If you are looking for proof, you haven’t played enough lol. Does having proof (which you are already ignoring) will make you feel better? Does the lack of proof (although there are proofs already) will make you the holier person?
Lol
Kinda the sad reality. From what I have seen so far most of the negative feedback is in the forums. But in X and YouTube and even the chat live streams, mostly are positive feedback.
I would expect to see the same feedback like patch 1.1.0 where the majority of players in forum and social media agree.
Which means that you were looking to replace one of those perfect items. So your long term play came from perfecting the slot, not the item itself. Same with all your other examples. In fact these were examples of exactly why change in the game is the thing that drives additional play in eternal.
Yes, there are people who are finding tons of things to do. And the seasonal changes are giving more to do by changing the game. But there are also tons of people who are done with the game but may come back for the expansion. Adding new levels to the expansion is a way to enhance that experience. Not every eternal player plays the way you do and so therefore the rules of eternal aren’t made specifically for your style.
But the outrage seems to assume that minmaxing a specific item should make that item BiS forever, whereas the actual goal should be to make it the best it can be because the best item for a slot is going to continually change. Arguing that this should not be true doesn’t make sense and doesn’t even align with your anecdotes about what there is to do at endgame in eternal.
But you did ask for them to somehow freeze in place the old builds and their equipment, which is also a change most players and especially seasonal players don’t want.
Again, I get it that you don’t want to farm another ilevel X amulet with GA MS and + to a passive and the same two tempers and aspect and then enchant and masterwork it to perfection. But the complaint here isn’t, “you have screwed eternal players by gutting all our items.” The complaint is, “this new tier of power sucks.” If you make the complaint into, “don’t add new tiers of power,” then lots of people will object and Blizzard will not listen.
if you want to keep every item you ever got in eternal useful forever, you basically stunt any change that the game may go through.
changes are needed to evolve the game, sure some will not be favorable in the short term, but keeping everything as is, will be a death sentence to the game.
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This has happened 3 times over the last year - no one has complained until now
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You’re conveniently ignoring the fact that I recently stopped playing upon learning about the future item changes. I’m here discussing this with you instead of pursuing that perfect item, which you claimed wouldn’t increase playtime. Also, I plan to play Seasonal > Eternal with the lack of item integrity and no longer will spend that 90-95% of the time farming 2-4 GA items. Neither will my friends, clan-mates, and other Eternal players on this forum. The dark horse here may be the Paragon point system or Rune words. Hard to say if those would increase long-term oriented play-time. My other point is that there’s still plenty to do in the game, even with BIS items remaining unchanged.
Saying “adding new levels to the expansion enhances the experience” is just a blanket statement that doesn’t really add to the discussion. The Seasonal Realm already gives players the option to start from scratch, so why replicate that in the Eternal Realm? Your view that the Eternal Realm doesn’t need to offer more than just avoiding re-leveling and re-glyphing misses the point of how challenging it is to obtain perfect gear, especially with the recent slot-machine-style updates to itemization and master-tempering. That’s why I keep asking if you’ve actually min-maxed your builds.
You’re trying to poke holes in my argument by saying my experience doesn’t reflect that of all Eternal players, but you haven’t provided a single anecdote to back up your point. Are you playing Diablo 4 on Eternal Realm more now because of these item changes? Do you even know anyone whose experience playtime has increased since the Campfire discussion? Otherwise, your argument could just as easily be copy-pasted as a rebuttal in any discussion here. The currency to discussions on the forums here is sadly anecdotal at best. But I still value individual player experiences, so I am having these discussions to see how other Eternal Realm players are experiencing the changes. Blizzard on the other hand can connect the anecdotes to population data including mean player play time since last Campfire for Eternal Realm based players.
Just because an item is BIS for a specific build doesn’t mean it will remain BIS for a different build that may supplant it. For example, I didn’t need to refarm all the items for my Flay Barb build last season to see if I could revive it—I target farmed the Verathiel Shard, tested it as well with the new Unique affixes on Fields of Crimson, and quickly realized it was a dead end. If item powers were changed, reaching that conclusion would have taken significantly longer and would have led to even more frustration. Your all or nothing solution is baffling to me here.
