less attack, give it rush’ would suffice for me.

Nah card is fine.

That sound horribly easy to abuse. Card is fine, still a good 1-drop for beginner.

What’s a hatchling ? A 1/1 ? That would make 5/4 stats for 2 mana. Too strong.

Hey, that sound like a good idea !

What ? No ! This card is super balanced ! It still see play even today !

Buff seems fair, but I don’t think it’s needed.

Way too complex.

Neutral weapon aren’t a thing.

Too complicated + sleep is an extansion mecanic.

But That would kill all the jokes !

2/4 is a buff, tho (it’s a 2/3). Would make sense if it became a 2/2, but 2/4 + 2 1/1 sounds too strong.

I don’t think making it less reliable is a good idea.

Way too strong. There was a 2/2 for 3 mana that gave you bananas, and it was played.

The entire concept of the card is to be aggresive (you know, just like a raider). Making it defensive wouldn’t make sense.

Sounds like a good way to have new players kill their own creatures with it.

Too complicated.

Too complicated.

Too complicated.

Please don’t add more random in cards that are supposed to be consistant.

Neutral weapon aren’t a thing + Durability is kind of a legendary effect.

Not sure it make that much sense : whenever he kill someone, he inspire a soldier to take up arms but as a taunt minion ? Why taunt ?

Sounds like a mix of a rogue effect and a warrior effect. Pure stat buff would be better.

Maybe. I’m not good at judging AOE healing.

I think Taunt is too much.

Wouldn’t a bear make more sense as a 3/3, tho ? Also pure stat increase would be better. (simple is good).

Sounds easily abusable.

Too complicated.

Poison in the arena ! Disquilafied !
Stat increase would probably be a better idea. Or just stat swap.

Maybe a little too complicated, and not reliable enough. This card is a finisher.

Not consistent enough.

Sounds like a terrible idea. Card is pretty fine as it is. A huge finisher for mid-swarm.

Too complicated + dormant is an expansion mecanic. Just give it +1 health.

I think keeping silence is pretty important so that druid always have acces to a silence. Wouldn’t hurt to have a small stat buff, tho (while keeping in mind that card was nerfed for a reason).

Sounds like you just want to rework stealth + this card is supposed to be a control tool with the ability to be a finisher (the 4/4 can be used to trade or end the face). Making it stealth, even with stat increase, would make it less reliable.

Yeah I think both effect should have a slight buff. But it would probably make it too strong in quest deck.

Card was nerfed for a reason.

Too complex, too confusing, possibly too strong, not very Druid-flavored.

Maybe.

Sounds like a bad idea. The rogue card that was nerfed is cheaper and you choose the target.

Would probably kill the card.

The card would become too much tempo loss.

Why not.

Odd pally is still a thing.

Maybe

I don’t think it’s necessary. Tirion is one of the strongest classic legendary.

Why ?

Card is already garbage, why make it worse ?

Why ?

Honestly combo cards seems hard to balance. Maybe it would be a good idea.

That wouldn’t change much.

I think the card should be reworked, but This buff isn’t a bad idea.

Would probably be OP in aggro deck. And shaman are very strong at aggro.

Card needs a reword to work like it does in Wacraft 3 : jumps from ennemy to ennemy.

I think it would make the card worse, but it would definitivly make it more aggro.

I aggre that shaman needs to be able to draw more than one card at once, but your idea seems too complicated.

I don’t think they need buffs.

I don’t think it needs a buff. I think Bliz should make some weapon buff for shaman.

Maybe. Overload is hard to balance.

Problem is, all classic legendary are finisher.Al’akir is supposed to be a finisher in a class that can give temporary buffs (like rockbiter weapon or flametongue totem).
I agree he needs a buff, but honestly I would be happier if they just gave shaman more temporary buffs.

Too complicated.

Probably too strong.

I think they should make it a low-cost minion, to fit zoo better.

Would probably be too strong.

Thalnos is already very strong.

What ? No ! this card is already not played (since it’s a worse ooze).

Maybe.

I don’t think that’s his biggest problem.

She should have 5 health.

Sounds too strong.

I don’t think that’s a good idea.

Same as sunwalker.

NO.

He should be consistant. Cards like these are terribly bad idea.

Ha, I was right ! You DO want to have stealth reworked !

I don’t know what to say.

Too complicated + possibility to abuse + please don’t touch Malygos, he’s a bro.

