Why? Just ban Odyn Warrior, problem solved
No it wouldn’t, since the number of games played on MT is negligent and most definitely not a statistically significant sample
Yeah, I don’t know what you’re looking at in those screen shots. Look at the matchups vs DH. It annihilates them all.
The only things in red are a few decks that see little to no play (see Big Shaman and Frost DK) and only has a few counters that are popular (see Rainbow Shaman, Razzle DK, and Odyn Warrior)
You talk about 50/50. There’s very little 50/50 here. It’s mostly 60/70/80 matchups.
I think that any non-bias non-Mage main player here will look at those screen shots, see all the massively solid green matchups, look at all the red matchups and the play rates of some of them being super low, and only come away with a logical conclusion that Elemental Mage is a great deck and a very strong performer in the meta.
There is absolutely no way one can come away with the conclusion that it’s a “mediocre” or “mid” deck based on those screenshots without having some weird bias shining through.
It’s clear as day here that it’s a top deck.
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“This 3 mana 3/1 draw three cards is PATHETIC! What a slap in the face this is Blizzard!”
~mall/kewl/all the other magetrolls
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Well its’ useful for one thing–getting a solid decklist down.
These players are experimenting in their off time and are some of the best players of the game, therefore, they way they choose to build Ele Mage will likely be better than most other variations we see on ladder.
It’s likely to be worse, because it’s tailored for the specific decks they’ll be playing against.
They all have to publish their exact deck lists before the MT, which leaves enough time to optimize.
Are we looking at the same table… Dollhouse druid which I assume = spell damage druid on that donkey site has elemental mage at a 52% winrate… hardly a 60-80% competitive edge.
Flood paladin is a 50% winrate which represents one of the ‘true’ aggro decks although at a rather small sample.
Im not sure what ‘tourist paladin’ is but I assume it might be pipsi in which case its sort of a cross aggro/mana cheat deck thats also a coinflip 50%
Rainbow shaman I’m not sure if that is the same as nostalgia shaman on the donkey website but I presume it can be considered an equally aggroish deck.
The only decks again that its good against (your 60-80% winrate) that see any level of play are the mana cheat decks (druid/BSM) and whatever rogue players are trying to do.
I imagine priest/warlock/hunter are all deep red vs everything so I doubt that has anything to do with elemental mage being a great deck and more that those classes are just bad.
I mean yes you showed me a table that has a bunch of green on it… whee I’ll just say great deck and move on… But when you actually look at it, it doesnt appear to have a significant edge against the specialized decks out there… The true aggro decks/true otk decks that are seeing any substantial play all seem to be coinflip matchups.
It seems like its only really great against people trying to utilize mana cheat (druid/rogue/BSM)
If anything that table shows that pirate DH is actually a pretty bad aggro deck as it cant even compete with a hybrid aggro deck.
The man cant defend himself so i will, he never said the card was bad.
He was pissed it only works with elementals,he plays a very specific type of Mage deck and feels this type of elemental Mage should not exist in the class.
If i recall he said something about not wanting to play a Paladin deck.
His biggest gripe has always been class bleed ,this last 2 sets were the straw that broke the camel’s back for him.
They don’t have a deck that can compete against the Mage decks because Mage can present lethal on turn 4. Any deck you could come up with to try and compete with that is going to be bad against the rest of the meta and not likely to beat the Mage anyway.
The Mage deck is not just burn to face oh look i win because I have big spell damage. It’s a true tempo deck from turn 1 that will keep playing to the board and asking the question. The minute you do not have the answer to the question it’s basically over.
That’s where those 1-3% points in win rates come into play. you didn’t draw the answer.
There’s the evolve version of Shaman that comes in two flavors and the true Rainbow with Razzle. Both are good because they high roll into randomly good 5+ drops well before they should.
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Yes. But all while ignoring the more popular Druid deck, Dungar with 59% win and even more popular Taunt Druid at 61%.
Why focus on a smaller play rate deck? Sure, you can pick and choose 1 or 2 decks here and there…but the overall scheme of things is decisively Elemental Mage dominance.
Sure. 1900 games. So insignificant here when compared to all the other decks that sit at 10k games. Why are we picking such small play rate decks???
And then you say it represents a true aggro deck, all while ignoring Pirate DH at 6300 games with a whopping 61% win rate. Over 3x the play rate of flood paladin…
Shaman is really the only class with a total overall good matchup rate when compared with all its available decks.
Of the 8 decks in red, Shaman is 4 of them.
So you brought up Flood Paladin with a less play rate of Pirate DH to make a point, yet ignore it and talk about how play rates of decks matter…
Did we just gloss over Quasar Rogue, BSM, Breakfast Hunter?
Let’s do this. Pick another deck. I’ll show you their stats and you can compare it to Elemental Mage.
Would you like to see Odyn Warrior? Spoiler Alert: Tons of red.
Rainbow Shaman, a deck that has been sitting at #1 for quite some time now, is the only one that looks even remotely close to Elemental Mage.
