Wasn't this supposed to be a NEW game? I mean $100...For D3 remake

Hello everyone,
I have played diablo since the first installment was released. It is one of my favorite game series and I have put countless hours into Diablo, Diablo 2, Diablo 2 Resurrected. I have played my fair share of Diablo 3 as well. I’ll get right to the point here. The Diablo series has become utter $|-|!T. It is so glaringly obvious that I feel ashamed that I fell for it again. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.

I will first point out flaws within diablo 3 so that I can then reference the similarities to those flaws that exist within diablo 4.

Let me explain what I mean:

  • The gameplay of Diablo 4 is basically the same as Diablo 3.
  • Diablo 3 was the worst, most boring Diablo game except Immortal.
  • Diablo 3’s gameplay was so poorly designed that every single class boiled down to the same thing every single season.
  • Level Up (easy), get greens (easy), get non green slot legendaries (easy), cube stuff (actually a somewhat interesting mechanic), pick up junk to scrap (tedious), rinse and repeat for ancestral versions of the same gear (easy).
  • Set gear gave such ridiculous bonuses (to single/select skills) that there were literally no other alternatives, except like one other niche build that was for the most part, sub-par to greens yet comparable.
  • The fact that such ultra specific, outrageously large bonuses were required in order to advance through the torments to the top tier shows just how flawed the game design was from a development standpoint.
  • Blizzard Literally had to make your build work. No gear consideration or skill consideration was necessary on the players part. This essentially took CHARACTER BUILDING away from the player. You either used whatever the set buffed or you sucked. (potency wise not skill wise)
  • Endgame boiled down to literally nothing as there was no trading system to create a reason to farm. Item drop rates and the ridiculous endgame combat dichotomy made maxing a character extremely easy.
  • The value of a trade system is that it introduces the concept of “wealth building,” which gives players a reason to continue to play. This only works however if Items are actually difficult to find, otherwise they will be valueless and the economy will stagnate easily. The reason this is an important concept is that wealth building has no ceiling, you can literally continue grinding (even on a maxed out character) and still feel as though they are playing the game with purpose.
  • Paragon levels are essentially worthless, a cheap distraction to keep you playing to chase minor upgrades that very soon become rather pointless as well.
  • The above concerns are secondary (though serious) to THE BIGGEST FLAW of Diablo 3 was it’s oversimplified, underwhelming and extremely limiting skill system. Which stunted its potential “Fun Factor.”
  • SKILL SYSTEM FLAW #1: You can only use 6 skills via hotbar/hotkeys. This effectively neutered the concept of “skilled/adaptive play” as there are specific types of skills available to each class that anyone would be a fool to go without, such as defensive skills, movement skills, etc. This essentially meant players weren’t even able to make use of all of the abilities available to them. They learned all the abilities, got all the runes but only had access to 6 at a time…and good luck changing them out and selecting runes in combat!
  • Skill System Flaw #2: The Gainer/Spender system. This system seems not so bad at first glance but upon greater scrutiny it becomes apparent that this system is a major contributing factor to the flawed itemization system. “Gainers” are weaker attacks with mostly unspectacular effects while gainers are powerful with mostly spectacular effects.
  • The reasons this matters are simple: when you are out of resource you are incredibly vulnerable and likely cannot kill the mobs fast enough since in the highest tiers the game more or less breaks down to “I stomp everything or I get one shot/shot-gunned.” This being the case (due to poor game balancing) the general go to strategy for surviving while still being able to clear at a reasonable speed is “move and attack at the same time.” Not all classes excel at this however, without this tactic you are nearly inescapably going to take many hits which can easily one shot or shotgun you to death. Alternatively you could split your resource recovery time between moving and attacking with your “gainer” however it is slow and you will likely end up having to use defensive/movement cooldowns to stay alive, which in turn will leave those cooldowns unavailable during your “spender” uptime. THEREIN LIES THE PROBLEM, the sets provide such bonuses as 10000% increased damage to a predetermined skill (usually a “spender”), applying all applicable runes to that skill, granting resource when that skill hits, granting defensive bonuses when that skill is cast/channeled, etc. Usually the result is this basically eliminates the need for the “gainer” ability and further simplifies the combat. (As if that were necessary…)
  • So by creating a game balance that escalates to a point where there is no real struggle but rather only overwhelming victory or instant death, they created a need for a mechanic that essentially overwrites their own “gainer/spender” system in addition to increasing the players TTK against enemies drastically. ENTER the sets…LOOK AT THESE BONUSES!! Nevermind that we just railroaded you into playing the game you bought however we decide. Nevermind that even though builds could be far more diverse, interesting and FUN…just be glad we even gave you 6 skills…coulda been 4…or 2.