TERRIBLE idea. I’d rather have him be a 4/12 (never understoof why he isn’t.)

I don’t think this keyword is a good idea.

I was probably too harsh, but Overall, I like the idea of buffing basic and classic a little bit. Just don’t overdo it + don’t make it too complex

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I mean, its better than the rng fiesta we have rn. At least its obvious what they do.

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  1. The rng of today is not due to the basic/classic set, because it’s the less random of all sets.

  2. You litteraly added randomness to some cards.

No it’s not : I didn’t get what’s the difference between ‘inflitrator’ and ‘stealth’, you created some keywords (thus adding complexity), you added a TON of complexity to some cards, and made new token !
You have good ideas, but you must remember that the basic and classic sets (especially the basic) must be simple and consistant.

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You have good ideas. But only about 80% of your list should be implemented in the game.

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Wild growth not good enough? At 3 Mana it’s “the perfect card” to receive turn two a lot of the time.

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I’m all in for having decent basic/classic cards since those cards are important for new players or start building new decks to counter meta.

There are plenty good ideas but most are overdoing it especially some of those cards were nerfed for reason. Aswell some of those don’t really deserve nerfs. Just for start improve some horribly weakly statted minions to proper stats. I just don’t see point of basic cards that nobody plays, not even new players.

Perfect example of awsome basic neutral/classic:
Acid swamp ooze 2 mana 3/2 that destroys opponent weapon. Simply just nice tech card.
Harvest golem: 3 mana 2/3 deathrattle 2/1. Classic has many decent cards but why I chose harvest golem for example is that it is just simple alright card that shows classic can have those cards but not to be too relevant for standard meta. You could have it in your deck and eventually upgrade out of it.

Perfect example of horrible basic neutral/classic:
Silverback Patriarch 3 mana 1/4 taunt. Beast tribe won’t save this. For some reason basic taunts are so valued that they often lack stats. Some can see Magma rager worse (which in use it can be for many reasons) but atleast in theory it can burst damage.
Priestess of Elune 6 mana 5/4 restore your hero for 4. So expensive for such little effect. Irony is current meta needs such cards but not when it leaves you more behind next turn.

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Most of these “rebalance” changes seem like they were made just for the sake of changing something. Pointless.

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Actually I could say that have an evergreen set isn’t necessarily too much but the actual amount of “evergreen cards” is to much.

Like…
We have more than 300 “evergreen cards” in a game were we can barely have 790 cards that actually rotate.

I think that around 10 cards for each class an 0 neutrals is more than enough IF
those cards were slightly relevant like fireball.

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i agree.i went overboard with a few card buffs.

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Hey ! I’m back now that you did some changes (I apologize for taking this much time, I didn’t realize you edited your post)

I still have no problem with this

Considering Goku has stats normal for his cost, you could probably make it a 6-mana.

Would It be balance ? Cost 1 less than a similar neutral classic card for 2 less stats, but a more restricted power. Maybe it could be kept at 3/2.

And again, I disagree. But that’s probably because I’m a mage main.

Yeah that should be good (not sure about giving taunt, tho)

Yeah that would actually be a good idea

Hmm… Not sure about it but why not.

Nah I think it’s pretty balanced.

Still agreeing

Let’s be more serious than last time. It should also give +1 attack. Because that’s what gob lackey does, and lackey are 1-cost effect with a 1/1 body attached to it.

Why not ? You sure about the damage buff ?

0/3 Eggs ? Or 0/2 ?
Maybe 2 eggs is too much

Still love this idea

Balanced.

Yes, very good idea. Simple health buff are enough (in my opinion)

Oh that’s cute, and sad.
And pretty balanced (maybe a 1/1)

Ok, seriously, it’s a pretty good card.

Very good idea.

Good. I’m happy you decided to keep it consistant.

Still unhappy it’s not super consistant. Maybe make it a 4/4 rush.

Same question about the health of the egg.
Seems more balanced than your raptor.

You like eggs deck, don’t you ? A third egg card is probably too much. Just give taunt to the current card.

Yeah that makes more sense. Seems okay.

Again, simple stat buff would suffice.

Hm. Restoring 6 health to all ally cost 2. Lets say 5 health to make it at the power-level of basic. So 3 health would cost 1. So yeah your proposal seems pretty balanced.

You know your proposal makes the ogre a 6/8 taunt for 6 and the arena champion a 6/7 for 6 with a big downside, right ?

