Shadow Set/Holy Point Shot [Consolidated PTR Feedback]

[PezRadar]

Thanks for the discussion on this - Highlighted this over to the team.

[Astig-1979]

HPS’s power ought to be on Sash of Knives. You do not put knives in a quiver but around your belt. The graphics said it all; it is arrows inside the quiver and not knives.

When equipped with shadow set, each hands ought to throw knives (ie double attack speed). Multishot attacks 50% faster with two handed weapon?

The fantasy is lost.

[CountDooku-21153]

Why does only Holy Point Shot get a buff? Krider Shot and Yang could really need one as well.

[Raziel187-1454]

I’d rather have Karlei’s Point have the buff instead of HPS. HPS is already frustratingly hard to get a good one. With the range of damage it adds to Impale, nearly impossible. Took at least 100 reforges to get an acceptable one with Lightning. Couldn’t get a good cold one to save my life. Spent I don’t know how many blood shards at Djank for mats to reforge. It’s crazy. I get it that good rolls shouldn’t be easy to get, but this is just ridiculous.

[Microcortes-1511]

Absolutely! Getting a guaranteed CHC roll on this item is now a huge necessity.

[Drakiock-1135]

@Raziel187-1454

I’d rather have Karlei’s Point have the buff instead of HPS. HPS is already frustratingly hard to get a good one. With the range of damage it adds to Impale, nearly impossible. Took at least 100 reforges to get an acceptable one with Lightning.

HPS as said before is one of the hardest quivers to roll to something usable. Perhaps applying the damage increase on Karlei’s Point instead is far simpler to implement/manage.

[Namcap-1135]

Why can’t the damage bonus be added to Chain of Shadows instead of HPS? Unless it’s not used in groups for RGK? I only play solo so not sure what setup is used, but I think this would make it much easier to implement.

[Hulk-1363]

chain of shadows isn’t used for group play, 250 - 300 on Holy Point Shot would do the trick, this would be the easiest way to buff it

[Drakiock-1135]

@Hulk-1363

chain of shadows isn’t used for group play, 250 - 300 on Holy Point Shot would do the trick, this would be the easiest way to buff it

Oh we are back to the pile on everything on the HPS, have fun rolling for everything you want then.

If not the belt, then Karlei’s Point works.

[Mersinary-11202]

@Dead-1988

Impale has no drawbacks like shotgun has. It has already cleared 150s as RGK in PTR. Buffing it to 200% or more will make it dominant as RGK and we don’t want that, we want variety

Im not saying this statement isn’t true or anything. But Impale has already been able to do Gr150 as RGK before PTR…No, I’m not saying it’s as viable as Crusader or Barb. But how viable is it now as it is now on PTR, cause Impale still isn’t clearing Gr140+ solo like other classes are able to. And what about on RG’s that spawn adds? Cause that’s seriously where Impale has the biggest trouble as an RGK.

Moreso, I’m talking as in a Seasonal character standpoint. If you gotta be p10000 to solo clear Gr140+, thats just ridiculious. Seasonal, I’d argue that “MAYBE” p4000 (without botting) is possible.

I’m p2100 and have cleared Gr122 this season. Can likely clear Gr123 (Maybe Gr124…Yea right) with a bit of effort and fishing. What’s it gonna take next season to do what Crusader and Barb is doing already?

[Mersinary-11202]

@Namcap-1135

Why can’t the damage bonus be added to Chain of Shadows instead of HPS? Unless it’s not used in groups for RGK? I only play solo so not sure what setup is used, but I think this would make it much easier to implement.

If possible, you’d rather use witching hour instead of chain of shadow as 4man RGK.

[Primate-1626]

Yes, I agree as Impale is one of the most fun builds, but I’ve stopped using it the last couple of seasons cause ww barb is just soooo much stronger.

[Vengeance-1150]

250%-300% is exactly what is needed to save s21 for DH and bring the fun back in playing one.

Many are saying this is to strong at 4000+p but we must not forget that average players hit ~1000-2000p in a season (maybe), most likely never do a 150 gr but struggle to find a group from 120gr and higher because any other RGKs are so much better.

A 300% buff will level the playing field for all paragons levels that don’t run pre-made groups and don’t have high paragon levels. Which in turn make the game more enjoyable for everyone not just the hard core.

