Stop Listening To Streamers, And Here's Why

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I am starting to get pretty frustrated with content creators pulling blizzard in conflicting directions with their feedback. Its gotta by tying them up and making shareholder make stupid, stupid decisions. Because they don’t know what they want. Because these people don’t know what they want.

I don’t think sheer difficulty makes sense for diablo games, at least not with whatever they think difficult means subjectively. That’s never been what I associate diablo with.

This game isn’t hard, and will probably never be that hard. Just like the other diablo games before it. Because ARPG’s are never hard. At best, they are convoluted, sure. Maybe poorly tuned or designed at times. But you can out build and out gear everything. POE is a much better made, more complicated, interesting, and demanding experience. But if you have the right knowledge and enough currency, you can trivialize everything. GGG target nerfs builds and playstyles constantly, people still kill uber elder day one of every league. It will always happen. Don’t try to tell blizzard to arms race the playerbase because that just removes builds and classes from viability and makes everyone more reliant on third party guides.

I do not care about takes from no lifing nerds that hate grass and have these annoying, incessant, inexhaustible, hyper specific competitive spoonfeeding needs. It is imperative blizzard stop coddling those people. They will never be happy. They’ve played the game too much and they’ve beaten it but won’t move on. The simple fact is that sweats will always sweat no matter what blizzard does. They will farm any game or system no matter how bad it is.

All that they’re going to do is make the game worse for regular people that aren’t freaks and then farm out youtube videos about how they’re disappointed with blizzard for making the game too hard in the wrong way. It already happened when this game released. I saw endless early praise for how the game was DIFFICULT (you dodge roll more than you attack) and METHODICAL (you’re hitting a monster for 20 seconds before it dies) and WEIGHTY (slow and clunky) when watching that early gameplay because these people are dumb and the only games they know besides Diablo are POE and Dark Souls. No other games exist apparently.

But then the game comes out. And what do you know. Game sucked. Loot was bad. The monsters CC’d you into a coma. The affixes were unbalanced. The game was tediously grindy. They literally gave these people what they asked for, and they cried about it anyway. Regular people hated it and just stopped playing the game. Now blizzard started changed the game to become more reasonable and enjoyable, and they’re crying for blizzard to make it hard again. The “right” kind of “hard”

Just shut up already. Stop with the HC hype. Nobody cares about SSF. Like ten people total both want ruthless and would actually play ruthless. Just play POE for that bro, it already exists. Stop asking blizzard to just make POE.

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To tell the truth, too much drama, wall of text, didn’t read. D4 being bad at the moment is not the end of the world

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the only bad suggestion Wudji has given was to take out boss fights. That’s why we fought vampires in AoZ. you can thank him specificially for that. other than that, what do you specifically disagree with? This isn’t a morning sports talk show where ppl just yell at each other. :smiley:

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Tell that to Anthem. With enough posts like this D4 will have the same fate.

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Streamers get a pass on everything. Can literally do whatever they want in game and get away scott free or rob free if u know what I mean.

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Your post is bang-on. The streamers play 8+ hours a day. So of course they prefer more complex games with lots of content. Unfortunately that doesn’t work as well for your average gamer who has 2-3 hours a day at most.

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Blizzard should listen to feedback from streamers and so should you.

Whether or not you agree is something else.

If the said subject matter involves how or what you play, wouldnt you see if it was valid and agree or disagree from said points.

Content creators have some amount of conflicting interest going on almost all the time and they arent forced to disclose that outside of an nda.

It’s up to blizzard to verify and give weight to what the streamers are saying just like they do with our feedback here.

Have an open mind.
Be skeptical.
“Trust but verify” on vetted information sources.

The last thing you should do is cut yourself off from streams of information and opinions on important things in your life.

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It’s like some kid saying DON’T LISTEN TO THE MATH TEACHER! All he does is do math all day.

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i just watched this video, besides his SSF idea. EVERYTHING else he said would be a GREAT addition to the game…

no clue why this direction wouldn’t be supported 100 %

You ever had someone pitch an idea and it sounded so good then the product comes out and it falls apart in the first few days?

Yea that’s what those TV commercials selling crap for 19.99$ sounded like and so do streamers trying to sell us these ideas that never end well.

So I watched the video and just for clarity’s sake, let’s show wudi’s list:

That’s actually pretty in line with what people here in the forum have been requesting.