What I asked for was a freeze on having to refarm the exact same item with the same affixes for the same build in the Eternal Realm. I didn’t ask this for the Seasonal Realm – why are you dragging this into the discussion? Leveling from 0-100/glyphing is only about 5-10% of the process, with over 90-95% of the collective effort going into min-maxing gear to 2-4 GAs. Without some form of item integrity, for me and other Eternal players, there’s no reason to stay in the Eternal Realm or farm to that goal.
You’re misinterpreting my words to imply I’m against adding new tiers of power, which isn’t the case. Is the current sorcerer I have able to tackle the equivalent of Pit 150 with the current item conversion? Probably not as there is an ongoing thread where PTR players are discovering that the item changes are not just about adding a new tier of power—item powers are being nerfed to the extent that builds are performing significantly worse in similar environments.
Lastly, please let us know if 1) you’ve min-maxed your items to 2+ GAs and truly understand this player experience, and 2) if you actually play on the Eternal Realm. Without any anecdotes from your own experience to support your claims, it feels like you’re just disagreeing based on arbitrary opinions about what the Eternal Server should be. Unless, of course, you have access to Blizzard’s player data to back up your disagreements.
Also, you keep dragging Seasonal Realm into this conversation. For the record, I’ve said nothing in the forums so far telling or hinting to Seasonal Players the correct way to think about or play their game.
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Maybe because eternal realm players are pretty done with their stuff not being “eternal” at all
The whole point of playing in eternal is not to have to grind and farm your char to endgame every single time when a new season comes out, otherwise it’s called “seasonal”
If i can kill tormented bosses in 5 seconds now i want to be able to kill the same tormented boss in 5 seconds next season without spending countless hours on gearing up again (Minor build changes are ok and noone is complaining about, total f ups of your whole gear are not)
That’s the whole point of playing eternal in case you didn’t get it
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Well the devs thought it was a good idea to let everybody be able to fill out there 5 paragon boards which means there will be ZERO build diversity and their is literaly zero way you can mess up placing your paragon points… everybody will now have the same 5 paragon boards filled out… the devs just ruined there game more then anybody thought was even possible
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Most of the legacy equipment problems in general come from Blizzard not doing a few things with that tag since they’re effectively dead.
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Lower the level requirement of all legacy items to 1.
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All legacy items are rolled to the max ilvl rank that can be obtained for that item type.
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All affixes are rolled to their maximum values.
Do this and legacy equipment isn’t an issue for eternal and won’t invalidate new equipment - and we know they can because they’re doing 99% of this already in some form or another with Mythics.
A bit less powerful is ok, like skills and builds are always changing, that’s normal for every game
Turning the most powerful and hard to get items in the game into plain trash is a totally different story
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While true this is what PTR is for. It’s going to take a few seasons for them to fix things, after every rework there’s always a mess of balance and bugs to clean up.
Can you really completely fill all 5? Thats fricken stupid.
As to the thread… The gear changes probably would have felt better if new gear was actually new gear. They should have made new gear. Like gear with an extra affix and a bunch of new affixes. I really dont know what else they can do to add gear other than that. Otherwise, yeah its pretty sucky to keep farming the same crap over and over.
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Yea somehow blizz managed to make an already casual para system even more casual… but now its kinda like a meme at how simple it is haha. The meme is that its so simple that there is literaly no way you can mess it up or assign the “wrong” point and there is no possible way you wont get every single node in your 5 boards
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Also, watching Rax it still looks like the game is easy af even in 540 gear. He is blasting through pits. Currently lvl 50 pit. Cleared it in minutes.
Also heard Mekuna just beat pit 100.
There’s always something to do, new builds, new variations. New glyphos and frames. New uniques. New mythics. New runes. The game doesn’t need to be reset from time to time. I’ll play less in S6 because I won’t improve all my characters again.
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I’m sorry that you lost motivation to play. I agree that perfecting an item at this stage when you know that it will last only a month before there is much better stuff available seems like a disproportionately large time sink. But S5 being only 2 months was always going to have a short time of stability and we’ve known that a stat Squamish was
I think the game post-2.0 will be better, though, and that items will be more stable and more interesting. There will still be plenty of times when they rebalance stuff or add new stuff that will make some of your items worse than the corresponding effort would warrant. Fortunately you get to use them for at least the remainder of whatever season.
I’m playing the PTR. Not sure what I’ll do after that; probably focus on theorycrafting for S6. Farming mythics or boss mats is also an option, but I’m betting I’ll find enough theorycrafting to keep me busy.
