As I have posted elsewhere, having two modes, one without trading and one with, would solve this. Balanced as necessary and even have both modes playing together, but with seperate leaderboards. That would work.
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Seems to me Skelos, at one point or another, thought he was getting a Vamp Gaze and instead got a Wormskull… I mean, this is the only kind of scam I can even think of in Diablo II… where most players would leave an item unid’d because it increased the value of the item not knowing the actual stat range.
There’s one simple way to alleviate this problem in D4… an item is no longer tradable unless it’s fully identified… that way every player knows what they are getting before they hit accept.
There was no real scamming in Diablo II, just dumb excitable people getting tricked because they were too lazy to hover their mouse over an item longer than 5 seconds.
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Right. Part of the issue is when I see people say something like this, they use PoE as an example. PoE’s self-found mode has the same drop rate as trade mode, so you’re basically playing with drop rates designed for an economy…with no economy.
I’m cool with separate modes as long as they’re balanced for their intended audiences. If someone loves trading, it shouldn’t matter to them that a character flagged as self-found can find loot faster. If someone prefers self-found it shouldn’t bother them if another player “shortcuts the reward curve” by buying their gear…and honestly, it shouldn’t bother them if someone RMTs, either. While I do hope D4 has a more robust bot detection system than D3, I don’t think it’s right or fair to punish the entire playerbase over the small percent who cheat.
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He IS quite the troll. Borderline insane.
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Scammer is someone who intentionally tricks the other buyer/seller into making a trade that doesn’t result in a fair value for him.
By saying “there was no real scamming in Diablo II” you show that you are one of the following:
- Not knowing what the word “scamming” means
- Noob D2 player that never played much
- Troll that wants open trading in D4 in order to troll and scam people like in D2
Oh boy, I love these forums. The qualifications pointed at me from the trolls are so stimulating to write.
You got tricked, get over it dude, happens to the dumbest of us.
I’ve never been scammed by any one in that game… if it was an item I needed I traded junk I found that I didn’t need for said item… simple as that.
Calling me a noob in D2 then not understanding the economy yourself really speaks volumes about you…
If you’re dumb enough to get tricked then do some research first or ask someone with more knowledge… don’t engage in trading when you don’t understand the system yourself.
All I keep hearing with “no trading in D4” is “I don’t understand game economics, they didn’t teach it to me in school” … if you have the time to learn the game, it’s mechanics and what gear is BiS and which areas to farm for gear / materials then you have enough time to understand the economy… simple as that.
Back then information even online was limited and since then information has become much more widely available and with websites dedicated for specific fandoms allows for the wide spread of information.
The ways people were tricked in the past won’t work today. People are smarter and the technology is better and you can find out instantly if your item is good or not.
If you’re one of those people easily tricked back then I’m sorry for you but you’re wiser and smarter now and won’t be tricked out of a super rare item now.
I should point out to you that people don’t want to get rid of the grind.
Besides, what if you’re on the other side of that? What if you traded your materials for gear and then a new patch was introduced that invalidated your gear?
I’m against that sort of power leveling.
And you’re only seeing half of it, apparently.
What you two noobs miss is that the majority of people have no clue about the real price of something as long as they don’t become adept traders. If you now watch replays of your play time in the games involving trading you will see how many bad deals you made when you learned the game.
But making a good or bad trade is not the point of my objection against trading. I wouldn’t care whether noobs like you enjoy cheating the item progression with trading, as long as I can compete with adequate people and measure my game skill in a pure form of competition not involving a broken system like trading.
You all defending trading here are quite good example of what such system leads to. It leads to scammers which are bad at the game itself, but can look-up the price of items online and troll inexperienced traders.
I am so happy the developers can read this thread and see for themselves what the people defending trading actually are.
It’s best to igore Skelos. He’s the resident D3 troll who will post endlessly in any trading thread with the naive belief that he is going to influence the development of D4. He will bait you with all manner of ridiculous things until he gets a rise from you. And then he will say “SEE LOOK! they bad”.
