Unintended consequences

Diablo II: Resurrected General Discussion
1

not 100% sure this is allowed but this here we go.

this threads is not to attack people. i want to put that out there right here an now.
i dont want links to people names, or posts.

this is just to show that people without all the info can ask for VERY bad things regardless of if the initial idea was good or bad

so now that that’s out of the way…
what was the “worst” suggestion you have seen in this forum that was bad not because the idea itself was bad (although that could have been bad too), but because its implementation would completely break something else the poster had no ( or limited) knowledge of.
aka an “unintended consequence”

and no im not talking about something u disagreed with… i dont want a list of bad ideas.
im talking about something that that may at first glance may sound like a bad idea or even a good idea, but the person talking has so little knowledge either on the subject in question or about some part of it

this thread is to show that no idea good or bad can be implemented without understanding how it affects other things

so i’ll start

i was talking about “loot filters” and someone suggested that this would be a balance change…( i disagree with that but thats not the point)
their idea if it was to be implemented “fairly”: was to make it so everyone was given the filter the game creator made.,

now i personally i think this is a terrible idea in its own right, but that’s not what makes it here.

what makes it here is…
the implementation of how that would work

because it would make other players client… download a file… from your computer and
run it.

now to the laymen this might sound "like “ok so what? we download files all the time” anyone with an once of networking knowledge.

you just told a computer to download a file from an unknown source… and open it.
aka…
insert opera car giveaway meme
YOU GET A VIRUS
YOU GET A VIRUS
EVERYONE GETS A VIRUS!!!

so yeah the idea isn’t here because what they suggested was terrible. ( i would ague the suggestion was a bad idea anyways but thats not why its here), it’s because it would cause a massive unintended consequence

this is to bring awareness to you cant just “ask for something” without thinking through everything that could go wrong… even if your idea would make the game better in the way its supposed to… does it “break” something else…

another example i had of a positive change ( IMO anyways) that i feel CAN’T be implemented because the unintended consequences would just be that much worse than the fix, would be the removal of immunites… do i want them removed?
YES, but would it completely break balance in the game… an even bigger yeah…

so i killed my own idea because i could not for the life if me find a way to get immunites removed without breaking more than i would be fixing.

but no matter how hard we try we dont see everyone wrong with or own things… its why youy always get someone else to proofread.

so with all that in mind… i ask again
what were some of the worst ideas u have seen… not because the ideas was necessarily bad, but because it would have an unintended consequence that would be bad.

and PLEASE be nice to each other

PS. no, i don’t think this is a good idea, i already foresee this thread going very badly…
but i want to at least try… who knows… maybe i’ll luck out and be wrong…

2

I have some other candidates. But i think this thread is also a good fit. (sry for the meta :wink: )

Many people might post the topic they dislike but “forget” to mention the unintended consquence. I fear it will quickly become a semi-toxic pile-on thread.

P.S.: If you want participation you might want to clean up the OP a bit. It is a bit hard to digest (aka long and with no clear structure). And i have already increased my text area to read everything on the full screen.

3

yeah i see that coming as well… its actually in my “PS” down at the bottom of the thread, ( i knew someone would do exactly what u just did)
but i want to at least give it a try

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4

Good point.
But i must admit, i didnt really finish your OP. It is a bit intimidating (see my p.s.)

5

Yeah, hate to be a downer, but think the potential for toxicity is very high here. At this point, the only things I would say would be possible post launch is anything Blizzard already surveyed on (as they themselves have data to back this up), and console lobbies. I’m happy enough where the current state of launch will be, and hope for more, as I expect we will be enjoying live service for a limited time.

My hope now, lies in them not going back on recent changes to try and appease the elitists.

6

is that a necessarily bad thing though? if people dont finish reading my posts do i want them to reply?

it wont make any difference, i cant for the life of me make a clear and concise message in a way that wont be misinterpreted no matter how badly try.

7

You can pretty much say all of my “ideas” I’ve posted would bring negative consequences to the game.

All I want for D2R is:

  • Bring back hell cows.
  • Add new subtle ladder incentives for placing players.
  • and MAYBE Arenas + Guild halls.

I think those three won’t cause collateral damage to the game.

8

I am not sure why you think that would happen. Game settings are server side then communicated to the client (PC or console). They are just simple flags to display or not. Nothing is ever downloaded to your PC from another player through Blizzard!

They don’t have TCP/IP anymore for D2R which would have allowed direct player to player PC connections. That was removed. There is no file transfer between PCs and no way to get information about another player such as their IP address.

If one good thing comes out of this maybe that mis conception can be cleared up?

Oh, and I did make a Security PSA thread at the end of last week everyone should read. It has account safety warnings and tips to keep it secure. It would be terrible if people fall for phishing scams or malware and then when D2R is released find out a hacker has their login stuff and gets them banned.

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9

Personal loot has numerous unintended consequences, some of which may be desirable and others possibly less so. There are several subsystems that may be affected and I am not referring only to the “economy” (which is laughable as a concept anyway.)

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10

I think a charm inventory is a change that many people do not understand the ramifications of.

I think it’s definitely one of the worst suggestions I’ve heard yet, with some of the least obvious negative consequences.

