In nutshell, how a mage becomes better at casting Hydra or another spell?
Diablo 1 - Reading tomes(On D1 Hydra is called Guardian)
Diablo 2 - Investing skill points
Diablo 3 - Finding a bigger and sharper axe and everyone learns Hydra at lv 21.
Diablo 4 - ???
A lot of games uses a system similar to Diablo 1. DarkStone and Fate are to examples. A lot of people say that ENERGY is a useless stat on D2(except for energ sorc) but MAG on D1 was useful because it was a requirement to be able to learn powerful spells from tomes and it actually increased the spell damage
On path of diablo mod for d2, having higher energy buffs not only your soul spear damage but the number of projectiles. The system of tomes is actually used in many games and some times with different names. On Sacred 1/2 (3 is trash), you loot runes and use runes similar to the spellbooks from D1 to learn new skills and advance skills.
On TES VI skyrim, you learn spells from Tomes. The main difference is that there aren’t stat requirement to learn spells. But without robes/armor enchanted to reduce the spell cost and skills at higher level, magic costs way too much mana. Other games such as Gothic 1/2 requires that you have learned the circle magic up to the level of the spell and purchased a rune. To learn circle magic, you need to find someone able and willing to teach you magical circles(Corristo only teaches you on chapter 2 if you joined old camp and Saturas, the unique guy who can teaches circle 5 on chap 4), on G3, they use a complete different magical system, but you still need to meet the requirement on ancient knowledge and find a teacher. Only Druids and Water Mages can teaches you Ice Lance for eg and to obtain Ice Explosion, you need to find a mage in a desert and do a quest for him.
IMO this system “everyone learns the spell X at the same level” but the spell never becomes stronger or weaker, nor his caster remembers me more about a CoD loadout system than a proper RPG system
For looter based games, the spellbook system is the best. The unique alteration that i would make is to make spellbooks capable of teaching high level spells and powerful spells like apocalypse on d1 - hellfire far rarer, like a “legendary” gear for a warrior.
I think that setup would work better if they had a Full Role Play server setup to run that way,.
For main stream players it may end up being to slow to get the Skills/Spells they want, or would they be not so random drops.
Even then if people dont loot book shelves that may stop you getting Skills/Spells.
They already have something that raises skills other than skill points for D4 it is called skill tomes. IIRC they are a rare drop, and using them you could in time unlock all skills and take them to max if you wanted to.
As for me though I will try making my own builds where I won’t be unlocking and maxing them all. Taking the challenge of beating the game with the skills at the level I choose to level them to.
But all that does is allocate one skill point into a skill. We don’t even know if skill comes will effect a particular skill or just be a skill point in general. But all skill tomes are essentially are a bonus skill point.
I think skill tomes work well enough for a game where you have one character but not good for a game like Diablo with several well-defined characters. Something I didn’t like about D1 was playing rogue or warrior and not having any skills that didn’t make me feel like I was playing a mage. If you remedy that problem then you have a bunch of class specific tomes dropping (which was the reason for removing droppable runes in D3). There is also the RNG aspect which I think is not great. You have RNG loot, I don’t think you need RNG skills too.
D2 skill system had problems but I prefer skill trees. I think TL2 did a really good job with the skill trees (no prerequisites no synergies, main issue is no +skills). I do think that you could add specific stuff (quests, teachers, whatever) to learn skill modifications (like what runes do)
Torchlight also did that. Skill points for the skill trees and then spell tomes which you could use four.
im a fan of a class-less system where you, through any mechanism you want, pick some skills to use and then get more proficient through use/expending earned consumables, etc.
I think a system where base skills are available for everyone to choose from (think white spell/skill purchases from a vendor) but then as you play, you earn points/mods that you can choose where to invest.
since they already talked about having linked gems (one controls how, the other what, that kinda thing), i would like to see that apply to spells/skills as well. IE you have a basic fireball spell… does fire damage, small AOE explosion when it impacts.
some mods might add just pure damage numbers, IE does +20% damage to everything. some might alter is basic abilities, IE +50% explosion radius, or something like adds burning damage over time to enemies hit.
Then something like a final mod that would allow you to change its basic nature, for instance, remove the AOE damage but ramp up the single target damage, or make the AOE cause massive knockback, or change the damage type from fire to something else.
say you can earn~10 of the first type, 2 of the second and 1 of the third per spell.
A classless system would mean you don’t create a Druid or a Sorceress or a Barbarian.
You just create a character, which can then pick up ANY skill to make any build you can come up with.
It’s got its pros and cons. Classless systems allow for a lot more freedom in making character builds, but you don’t have strong class thematics and have to balance the game around every spell being able to be used in conjunction with every spell.
I posted before about the idea of D4 Shared Skills. This would be a skill tree apart from the class one, and it would be shared between all classes.
This idea add the posibility of create more personalized builds. It would be some kind of multi-class without cross-class skills.
I like the spellbooks bcs they add an unknown factor and you can’t do the build you want from the start, you must work with what you get. And i loved the first time i played D1 not knowing which skills we could have.
I think that have a few skills that could be only unlocked with very rare books could be an interesting thing. It could be also be done giving mythic items a skill we can add to our bar.
I do remember that during Blizzcon it was mentioned that each skill would have perks at certain levels.
Since they didn’t mention whether or not they are class and skill specific I am gonna assume that they are just an average skill tome that will work for any class and any skill.
What happens with such a system is that the class is more of a race than a class. Not saying whether it is bad or good, I just don’t think it fits a Diablo game though.
I know that is a controversial opinion, but i would love to be able to play Diablo as UNDEAD. I mean, necromancer with Trang set on D2 can assume a vampire form? Yes, but is visual only. Would be cool if vampires act like vampires(ie - weak vs fire, take increased sun damage, is considered undead and subjected to holy bolt spell, etc)
D1 did something like that… well, an hybrid between both. That is why i think having a shared skill bar (apart from the class skills) and/or having items that give skills (powerful skills could be limited to mythic items) could be an interesting thing to personalize the builds and bring some of D1 back without destroy the class system.
That would be cool. They could make it a necromancer skill or one of the item skills (maybe a mythic item’s skill that allow you to transform).
Undead Transformation:
Pros: the transformed character can summon undead armies at no resource cost (the skill could have charges that regenerate with time).
Cons: stop to regen health (if it was a vampire it could increase their life steal but don’t be healed by healing skills or potions) and weak against holy skills(?)
It could be that but i would like it more if were skill specific tomes. I think it would make more sence and it would make it more interesting for the game.
How a random tome (even if it is ancient wisdom) would make you better at kicking or jumping? I think that specific tomes that teach a specific technique would have more sence. I don’t like it as much but even a class tome would have more sence, since it could be the book wrote by a master of the arts of your class and allow you to increase your general knowledge of that art.
Spellbooks worked in D1 because all 3 classes had the same system to work with. They all had access to the same spells and abilities. The class distinction just said how effective they were with them.
Nowadays classes are far more diversified and aren’t working from the same base set of spells and abilities. Each class has their own.
Here’s a challenge for you. Make just 1 topic that doesn’t mention weapon damage scaling.
You should not be able to max out every single skill… That ruins The Class IDENTITY between players. You have to make Choices, that is a part of the APRG genre
I could argue that it would fit for it being a book that raises any skill. Think of it this way that general skill tome would reflect someone training in that skill. Practicing fireball to be better at it will increase your skill at using it.
Look you don’t have to max out all skills and may not want to. There might be certain perks that you don’t want for certain builds. So in order to not get them you just don’t bother to raise the skill any higher. Think Torchlight series here, at least that is what I am told. They have perks for every five levels you raise your skill.