You’re just arguing against blatant reality. The mere fact sites like maxroll are popular disprove your argument. The fact is people enjoy games differently. And many enjoy arpgs by minmaxing them.
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Its very obvious, min maxing gear. Like literally every other diablo game.
“Nobody likes to grind the same dungeon endlessly, cause that’s not fun. But people will do it cause it’s optimal.”
That right there is why this update had to happen. Things in the game should be equally efficient for the amount of time you put into something so that you’re not forced to choose to spam 1 dungeon over and over, instead now you can explore the world, do side quests, do a side dungeon, a cellar here and there and so on. You wrote your own argument for yourself and that’s exactly what they’re combatting. Level 100 is prestigious and takes time, it shouldn’t be gotten via exploits or doing the same exact 1 thing over and over.
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Well done Blizzard, can u add one refund botton? thx
Are you one of those players who want to get to 100 as soon as possible with the most efficient way? If so, can you answer one simple question: why? Like I said, this psychology works for games with win conditions like Civilization. Why Diablo, where there are no win conditions?
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Because I cannot enjoy games without playing them efficiently. Many players come at games to reverse engineer them and master them. That’s not you. And that’s fine. What confounds me is how unable you are to understand other ways players gain satisfaction from playing games. It seems to disturb you, and others like you, in some way.
Because “I enjoy it” doesn’t provide any interesting information. The “why” behind it is what matters, because if you understand the why, you’ll be able to reason about games more correctly.
Many players come at games to reverse engineer them
Is that your reason? But then why do you give Maxroll as an example? Maxroll guys have already figured everything out, if you read their guides, you’ll spoil the entire reason for enjoying the game. Yes, theorycrafting is super fun. It’s not the game though, and not really playing the game either. It’s like me saying “I like to install apps on my PC because I like to reverse engineer them in assembly code” whereas a normal person installs apps for the functionality they provide. Both are valid scenarios, but one is niche and not why the developer made the app.
master them
Cool, but mastering the game has nothing to do with running some stupid short xp loop that gives best rewards per minute compared to other locations in the game. That’s not mastering, because there is no skill in that, it’s just braindead activity. Mastering the game would be learning all concepts, how everything works - the theoretical part - and then doing the practical part, like … performing in combat exceptionally well - dodging everything, doing perfect timings, using abilities intelligently, and so on. Cool. But you don’t need to rush to level 100 for that. So your explanation so far misses the 100 rush.
You are just arguing how you don’t understand why people enjoy games this way. I cannot explain all the nuances of human psychology to you. But the objective fact remains that a huge population of players, especially diablo players, enjoy playing the game in the most efficient manner possible. You don’t like it? That’s simply your problem.
That’s ok. Not everyone is able to explain why they do something, it can be quite hard. But at least you tried - thanks for that.
You don’t like it? That’s simply your problem.
Has nothing to do with what I like or dislike. I’m simply trying to understand what these people think and why. Especially when they make a claim that doesn’t make sense, then fail to provide logical reasoning to back it up, which gives me a suspicion that perhaps they’re lying to themselves, maybe they’re in some kind of congnitive fallacy. Not saying 100% so, just a maybe. Which is why it’s super interesting to figure out why. Kind of like reverse engineering the game, eh?
no you have to explain the entirety of human psychology to me or you’re wrong
You post on reddit a lot don’t you? Unable to acknowledge your lack of an argument or weak position even when fully exposed. You’re not interested in answers to your question. Just “being right”. Sad.
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I’m guessing you haven’t gotten to level 70 or 80 yet. By the time you reach level 80, you’ll be doing every single dungeon in the game over 20 times before you reach level 100 with the current rate of leveling. Tell me how much fun that is once you’ve reached level 100 that way.
Look, I don’t make any claims that I can’t back up and I don’t contradict myself. Others do.
Like, “I play for maximum efficiency because I like reverse engineering the game and mastering the game”, but then referring to Maxroll’s usefulness which directly contradicts the reverse engineering claim. If you like reverse engineering, you avoid sites like Maxroll like fire, because it’s the biggest spoiler you can ever have.
What exactly is exposed here, what argument is weak? I’m asking for info and getting inconsistencies in the provided answers. Naturally, that makes anyone with an inquisitive mind tug at those inconsistencies to resolve them, because otherwise the provided info is invalid and not helpful in any way. There is no position here. It’s not a contest.
Like, remember we talked about implementing WASD in D4? You said it should be implemented, I argued that it cannot be done, and in the end you provided the solution of how it can be done, but at the start of the conversation you yourself had no idea that there were any problems to solve for that implementation. It’s only my relentless questioning that allowed us to reach a solution. Same here. I see and smell BS, I’m gonna persist in figuring out the underlying cause, and I’m not gonna take these, as I see them, silly claims about max efficiency at blind faith.
I’m at 75 and have been at endgame for a long time as a mainly solo druid. I’m having lots of fun leveling at a regular pace and doing all the side content and will have fun again during the season and the next season and so on. it should be difficult to reach max level just like in d2 if you play regularly w/ no exploits.
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Resetting a dungeon to do it again is literally not an exploit, it’s a function of the game. Same thing that people did ever since Diablo 2.
But its not fun… farming the same dungeon because its “optimal”. Why do you need OP xp gain? so you can be done in a week or two and quit? that makes no sense.
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let everyone play how they like to play it.
I really enjoyed resetting it because this dungeon was rewarding compared to the rest of the game. Now i don’t feel getting rewarded elsewhere
So I guess the race to 100 that is sponsored and incentivized by Blizzard isn’t a reason… ok lol
Part of finding the “optimal” way of playing is part of the fun for many people in many games. If the developers of the game have designed it so that the “optimal” way is now nerfed or sucks, then that’s just bad game design, which is the point of the original post.
Buff Nightmare dungeon exp instead of nerfing mob density.
Depends, how bout making other dungeons as rewarding and fun. That way, folks will do everything. Taking a dump in someones mouth for doing something they enjoy won’t make you any friends
This has been my impression with the game. Only time I found upgrade was after killing the world boss. Otherwise, drops were pretty underwhelming. No real upgrades. Few sidegrades and downright underlevel stuffs. Not sure how this ‘high effort low return’ is supposed to be fun.