And full disclosure I run a pre-made three person that averages 1500-2000k paragon and does 130s. We just stop running DH because we wouldn’t be doing 130s on the current build or a future build with only a 100% buff at a sub 4000 paragon level (roughly)…

[Knightmare65-1768]

Ever since the META was invented and GR’s were put in place, all us DH players wanted is to be included in the competition to be fighting for top spot on the solo leaderboards as a whole and to be included in the 4 player META. The buff is nice for the Holy Point Shot, but it falls way short of becoming the RGK and to be taken seriously in a 4 player META. This set NEEDS to be right up there with WW barb, Valor crusader, Mundinago WD, & LoD Necromancer. Even an LoD Impale build would be nice. We just want to be included into the 4 player META as either trash killer or RGK. Please fix the Impale Shadows set and Holy Point Shot to be as powerful as the other offensive builds.

[MicroRNA-1507]

I realize that the main focus is on the new DH and necromancer sets; however, I hope that the math on holy point shot are increased (mid-PTR or even post PTR). Since this is simple math, it might be best to increase the number post PTR not to mask the performance of the DH Gear set. If the game developers decide this, it might be nice to get a quick note.

[Mersinary-11202]

@Vengeance-1150

250%-300% is exactly what is needed to save s21 for DH and bring the fun back in playing one.

Many are saying this is to strong at 4000+p but we must not forget that average players hit ~1000-2000p in a season (maybe), most likely never do a 150 gr but struggle to find a group from 120gr and higher because any other RGKs are so much better.

A 300% buff will level the playing field for all paragons levels that don’t run pre-made groups and don’t have high paragon levels. Which in turn make the game more enjoyable for everyone not just the hard core.

And full disclosure I run a pre-made three person that averages 1500-2000k paragon and does 130s. We just stop running DH because we wouldn’t be doing 130s on the current build or a future build with only a 100% buff at a sub 4000 paragon level (roughly)…

I agree that a lot if not most players only avg between 1000-2000 paragon during season. But people that run more than 1 character, more specifically, players that run meta 4man groups, or even botters I guess. Are moreso capable of hitting 4000+ paragon.

Also the higher Grift’s we start pushing from the Holy Point Shot buff, the more incoming dmg we have to suffer through cause theres no dmg reduction buffs. I’ve pushed Gr122 during season at p2000-p2100. In PTR I’ve pushed up to Gr125, almost Gr126. Actually I wouldn’t even call it “Pushing”, cause I’m not fishing for maps or anything and not exactly repeatedly trying very hard to do Gr126+ cause it’s just PTR.

We’re gonna be forced back to using Aquilas in cube over Elusive Ring so we can still use CoE, thats 10% less dmg reduction off the bat. I’ve forced myself to use Aquilas (Cubed) and Elusive Ring (Equiped) to push that Gr125 cause I’m simply not able to survive. So either way, we’re gonna lose dmg reduction or the burst from CoE.

Also alot of people will resort to putting paragon points into hatred to more easily stay above 90% resource (hatred) so thats slightly less dmg and dmg reduction as well from having less main stat.

[Ronin001-11221]

@MicroRNA-1507

For DHs and game balance, I want to highlight the fact that impale damage buff to Holy Point Shot should be increased to 250%-300% from 75%-100%.

I hope this number change does not get lost in the PTR feedback that has been largely focused on the underwhelming performance of the 2 new sets.

The math and data
The top solo DH build in non-season is rapid fire (GR 142 @ paragon 11302) that is 5 GRs behind barb ww/rend. Shadow/impale is an additional 4-5 GRs behind behind rapid fire, suggesting that a buff of 9-10 GRs would be appropriate.

Agreed impale should be made competitive with sader for RGK.

They shouldn’t forget however, to then buff the other DH solo builds (Hungering Arrow, Multishot, etc) to the same level as impale.

[Was-1394]

Buffing Impale to at least 150-200 would make it viable RGK in metas and high group pushing. The question is not whether it can clear or not 150, but how long it will it take it because the longer time is the less likely DH RGKs will be included in high metas (top players are notoriously impatient:).
Getting an easier roll is also very important. I have been playing Impale for about 2 years and I am close to 5k paragon, and still do not have decent quiver:)

[Mersinary-11202]

Impale RGK still won’t be “as viable” because of RG’s that spawn adds. Trying to kill RG when adds spawn is horribly troublesome cause you either need to kill the adds, or ignore them, in which a lot of the time you’re still forced attacking adds when trying to hit RG…They simply get in the way.

[Kindran-11838]

Honestly, they should just keep the bonus as is and remove the 1st hit only requirement. Make Impale do full damage to everything it hits. Not just the first thing.