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Just block this guy he’s just a troll
He’s gone?
praise the lawd
How about you do this… Make a list of aggro decks and show me the winrate vs those aggro decks
Make a list of OTK decks and show me the winrate against those OTK decks
Make a list of ‘control’ decks and show me the winrate vs those decks
Then make a list of ‘mana cheat’ decks and show the winrate vs those decks.
The deck performs against mana cheat decks (BSM/Dungar Druid/Taunt druid/quasar/cycle rogue)
Is average vs aggro decks (DH apparently can be declared an awful aggro deck feel free to compare pirate DH vs the other aggro decks in the winrate table of aggro decks I imagine its a dog)
Is average vs OTK decks
Is a dog vs control decks.
Is a great deck vs mana cheat strategies.
Thats my conclusion from the screenshots/data you provided. If you have a better source of data with more games played then by all means share it.
I have neither the time nor energy to sort the data when it’s all right there in the screen shots.
If this were a VS report, it would look like this across the board of meta decks
GGGGGGGGGGRGGGGGGGRGGGGGRGGGG
Where G = Green and R = Red
That should tell you all you need to know. With that much green, claiming the deck is mediocre is just denial at this point.
I can tell you right now, Elemental Mage is not “dog vs control decks”. The only “control” deck that beats it is Odyn Warrior if you even want to consider that a Control deck.
I don’t know what else to tell you. The deck is solid.
For some reason, we’re just ignoring the stats I gave you earlier:
That’s all you need to know on determining if a deck is good. Those numbers point to a deck that isn’t just good, but top of the meta good. Saying it’s mid is mind blowing.
The ONLY logical debate we can have here is whether or not the deck needs a nerf.
The fact that the deck is great is non-debatable at this point. Might as well debate on whether or not the moon is made of cheese if that’s the case.
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I would like to add that outside of the obvious Warrior and Shaman decks that the Mage deck has problems against. 8 Hands DK is the next worst matchup for the Mage deck. The version i am playing is also very good at disposing of the Warrior decks. Those shaman decks are the bigger problem IMO. If Shaman goes untouched in balance…oh my.
I’m going to assume your 8 Hands Deck is vastly different from the meta list because the meta list gets eaten up for breakfast by Ele Mage.
Do you have a list? I would think the reason Ele Mage beats it is because deleting the top 8 cards lets the Mage get to the Saruun + Surger combo much faster and that likely doesn’t work out well.
I’m able to get under Elemental Mage with Starship DK if I can get my armor piece out and deathgrowl the starship and gain 40+ armor on turn 7. That’s pretty much my only saving grace and game plan unless they draw godly then there’s no chance.
Giving me a chart and going ‘LOOK ITS ALL GREEN BELIEVE ME SEE’ without actually analyzing it is mind blowing.
Its mid against aggro archtypes (shaman, most aggro has disappeared DH Is bad)… mid against otk archetypes (50% winrate against the highest played OTK deck in the game)… bad against control (warrior/DK)… and great against mana cheat archetypes.
Its winrate is inflated because mana cheat archetypes are some of the most popular decks in the game.
So it is debatable outside just pointing and drooling at a number on a stat website and some green colors on winrate table.
I changed 8 cards in the deck that is on most sites. It’s a good foundation but it’s a bit mid and top heavy. You need more pressure front loaded which translates into more corpses quicker and a more explosive mid game. If you cannot reliably play breach on 6 then you aren’t playing enough early game to trade with and keep the Mage in check.
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Its winrate is deflated because of the mass popularity of Odyn Warrior being played specifically to counter it.
You’re focusing on one side of the picture here. On purpose? I don’t know.
But it’s pretty dang clear the meta at the top of the game looks like this:
Play Rainbow Shaman to win.
Play Elemental Mage to win.
Play a deck that counters Elemental Mage.
Everyone is trying to find answers to counter the mass popularity and strength of Elemental Mage. This is why Odyn Warrior currently exists in its current form. It sucks against a large part of the meta.
The name of the game is play a deck that counters Elemental Mage. And despite people doing that, those numbers are all still massively green.
Well if we circle back to the original premise… the deck is uncompetitive at high ranks like pirate warrior…
Odyn warrior makes up a paltry 4000 games played from your website at top 1k legend…
Its a coinflip vs the other highly played OTK archtype in spell damage druid
It massively farms the mana cheat decks like BSM & rogue decks
So stop playing BSM & stop playing rogue and play paladin/OTK druid/DK/shaman at high legend and you’ll have no problem with elemental mage
I guess better put elemental mage only looks like a great deck because people are stubbornly playing bad rogue decks at 1k legend
I guess even better put the deck excels at getting under decks that defer board presence like cycle rogue / BSM / mana cheat decks… but average against decks that have equal board presence (aggro decks) or decks with clears and an equal OTK footing (spell damage druid/warrior)
Yes he quit for good and unlike some clowns on this forum he doesnt hide in alts.
Not sure if he will ever return but he hasnt played since then.
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