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11

People don’t understand how most functionality works, they have very little experience and everyone just wants their VOICE HEARD! When in reality this post is very accurate, in order to add a loot filter you NEED an inject program 1st, 2nd you need to edit your files to read as

ItemDisplay[(SUP OR INF) !RW cap]: Cap%CONTINUE%
ItemDisplay[(SUP OR INF) !RW xap]: War Hat%CONTINUE%
ItemDisplay[(SUP OR INF) !RW uap]: Shako%CONTINUE%
ItemDisplay[(SUP OR INF) !RW skp]: Skull Cap%CONTINUE%

etc, fully customizable to that person Filter or .INI folder… if you think for a second i’d be ok with downloading someone else’ files after all the D2 drop hack injects LOL… So many voices with words that hold 0 fruition. If you don’t understand what you’re asking for or what ASK if this implementation would be even possible without someone possibly fully hijacking your character/account 1st.

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12

this thread is possibly the worst idea i have seen because of the unintended consequences. i know its not your intent and i hope it doesn’t devolve but it’s hard to imagine it wont at some point.

13

If the idea was for Blizzard to provide an interface for a loot filter then you need neither of these things. As MissCheetah said, it would just be a simple server side display flag, e.g. an option to choose whether item labels for gold piles are displayed.

Having display flags as game options rather than personal options doesn’t seem like the best way to go to me, but people should feel free to share their ideas.

14

do you want me to post my simple display flag loot filter … do you know how many items are in this game

LOL My personal loot filters on mods have about 10k lines

The only way to implement this even server side is an inject, mods have it… you still require a user importing said chosen filter and or custom editing their own.

There rendition of Advanced character stats is gross and cluttered compared to most mods ACS menu. It’s all thrown together no brackets no colorization no nothing just ALL YOUR EXTRAS in this pile of words stacked.

15

ok if u think it has unintended consequences u need to WRITE what those are, you can just day " it has them" you need to explain them. and explain why they are worse than not implementing said idea.

because i have played with a charm inventory., and its flat out better, i have used it for 2 years, and as for as i can see the way the people who know what is it are asking for implementation of… it worst exactly how intended.

also for it to be an “unintended” consequence it has to NOT be intended. if the person suggesting it INTENDS for to to change something, even if you disagree with that change then its not “unintended”.

for example… giveing pvm 1 more GC rather than removing one from pvp WAS intended, that was a conscious choice.

removing their illusion of choice of “power vs quality of life”… that’s INTENDED.

you say " we dont understand the ramifications of doing stuff… maybe we DO understand it… we just still think its better than not having it.
that the thing… it has to be UNINTENDED.

16

The issue it’s what 2000 game worked on bnet isn’t the same way that d2r will work. While there are some similarities doesn’t mean the game itself inter workings would work in the same way, just watching interactions between stash, vendors and even refresh gamble buttons shows that. If was entirely the 2000’s game I would agree with your concern. But the current interaction? There are checksum even to sell garbage and put an item on stash. That isn’t on any file on pc, it’s on blizz servers, if you doubt about it. Stress your disk and try to do the operation, will take the same delay. You could even try put hdd for the task and check it out.

I don’t know much about what kind of filter you talking about because there are ton of threads about different ways to do that. But d2r would at max use local checksum to compare to server data, if ever does. Most likely they use id item pointer to character, stash, ground, cube or vendor. For that purpose and validates if the previous state and current state are compatible, maybe that’s why some items have unnintended behavior of having duplicated effect because didn’t changed the owner in the process. Like the trade doubling effectness of gems and certain runes.

So if you’re talking about d2 2000’s you would be right, but d2r? The game itself it’s in development and has several checksums based on your actions. Like d3 has on lvl1 character entering on t16 room. That isn’t the pc it’s how fast you receive and send information of your input, if you have lower ping wouldn’t work if you habe higher ping you generate the exception and both commands are accepted and a lvl 1 character join in the game.

Doesn’t use file, uses input stream and output stream. The file editing era ended, at least on most blizzard games after WoW.

17

Ploot, and PoE has proven this. Only instances where loot allocation is used in POE is when you do group runs with BUY-IN for example breachstones, everyone contributed equally to make the runs possible, other case is premade of friends doing maps or whatever. Other than that kind of runs everyone plays solo even though party increases QUANTITY of drops. What this would cause in d2r is that the people hosting cs/baalruns on their strong characters and giving free exp to bunch of lvl 50s would stop doing public runs because after diablo dies 7/8 of the loot is taken away by those 7 players hiding in corner not contributing to the run. Then the less fortunate players are stuck by themselves doing normal or NM for exp, call the game lame and quit. Other thing that would most likely happen is that with ploot people will see how little loot they SEE on those runs and go complain about drop rates to forums.

18

Why would they stop doing runs when they could just simply open up FFA runs as before?

19

Ok let me rephrase it, then all the casuals that want ploot would be excluded from those runs and they are stuck on leveling on NM, you think thats healthy for community? They will call the game too hard and quit.
And we are at the point where adding ploot didnt bring anything of value to the table, except for niche scenarios for a minority.

20

Why would they be excluded? They can still play FFA. Or they can open their own ploot games.
We are not asking for handouts. We are asking for a mode to play with likeminded people.
You are the one believing others cannot play without being carried.

And what makes you think that? I didnt see you test your arguments in the ploot threads. Seems to be a home-grown attitude you are bringing here.