Still dislike it. Rekless rocketeer is a finisher. You make it an inconsistant board clear. To make more sense the rocket should also hit the hero.

Balanced. Inconsistant, tho.

Balanced. I’m not sure it’s needed, tho.

Again, dormant is an extension mecanic (except if they decide to keep adding cards with it)

Wouldn’t rush make more sense ?

Yeah, seems good.

The heal option should be buffed, then.

Make sense.

Why not.

Honestly, I don’t want to try and think about the balance of weapon. It’s too complicated for me.

Again, odd pally. Or maybe it wouldn’t be too much of a problem, idk.

Still okay with it.

Considering how bad the card is, a full rework would be better.

Huh, combo are annoying to balance for me. But it would make sense.

Yeah that may change things. I’m not sure.

Isn’t this card already okay ?

Yeah a 2/2 windfury overload 2 sounds okay.

I still think it needs a rework

My opinion didn’t change.

Maybe. I like to see it as a finisher, but maybe I’m wrong.

Ok

That sounds okay. I don’t like the card (too big for a zoo) but that’s just me.

I still don’t get it. It’s just a weaker ooze

Ok

Now that I re-think about it, it may be enough : at least 13 stats for 6 mana.

Yeah that would be balanced.

I really don’t think it’s a good idea, but maybe that’s just me. Let’s see : divine shield cost 1, taunt cost 0, and a 4/5 cost pretty much 4. Considering there’s a 4 mana 3/3 divine shield and a 2 mana 3/1 divine shield. a 6 Mana divine shield would be a 5/5. So yeah, adding taunt and removing 1 attack would make sense (ie the current one).

? He’s already 6 mana.

Yes please make it consistant Bliz

The 4/12 I agree. The 15 seconds I’m not sure. Anyway they need to prevent buggy interaction forever before doing things like this.

Why not. But make it 5 mana. Dream cards are super strong cards.

Have a good day !

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Eggs have 1 health.The reason I nerfed Fireball to 5 damage and kept it is so it would be The Priestess of Fury counter for mage. The reason for me to buff sunwalker to 5 mana is so its out of the power of creation pool.The Ironbark thing.Yes,you are right.Your version would be better,same thing with starvin buzzard,Guardian of kings should heal 8 if it doesnt give taunt as you suggested if it is to keep up with amber watcher,maybe also changed to a 6/8.Also,yes fire elemental should be buffed by 1 mana instead of increasing the effects damage,thats would make more sense,agree with the charge buff you said too.Maybe Warsong Commander should give +1 attack (i also agree that i went a bit overboard),the Lonely Cub should be 1/1 too,maybe with rush.Chillwind Yeti should be a 4/5 rush so that even if there is no minions on the board it has half a mana value which wouldnt be too powerful,boulderfist ogre just having +1 health would be good.or deatharattle:Spawn a Boulder .The boulder would force the minion infront of it to attack it.If the Boulder was in the middle of 2 minions one of the would attack it.It isnt like a “force an an enemy to attack it”.The minion infront of it or the minions on the side would have tokill it to attack something else.It would be a 0/3. This way you wouldnt just throw the Ogre to the board but would think “Where is the best place to put it”.Would be pretty nice.Injured New Champion is also nerfed to a 1/2 with poison.Reckess Rocketeer maybe buffed to 5 mana too so its also out of the power of creation spawnpool.Thıs way it would see more play but also wouldnt cause me to buff mage unintentionally.Also,dormant has been in previous expansions too,even if there were only a few.So it isnt an Ashes of Outland keyword.Wıthout stealth the Charge option of the druid of the claw would make more sense and would be more balanced.The healing of the ancient of lore should be 5.6 would be too powerful.SI:7 Agent is just a 3 mana 3/3 if we remove the effect.rignt now it has a 0 mana spell as its combo.It doing what a 1 mana spell does would give it more value.Its pretty good,i even use it but 3 damage would be better for it.My overload decreases are pretty balanced in my opinion.Blizzard made the overload of some cards too mcuh which made them not really worth using since they could really limit your next turn.I like it as a mechanic but blizzard made some cards have too much.Black Knight stays the same then lol.It should have more variety at what it can destroy.Maybe he can destory divine shield,taunt and end/start of turn effect minions? Eternal dream guard should be 6 mana.Its stats cost 6 and lifesteal costs 0.5 mana.But if i make it 5 mana it would have 1.5 mana value which is too much.

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