If Diablo 4 has trading and an "economy" - I won't buy it

That’s again the mindset of people don’t want to play but simply deck themselves out with endgame gear
Maybe you just want to get rid of some nice leggo you found for another class and maybe get something in return
A few runes, gems, what ever
Think more casually
Trading isn’t always cheating the game and making profit

Which is what should be prevented imo.

No, it is getting easy gear for nearly free.

Honestly don’t like “time restriction” either, but should be restricted by something… How about the “trade token” suggestion I made ?

Ofc. can’t make a trade without Trade Token, and Trade Tokens themselves cannot be traded… :thinking:

The way how these are acquired is by killing an Act boss in the campaign but each time you do it the boss becomes stronger and stronger to put some sort of limit in a more subtle way. Additionally if this feels a bit too abusable and/or repetitive could add another type of token = Token of Boss ressurect, and have the boss appear only if use the token otherwise there’s no point in “farming” it over and over again cause when once killed (unless used the token) the boss won’t be there ? :thinking:

This is quite a bit too restrictive tbh, wouldn’t go into it that much, IMO all that needs to be made sure of is that the item category is the same on both sides of trade (armor piece for armor piece, weapon for weapon, jewelry or socket for another) and levels are near one another (don’t see the need to restrict quality, perhaps a rare item with a couple highest rolls could be enough of a teaser for someone to give a legendary or set item, no biggie there) :slight_smile:

What the hell why? You are truly the end boss

:laughing:
It ruins the gear hunt. Mid-tier trading is a lot more harmful than BIS trading. At least BIS is better at keeping its value.
Hence why Blizzards idea of making the best items untradeable is a terrible solution. Would be better to make everything except the best items untradeable (not that either of those are good solutions).

Sounds like a trading fee. Can work fine. I’d definitely say it would be important that both the seller AND buyer needs to pay the token/fee however.
Only issue I see, too much risk that it will be too easy/fast to get the trade tokens/currency for the fee. A hard time restriction cant be overcome through power creep etc. (though of course, hopefully power creep doesn’t happen).
Same issue I have with a respec token vs. a hard time restriction on respecs.

But none is ruining it for you!

They are ruining it for themselves. A good game designer should not allow that.

But some people like it xD

Some people also like bots. They still shouldnt be allowed.

That’s a different thing
Trading is a legal way to play the game differently
In borderlands it’s not even a thing people are arguing about
Some people are spaming the dedicated forum section with “lf double penetrating corrosive sandhawk…” What ever because they are too lazy and theres me happy farming for at least 1 perfect piece after 6 months straight
And we coexist perfectly

Trading, indeed, makes the game more casual. Easier and faster to complete (in comparison with SoloSelfFound within this very game). I’d like to share my recent experience with ProjectDiablo2 mod (Season 3). On the one hand they increased overall drop for solo grind (inbuilt 5 ppl drop and [slightly?] increased drop chance for highest runes). Solo players were, for the most part, strongly satisfied with that (recalling their poor SSF experience in D2 vanilla). Some even said they were able to find every single item in the game during a season (~3-4 months), completing so called Holy Grail task. On the other hand… I played in a party (4-6 ppl) and we traded a lot - traded everything that could be traded. As a result we burned out pretty fast, got best equip for everyone in less than a week. Some even suggested that we should limit trading only within our group. And, I think, everyone in our party would agree in the end, that buying an item was never as cool as finding it. Something like… Ah, you bought that Griffon… okay. We had our fun with a trade though, but it didn’t last long enough, so some started offline Plugy SSF characters after. Just as I said, my 5 cents, I don’t mean anything by that, just a recent D2 shared experience. A “case” -)

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look
i usually really dont care and i only join these discussions for fun
but if i’m being honest and speak from a completely egoistic and self centered perspective, trading helps
because if we like it or not, we (hardcore grinders) aren’t a large majority
a good 50% of people buying games like this one today are impatient casuals who will complain about the game being too hard, too complicated and too frustrating for them to enjoy it in couch coop together with their 5 year old children

id MUCH rather have them have a way to bypass the grind than them complaining so much that blizzard is trying to find a compromis and causing another orange rain scenario
think about that for a minute

ofc people will still complain, they do in borderlands every day where there’s completely open trade
but if you think about that 100% statistically, every single way for them to bypass the grind is another chance for them to not get frustrated, raiding the forums and turning diablo into a completely casual leggo shower

Those people are probably also the ones who dont particularly care that they dont get BiS, as long as the gameplay itself is enjoyable.
The game also dont have to be particularly grindy, nor should you ever need BiS to complete the game.

I bet the average person playing with their 5 year old would rather have reasonable droprates and not having to bother with trading, and a toxic community.

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Now that very much depends on how it’s done. D3 before revamp where you would quite literally bash your head against the wall that was Inferno for months unless you traded doesn’t really help matters in the slightest.

Also, paragon 23 doesn’t really strike me as that.

why would i grind in a game like diablo 3?
i play games i like xD

Ok, so why spend all that time on a forum for a game you don’t like?

they are indeed complaining about drop rates because i have experienced that
i wouldnt pull this example out of my butt
they also complain about enemies being too hard, things being too expensive, skilltrees being to complicated and basically anything that makes a game more interesting for a person actually wanting to invest into the game xDD

Devs should ignore those people. Some also keep saying they want an easy mode in Souls games. So far the devs seems to be like :woman_shrugging:

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Trading is the only thing that keeps the PvPer in the game. Yes, it shortens the loothunt so does the jackpot machines that you dump one resource in the middle of the town squares. PvP needs to min max their stats and they wouldn’t stay in the game for long if their build lacks 1% stat or they can not rip through the breakpoint.

You may hate PvP, but trading is the only way to keep their attention and making this relevant. PvP system won’t have rewarding points like PvE and trying to build up “the right” build would take abit longer than the non-optimized PvE builds.
Unless we’re talking about a very unique system where you can loot fallen players, which is horrible, things won’t go your way in a completely randomized loot machine. PvP requires very precise pieces for it to be fair or don’t get overwhelmed against the odds you can face. Getting pitted against human control warriors are much different from slaughtering monsters controlled by artificial intelligence with some dirty tricks up their sleeve.

Trading player characters and non-trading player characters can easily be separated at the leaderboards if that really bothers you that someone traded their way through getting a placement. As a developer it’s easier to disable and deny any trading characters’ attempt to get into leaderboards instead of blocking off trading.
Similarly even if shortens the loothunt, trading will always welcome any player after a long break. That sustain will keep old players returning to the game for the foreseeable future.
Any model that would block off trading and doesn’t become a grindy treadmill is simply utopic and unrealistic. It has been tried many times and game ended up becoming dull with human interaction minimized with little to none replay value. That’s what developers want to maximize for their MAU interaction.

Even Diablo Immortal, a phone game with billions of target audience at the far east, has a trading system going and you’re asking if the new PC installment should block trading completely. This doesn’t really look complicated on surface but things become more complex you try to insist your views. Let developers decide the best outcome. They will want the prolonged interaction from the player and I doubt they’d want to repeat Diablo 3.