The condition that the opponent board has to be weak is a “yes and no”; if it is lethal yes; if it’s not: it can be anything[especially if the remaining cards include clears and heals].
[also even a lethal may survive the first round because there is 2 remaining mana plus any extra potential mana from potential mana sources (including no-mana-cost cards)]
Your are right it has to be heavily supported by the [remaining in-hand] cards (which makes it obviously a “we’ll see”),
but don’t underestimate the predictability of late-rounds on 30-card decks; e.g. the warrior that is a meme right now almost-always has the cards it needs at round 10 because there’s simply no much randomness at that point; also some cards directly target lowering unpredictability[e.g. Dredge/“Draw a <type”/“Put to bottom->Give me the bottom”] (though again we’ll have to wait and see their availability (and applicability)).
This mythical 9 card hand of heals and removals is only going to occur in games where your opponent is a literal punch bag. Every time a card like this is revealed, people rush to say how broken it will be assuming everything goes perfectly. The reality is, our opponent is trying to win the game too and isn’t going to let us hoard removals and heals. Neither are they going to let us skip turn 8 without facing dire consequences. Do I think this card will end games? Sure, but I doubt it will rise above tier 3 without a lot of help (by a lot of help I mean a card that lets you effectively bypass all the glaring weaknesses of the wheel).
I’ve been playing this game for 10 years, I know how the late game goes. I also know that “destroy the enemy hero” win conditions either need to be extremely fast or be resigned to countering attrition control decks and nothing else. The only way I can see this having a chance at being remotely playable is some kind of powercrept Doomkin allowing the Warlock to ramp ahead of the opponent earlier than turn 6 (but also needs to draw through the deck to ensure they have the resources to survive the 5 turn clock in fatigue). 5 turns is a really long time to play survival in the late game with finite resources and a looming fatigue clock.
I don’t see it either being great with just single-use cards (and you’re right a ramp-up archetype may work). But I think you missed another archetype/hand type that may do it. Very high randomness but with high probability of getting powerful cards; e.g. cards that Discover legendaries; these can be pretty good if they are 9 because they often bring stuff that bring in turn more powerful stuff (and in that case it’s clear that mainly fatigue would be a technical issue but for that there may be another targeted method adding cards to deck).
Okay, I’ve been thinking about this a bit more and I’m not sure that “Bad Odyn” is garbage anymore.
First off, Sludges. So it’s not exactly zero tempo the turn it’s played, you’ll be slinging Sludge everywhere.
Second, Fanottem. 0 cost 15/15 Lifesteal Taunt on the turn you play Bad Odyn. Seems aight.
Third, Symphony of Sins. This shuffles six cards into the deck, so we might only be looking at 1 Fatigue damage here.
Fourth, Felstring Harp. Warlock has more than one tool to prevent Fatigue, although this one isn’t nearly as good as Symphony for purpose. But it is cheap, and that is a big deal if Symphony is too risky.
Fifth, Photographer Fizzle. An alternative to Symphony, best combined with Harp. Basically double your resources and miss one Fatigue draw.
That said, I still don’t think the deck would be viable unless the new set provides some new cards for Warlock to cycle through most of their deck quickly. Odyn Warrior only works because of Acolyte of Pain and removal that synergizes with it. But I’m starting to see that Festival of Legends already includes a decent amount of the necessary tools, albeit not all of them.
I guess a Warlock version of Aftershocks is about all it would take to make the deck work. Probably still Tier 3 even then but Carnivore has a point, it depends on what other cards are coming.
This card can potentially be overpowered if played with a perfect synergy of cards.
For example, this would obviously not be competitive at 8 mana, but seems like everyone has forgotten about reverb plus bats, that can discount a total of 12 mana off a shadow card, so this card can easily cost 2 or less mana after discounting it with bats twice or more.
I’ve already been experimenting with a fatigue Warlock otk combo deck in standard using bats and it was nearly competitive prior to nerfs, thanks to bats discounting reverb plus lady D.
The idea would be to cast this around turn 6 or 7 for 2 or less mana, which should be consistently possible.
The next step is you need something to take advantage of the empty deck. For example you run Reno. I’d have to see the other cards that get released to know if there is support this, but with the current cards there’s not enough highlander cards or other effects that would benefit from an empty deck. Perhaps tome tampering, but there would need to be a way to get draw.
Overall, people are way to quick to dismiss this card, it has potential to be op with the right support package, but then again, im not sure how many of you build original and competitive decks, so this kind of thinking only comes from a lot of practice.
To be clear it’s unlikely the 5 turn win condition will be that strong (5 turns is a very long time in HS) but the deck deletion could potentially be very strong with the right synergies. The 5 turn clock is a nice add on.
Also for people who think it simply “but my health goes down”, I remind you that the Shaman has a gigantic mountain with mega windfury that just spam heals and can even be doubled with the big lady.
I’m not saying Warlock will have that as is but don’t underestimate how crazy end game can be; healing is not an important issue in isolation for example; there are already cards that just fully-heal.
I mean, I’m not sure what Scroties point was, but to yours, it is a weekend.
This will very likely become the centerpiece of a deck. When depends on if they give warlock bonkers removal (likely) or stall (less likely, but voidlords could come back) and draw (very likely).
It probably fits into some sort of control sludge deck that also runs encroaching madness. If you can draw the right combo pieces, this annihilates your deck and likely the opponents board/face and then you follow it up with draw, damage, protection and fatigue damage (void virtuoso, and crescendo, plus popgar for heals).
Agreed… I believed the developers learned from the mistakes which are almoast killed the game last year… but seems like they didn’t… It think it is time for me to stop playing too… I had enough… I am sure the Warlocks will find a way to use this in OP way… no mather the mana cost or the conditions… it is a sick joke for me…
The point is just to get your fatigue timer up. Encroaching insanity might not even be the best way to do that once the deck is blown up.
Let’s say you’re already at 4 fatigue, one way or another. Next turn after this spell (which we can assume blew up 4-8 sludges and so probably cleared their board and hit face) you play virtuoso, popgar, a 3 mana draw three, two crescendos and the 2 sludges for 10 mana. That’s 25 damage to face.
It’s easy to imagine the deck blowup hitting the draw 2 if destroyed spell, in which case you’re at 27 or 29 damage. And thats on top of anything the sludges did.
I can also easily see a fel draw spell making the combo with popgar get above 30 or leave you with space to play a harp.
So now you basically have a control warlock deck that can otk on turn 10. Which grantee, might be a little late, dependent on the meta.
Might be a potential issue in wild but there is also a lot of disruption options. I’m not a fan of the card but unless someone finds a way to to discount it early I can’t see it being that big of an issue, at least when it initially comes out. Possibly down the road when future cards are released. In standard it shouldn’t be an issue.
Insanity just as “permanent” spell damage for Crescendo (plus 3 or 7 to both faces) is a second win condition. And you don’t really need alternative win conditions if your primary is good enough. Like the cycle Odyn Warrior deck, it doesn’t need alternative win conditions.
You don’t need Encroaching Insanity for healing to full off of Pop’gar, generally. A Baritone Imp or two will generally suffice. So there isn’t really any defensive justification for it.
Spells are pretty difficult to disrupt currently. If they print a Dirty Rat for spells then idk maybe investing in two wincons would make sense. But generally speaking no, I don’t think that what you’re talking about will be a thing.