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Game developers need to listen to feedback from all interested parties. However, they need to believe in the core of the game they have made and adhere to their vision of how they intended it to be played, They should watch the streamers break the game and then focus on fixing the issues that allowed that to happen.

When they start to bend over backwards to make streamers, influencers and blasters wishes come true, they will alienate the majority of the people that bought the game and are not interested in racing through the game while ignoring all the content they created.

I want them to listen to feedback but filter it with their vision for their game. The streamers and influencers, for the most part, are going to move on when the “new shiny” game comes out anyway. In the meantime, they will post click bait thumbnails to try to get views and as we all know, drama and negativity is often what gets the most views and reactions. I call it the Kardashian effect.

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Very well said. There is a balance and core vision retainment.

I believe they should have made respecs more expensive and harder to do to force people into keeping their builds or just make a new character.

In the same sense, I would expect them to make more character slots for us or purchasable anyhow. This would have fixed the stash space problem since characters would specifically be unique builds / equipment.

They made releveling alts to level 60 very easy to do now, at most takes about 2 hours, since you need 2 capstones and about 10 nms to get to around 60 (depending on the dungeon events).

They could make it hard though. World Tier 1 - 4 could be for casual players (keep everything same as now) but introduce Tier 5 that is vastly more difficult. Item power does not have to go any higher than what we have in WT4.

We just want a bit harder content. Make hell tide mobs +30 levels above your current level for example. Or whatever parameters we need to make the game harder without adding power creep.

Now the casuals can casually play as they can now and the more … focused group of folks can have at it in a much harsher world that inspires bloody, gory combat.

There’s nothing wrong with introducing SSF. For actual competitive events, it’s the only way you can guarantee legitimacy (outside of hacking/account sharing, obviously). On a broader level, the popular counterargument of “but it’ll split the player base” really holds no water, because many people who’d play SSF already don’t group or trade with people in the first place.

PoE went through this entire song and dance a decade ago, until the devs finally caved and added it. Now all their competitions are SSFHC, and a subset of players almost exclusively play SSF. The game at large is still completely fine and thriving in its trade leagues.

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Well Said. As a Side note, they also get to play hours and hours more than some of us, so while they might have issues, i do not, i have only scratched the surface of build theory crafting and all of that, and i have no intention to fast track this buy using there 3rd party sites, this defeats the purpose for me, and causes issues were there is none for certain players with interest but less time.

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I disagree with you. Diablo 1 is still one of the more challenging arpgs out. Even D2 is pretty good. I will say though is even though i would prefer it stayed this way, a blizzard game since 3 will never be niche again, so they cant justify the money spent without appealing to a bigger audience, This creates the problem. Solution i have no idea. But i think just making all content and gear available in a mode called casual might work, just like Hardcore is all some people play, i see no other way.

Considering Poe IS more diablo 3 than diablo 3, i don’t get you. In the end though D3 and a few others exist as a very casual friendly aprg, but that does not mean that is all they are or what they are meant to be. The real issue is they need to have vision and direction and actually finish ideas, and add a casual mode. Since because of 3 it is clear there is demand for a more casual game in the arpg diablo space.

To be honest a lot of the suggestions and takes from CC’s are way better than 99% of takes and suggestions from the forums.

Do people also forget that a lot of these suggestions come from the community themselves in the form of “chat” that often brainstorm with these CC’s?

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D4 dev team should not take into consideration anything coming from streamers who made D3 their career. Wudijo, Raxx, Rob etc. are poison for the game and will keep D4 down to their level.

They have no other meaningful view points other than D3. Their feedback is limited to what they want and need in order to keep their streaming careers afloat. A charisma vacuum like Wudijo for example cannot successfully branch out to other ARPG games. He is known as the D3 guy, he is irrelevant outside of that.

Blizzard should reach out to their player base as a whole or look for feedback from people who did not make D3/D4 their whole personality and life.

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true, but its something you can do yourself. no outside dev work to be done… i just say this only to state i would dislike the idea of devs wasting time to program this over other ideas listed in his video.

you can play SSF right now if you were self disciplined enough already. the fact that you need a dev to program it as a way to play means you lack conviction to the idea of it.

and this is a co-op game, its alot funner with friends… trust me