MEANWHILE IN DIABLO 4:

  • Still only 6 skills usable at a time via notkey/hotbar…huh, foreboding…
  • Still “Gainer/Spender” resource system…the foreboding grows…
  • Still Not Trading thus no worthwhile reason to play after hitting the progression/itemization ceiling.
  • Still RIDICULOUSLY easy item find. Not that it matters to the non existing trade economy but itemization is going to be boring, followed by a near instantly fleeting contentment and finally the feeling of a hollow victory.
  • The “Stomp or Die” endgame has begun, and will likely worsen as seasons/patches/expansions are released…The Forboding is REAL…
  • Are those sets I see on the horizon??
  • The Mount is nice…but not as nice as BEING ABLE TO USE ALL THE SPELLS I KNOW WHENEVER I WANT!!! (When off CD and with appropriate resource of course.)
  • Aspects are nice…honestly a very interesting and fun mechanic.
  • Paragon Levels are better than they were, Gotta give them that one.
  • The graphics quality is Very Nice however the Character Esthetics leave much to be desired. just to give a few example most of the armor is Ugly, looks impractical (like a big hole in the front right over the characters heart) and is misrepresentative (i.e. Sorcerer “heavy Plate” is literally just a big necklace with a shawl on your back…the rest just bare skin.)
  • The oh so familiar flaws of D3 are woven into D4 and if they are not fixed the game is HIGHLY likely to end up playing just like the oh so boring, oversimplified, uninspired, imbalanced, railroaded, heavy handed, uninteresting Diablo 3. Which was a gold plated turd…nah more like a turd covered in glass dust…you know so it twinkles like diamond dust…or well maybe that’s too obvious it’s a turd…OH got it! Diablo 3 was a Pyrite covered turd…you know so you would think it was gold but then realized it really a turd…but then you would think hey at least it was a little bit gold…and then you got it appraised and found out it was pyrite instead…and then you had to pay the appraiser…and then you realize you also wasted your time…OUCH that’s a savage combo…
  • Overall, it comes down to a few simple and fundamental game development principals. #1. Fun Factor #2. Player (NOT Character) Reward System and #3. Engaging Gameplay. Diablo 3 failed in all three of these…sure it was fun for a while but had no staying power due to poor design. I hope the same won’t be true of D4.

Now all that said I sure hope it gets better/changes/doesn’t end up like D3. Looking at the similarities though…it seems like it might. It honestly already feels so similar to D3 that I was so frustrated about it that I had to write this post…$100 just to buy a D3 clone…If it doesn’t change, If Blizzard ruins this installment of the Diablo series like they failed on the D3 and Immortal, I will just be done buying blizzard products, they won’t see another penny from me. Yeah, Yeah, I know it is no big deal to them but what else can I do? They are gonna make the games they make the way they wanna make them…So I will spend my money with a company that actually cares about making quality products.

OK, LET THE FANBOY HATE BEGIN!!!

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You say that, and yet there are many in here complaining that the game is not more like D3.

Personally, I’d have preferred 3 (or 4) difficulty levels where we play through the campaign again, just like every previous iteration. The 50+ stuff just seems… messy.

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Too long of a post for anything to begin

Here’s a TL:DRGPT:

The author is disappointed with the Diablo series, particularly Diablo 3, and sees similar flaws in Diablo 4. They criticize the repetitive gameplay, over-reliance on set gear, lack of character building, lack of trading system, and oversimplified skill system in Diablo 3. They express concern that Diablo 4 continues to have only six usable skills, the same resource system, lack of trading, easy item find, and a “stomp or die” endgame. They appreciate certain aspects like the mount, Paragon levels, and graphics quality but find character aesthetics lacking. The author hopes Diablo 4 will improve but threatens to stop buying Blizzard products if it disappoints like Diablo 3 and Diablo Immortal.