People who want trading are not wanting it so they can scam people. Yet that’s what he claims. Just pure nonsense. He’s a troll.
Keep repeating this and the dream may come true man! Open trading in D4 may become a reality! YAY!
We want to avoid what we've seen in other games, including my experiences sometimes in Diablo II,” Luis continues. “Depending on how you play or what luck you have, sometimes you might be wearing head to toe gear that never dropped for you, it was all fully bartered for. - Diablo 4 - Blizzard on the Technology Behind Sanctuary, Making Your Character Unique, Trading, and PvP - AusGamers.com
Says the guy who just used two hypocritical quips in a row because he couldn’t think up a valid rebuttal to my statements.
You’re just ignorant is all. I don’t care what your moral grounds are on the subject, nice deflection though. The fact that people used items/runes as currency in Diablo II could very well carry over in to D4 and was a valid reason as to how players could use farmed mats as currency. This is why end game farming is viable… if you take no joy in it, then don’t partake.
If you want to live in a bubble, that’s fine, go nuts, but again, you’re looking at this very narrow mindedly and selfishly. Trading should make a come back in Diablo IV and materials should be viable as trading for goods and services, if you don’t like it, go play Diablo III with the bots.
Also, I’m aware that a new patch could very well invalidate some or most of the gear in the game but that’s going to be a long time from the initial release… It doesn’t mean we should invalidate the entire trading system [if they’re implemented] because a patch will kill it.
You just seem to not enjoy the idea of end game farming / trading but there’s a simple solution, you personally can opt out and let the rest of us get rich.
You are those guys that should go play D2. Open trading is not coming to D4.
Let the noobs progress because of scamming other noobs AHAHAHAH. Stop dreaming guys. Wake up. How many people are needed to tell you trading is not coming in D4, because it creates problems.
That is a good quote. I completely agree with that view.
I told you Barriga and his team have solid philosophy about D4. These are words of Luis Barriga himself.
Well, they still seem to reach the wrong conclusion however
And with all that what we will have is knobs, so we can decide which buckets get filled, and how many items we put into each bucket. The hope is that when we’re done filling and testing and iterating, players feel like they can trade a good number of items. But also, that many items they’re wearing have come from their own exploits. Their own kills. That is a core value for us.”
Sounds to me like they underestimate trading.
If you end up with 100% traded gear in the mid-game, only slowly replacing it with the BoA gear, that is not a great experience either.
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Saw a video where the lead developer of Diablo 4 said they will have trading, but they are unsure how to go about it at the moment. They are thinking of having it so there is three types of gear. Gear you can trade with anyone at any time, gear that you can only trade once, and gear that can’t be traded. To me that sounds like anything rare and under is completely trade-able with anyone, sets can only be traded once, and legendaries can’t be traded.
No, they are fully aware of such system consequences and they actually want the whales to have an advantage in order to spend more in the MTX shop. This is like masked P2W. The casual player won’t perceive it as P2W. But if they start selling mats themselves the casual player will scream “THIS IS PAY TO WIN, NO P2W IN DIABLO PLEASE!!!”. So they found the best way to shut the eyes of the casuals and offer the whales everything P2W would offer them with the only difference they’ll have to use 3rd parties.
Sad story, but 21st century story. Time is such. Money and power are kings, not proper design.
Best we should advocate for is pure competition not compromised by the whales and their actions. I will try my best to share this in many trading threads as possible to make the community aware, so more people speak against this, just as they are speaking now against paragon and years before the same guys downvoted me when I told how bad paragon was for the game. So, it takes time to educate the community. But we should never give up.
Diablo 4 has to have pure competition free of trading/botting/account sharing influence.
There should be free, unrestricted trading. End of story. It’s what most of the Diablo player-base wants.
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you can’t have ‘low hopes’, only hope.
i am playing D3, are you?
i post about D4, when i see a need to keep posters on-topic: D3