But there are really three separate questions:
- What can they do to make the game more fun going forward?
- What can they do to ease the transition when they do things to address 1?
- What can they do to make sure that people remain motivated towards the end of a season?
1 is more important than 2, which is more important than 3. I know that your solution to 2 is to just have everyone be max level with max level items, but they aren’t going to just give all eternal characters the 10 new levels (or the 100 new paragon). It wouldn’t impact seasonal for them to do it, but it would impact all the returning players.
So again, the focus needs to be on what can they do that is in the realm of a reasonable post-PTR tweak to improve this experience? My personal suggestion would be to make 750s equippable at level 50 and have the item power squish take 925->750.
Sure, but having all builds remain static and change only come in the form of new builds isn’t a good way to keep people’s interest.
But when have you had to do this before? Again, I agree that if 2.0 makes you refarm the exact same item for your build to work then it will have created busywork with no value. But I think you will be farming items with different stats.
But what happens when the same bosses don’t exist in the next season?
I really don’t think spending a couple hours to earn 10 more skill points and earn your way up the new pit ladder is some crazy burden.
Ok let me preface this by saying I’ve spent a little bit of time in the PTR. I haven’t read any further comments in this post as of the moment, so I’m just going off your previous reply to mine.
First let me say I understand where you’re coming from when you say ‘farming the same item just to increase the item power.’ It is exactly what you’re doing with these changes. If anything you’re set even further back with the addition of the new Ancestral gear in the Torment difficulties. Just leveling from 50 to 60 on the PTR I immediately found upgrades to my mediocre gear from when they copied my character.
I believe the new cap is 750 for normal gear so to speak? I could be wrong on this, as I only have a few pieces mind you. Regardless though, they are more powerful than any of my previous gear with the stat squish. Main Stat and Max Health attributes are significantly higher than the 540’s. The other affixes not so much such as +% to damage, cooldown, etc. They increased, but it wasn’t triple or even sextuple the amount like main stat and added health.
All that being said though, going into Penitent at level 50 with my old crappy gear, I was just as strong, if not stronger then I was in WT4. I’d say stronger because Blood Maiden was being one-shot or very close to it every time she spawned. Honestly it just reminded me of leveling from 1-40 before the first capstone in live.
Now the funny part is Mythics themselves didn’t change stat wise. If anything, if you have a 12/12 Mythic Unique now, it will be better then anything you can craft, aside from getting a guaranteed GA on crafting one now now that they are Ancestral items. The only difference between the 540 and 800 Mythic Uniques will be the base armor/damage/resists though. So this will hit more for those that use weapons.
For comparison a 540 Shako comes with 68 armor, but an 800 comes with 100 armor, the inherint affix, not the +armor affix that comes with it which is currently sitting at +350 armor. So 32 armor missing from a 540 to an 800 version, all other affixes are identical.
Not sure if you’ve been in the PTR yet, but just trying to paint the picture mind you. If anything though I thought I would be weaker not stronger. However I only just unlocked Torment 1 with my crappy gear on, the 540 stuff. Tier 20 Pit was just as easy as running through the Helltides on Penitent.
We’ll see how it goes from Torment 1 to 2. Not entirely sure I can keep using the same gear, but I’ll try it first then adjust accordingly.
Obviously I can’t say how this will make the Eternal players feel. We’re now out of the realm of theoreticals and into what will be happening when the patch hits. I don’t know how they would honestly fix it though.
Maybe making the items scale to 750 instead of 540? I feel 800 would be slightly too high, but again I have a different mindset. Curious on your thoughts when you have time.
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You’re lvl 50+ not in torment 1?? LOL! Are these actually the people testing things in PTR and giving feedback or is this just a joke?
You always have classy and inteligent input. My biggest problem with this is that it is EVERY season.
If Mythics get buffed, external players have to refarm because the buff does not alter earned gear.
If Mystics get nerfed, eternal players have to refarm because the Nerf DOES alter earned gear.
EVERY SEASON
Blizzard needs to figure out some stability. I do play 80% in Seasons assuming my job is not so hectic that I am working overtime. But I do want to play on Characters that I have refined. I do not want an archive of worthless former seasonal characters that ALL need to be reworked because Blizzard cannot find a balance.
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