Hopefully that did it if not feel free to take it and put a TL:DR at the top. If it’s interesting to the audience, they can then decide if they want to read all that. GL

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It’s about to be. Wait until nightmare sigils open a rift to the dungeon.

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I am not disappointed in the entire Diablo series, I even stated so at the very beginning. It is just D3 and Immortal that sucked and it makes me concerned for D4 because it is so similar to D3 in very fundamental and foundational ways.

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If you think Diablo 3 and Diablo Immortal sucked…why on earth did you buy Diablo 4? At this point you can NOT blame the devs.

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I will say… Diablo 3 and 4 are entirely different because of one thing - trading. Having the ability to trade or not dictates how loot can be acquired, which is a massive change to the game mechanics. If you’ve ever played solo self found, Ironman, or wow hardcore classic, you know exactly what I mean here.

No trading in D3 means you absolutely need focused loot for your class when you’re playing. You need higher drop rates as well.

But then they put trading in D4 and then still kept the focused loot and high drop rates… which is kind of fine…. It actually works for legendary imprinting, but the focused loot has horrible downsides when trading is allowed

But trading vs no trading affects end game activities too. Trading means a high level character should be able to farm to trade items and in D4 with item level requirement, you can’t.

Kinda weird they clashed both aspects of loot where some work well in a trading environment and some don’t.

Meanwhile just as many people complaining that it needs to be more like d3. Both camps look pretty stupid.

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Like I said at the very beginning of my post. I Have been playing diablo games since the original came out. I had hope, that ever happen to you? I can blame the devs, I never blamed them for me buying the game. I blamed them for how diablo 4 turned out or how it seems like it will turn out anyway.

Who else is to blame for how Diablo 4 was created? Me? You? I know I didn’t have any direct influence on it. Did you?

“wasn’t this supposed to be a new game” - immediately wants to regress the game back to Diablo 2.

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My suggestion was just to put a TLDR. It helps people realize whether or not to actually read your post. I can tell you’re passionate about the game but that’s a lot to get invested in and people are just going to miss your message by skimming.

I use GPT a lot to summarize and take notes on my scripts, summaries and so on. It’s at least a good start :wink:

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I dont care about your post. A lot of you “have played Diablo since the beginning” but clearly hate Diablo so I don’t know why you keep buying it. It’s unhealthy and disturbing to read. But here we are. I expect the forum trolling and developer bashing will never truly end. Like I said " IF YOU HATED DIABLO 3 AND DIABLO IMMORTAL, words that came out of YOUR text, THEN WHY BUY 4? That’s stupidity at its best. At this point I believe some of yall are buying games with no idea what you are truly buying. Then get upset when its not what you think it should be when it was always advertised as what it is. Look at all betas. This game had more than enough time to show you what it was. It’s not the game’s fault you ignored all that to still pay for it and expect something else.

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Immortal and D3 were trash compared to 4.

I agree. 4 is amazing. But I do love Immortal and I did enjoy 3. I just got bored with 3 after awhile and the devs stopped supporting it. So if the support stays strong with 4, I think it’ll be the ultimate Diablo experience. I still log into Immortal everyday and do my elder rifts cause my immortal barb is fun to play as well.

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No hate from me. Any OG Diablo 1-2 player will agree with you. It’s these new console players that like these zoomer, instant gratification casual games.

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Actually D3 wasn’t that bad of game
It was ok but not great D2r is still the best diablo
I am having fun with D4 but I still think D2 is the best of the series but I will prob go back to D2 after I get bored with D4

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You can summerize this topic down to OP having a hate b**** for D3 and projecting that here.

We get it, you hate the game. Could of saved up all the time by just saying “This game is like D3 and I hate D3”.

The game is really a lot like D3. Too much so. It’s hard to tell the difference. I don’t mind them borrowing or improving on ideas from D3, but that’s not what they did. Everything in D4 is just a translation of what D3 was. D4 doesn’t do enough to distinguish itself as it’s own game.

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So your brain melted. That would explain why u believe d4 is a d3 remake. They are very different anyone without a braindmg can see that.

They should have borrowed more systems from D2. They could have kept the quality of life changes, graphics, animation and combat from D3 and married the two games. Then it would have had D2’s superior items and complexity.

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