Diablo IV Announcement Discussion

Rhykker’s stream included a dev sitting with him answering questions - you might want to check that out. I believe he said 40 levels, with more coming with expansions.

Also you can play through the story, or not, as you see fit. You can start playing the story, deviate from it if you want, go back to it whenever you want. Lots of player choice on that.

I also heard 3 levels of difficulty, but not sure which stream that came from - either the D4 details one or Rhykker’s.

1 Like

Lore and Cinematic 11/10 love apocalyptic/cult pictures.

Rest:
Console game.
The idea to create rune that impact another rune is waste of slots on item and not creative at all. ITem should determine how runes work thorugh crafting or imbue…
You talk about expansions and game is ready like 10%. Looks old now, I dont feel dynamic aswell.
Skills look cheap and sorc blizzard should be called frosty rain.Simplified mechanics for console.Not impressed.Little improve on D3 nothing special.0 Theorycrafting still
So start create DV or start from essence Loot and Skill System that involve players to create awesome gameplay mechanics,builds or give them tools (modding).Not going to buy :frowning:

1 Like

Looks promising so far, thanks Blizzard. This is a great franchise/IP so it should be something that is truly a passion project.

1 Like

in the intro video that “scholar” who was searching for knowledge is that guy the same as tyreal the former archangel of sanctuary?

No, he just kind of looks like the human Tyrael, but it’s not him.

1 Like

I’d like some d4 forums . the d3 forums never were really a place for me.

for once I must say I love where you are going with art, looked at it over and over again. its not only dark and gritty and gothic but its horror . like that a lot.

skilltrees back I really hope you can build your character with consequence rather than being every build at the same time.

even though d3 was a disappointment (it was an ok game but never the classic 1 and 2 were) and DI was a huge slap in the face (I still think it should be cancelled like other projects due to not living up to bliz standards)

with this presentation I will give you the benefit of a doubt that d4 might rock :slight_smile:

2 Likes

OMG get a job. It has to be horrible to have a dad (or mom) like you.

1 Like

I want SSF.

If Leaderboards are the concern for some reason, here’s how you implement it and Hardcore. Envision D3 Leaderboards: You just have an “HC” or “SSF” visual tag (or both) on that position on the Leaderboard. Then, you also have Filtering options for HC or SSF (or both). And like Path of Exile, if someone wants to opt out of at least the SSF, they can, and then they’re just not SSF anymore. I feel like this should enter consideration now so that it is in the final product and not prohibited by other future systems (for all I know, it’s not in Diablo III already due to how Leaderboard-data is).

2 Likes

The problem with that is:
constant spamming of clan invites
asking for a duel over and over
Dancing around in the new Goldshire in your purple butterfly Magda costume
Finding exploits that effect other players, no way I’m playing HC
PVP player killers will find new ways of ganking folks, I’m sure
Chat will be a fun place based off public chat nowadays
Not exactly my way of playing a dark gothic fantasy game, WOW, sure, Diablo, I’m not liking it.
But life goes on

3 Likes

Hi!

As an initial matter, I would like to say that I love the fact that you are all leaning heavily into the dark tones of Diablo for Diablo IV. I am absolutely thrilled about that.

With regard to the gameplay, I am a little concerned. I did not have the luxury of going to BlizzCon to try the demo myself, but I watched a fair amount of what was streamed, as well as the gameplay trailer. PLEASE get someone who understands spellcasters from the Blizzard North days to work on the Diablo IV spellcaster classes. Cooldowns feel horrible and make the gameplay experience clunky. Archon was atrocious in Diablo 3 and the fact that it became the best way to play a wizard, and stayed that way, made me stop playing Diablo 3 altogether. With regard to Diablo 2, the implementation of the cooldowns on skills after Blizzard North left destroyed the gameplay experience for spellcaster characters. Having mana be the limiting factor, with mana regeneration, potions, and mana leach (though, not allowed for spellcasters in Diablo 2), to alleviate that limitation, made spellcasters feel enjoyable. I enjoy playing all sorts of different characters, but spellcasters are an archetype that I particularly enjoy.

Spamming frozen orbs, meteors, blizzards, hydras, etc. felt amazing, powerful, and enjoyable. Casting these spells and having a cooldown stop you from casting it again feels clunky, breaks the immersion experience, and it was a stupid thing to introduce to Diablo 2. The cooldowns in Diablo 3 likewise made it difficult to enjoy playing a spellcaster. There are many other ways to further alleviate mana limitations for spellcasters that have been implemented in other games through gear and/or skill choices, such as mana leach or gaining scaling amounts of mana based on damage taken from enemies.

Really long-cooldown abilities: Like Archon in Diablo 3, the Conduit skill in the Diablo IV demo appears to lock the character down into a ‘transformed’ state, making it so that the other skills that you want to cast, cannot be used. I tried pleading on the forums for the Diablo 3 dev team to change Archon to be more like Wrath of the Berserker, so that players could choose their skills to use and would not be locked into a punch and a beam on a spellcaster, but that was never changed. The new Conduit skill in the Diablo IV demo appears to functionally do the same sort of thing. You are a spellcaster with meaningful choices, but as soon as you go to use your stupid long-cooldown ability, your skills are locked down and you just dash around while a lightning damages nearby enemies. PLEASE don’t do this. It will make playing a sorceress in Diablo IV feel terrible.

I truly wish for Diablo IV to be the best game it can be and hope that it will be a game I can enjoy for many years.

7 Likes

Please Do NOT make any item bind on pickup. Do bind on equip if you have to, but I feel like everything should be able to be traded at least once. Part of the fun of D2 was hunting for the best loot like a Crown of Ages or Griffon’s Diadem to trade for high runes etc and then getting what you’re missing for your character with those runes. If you want the game to be more social, then this is the way to do it. Other than that, looking forward to D4.

3 Likes

Game looks dark, but not dark enough if you compare to D2. The Gothic dark feeling was one of the things making it so exciting and scary to play. You never knew what was around the corner.

I just hope and cross my fingers, that the combat system will not be the “Lawnmover” type as D3 has become. Sadly it already looks like it will.

With Lawnmower I mean that you kill hundreds and hundreds of mobs in one go. If you look at D2 vs. D3 or Classic WoW vs. Retail, one very big clear difference is the pace of the combat. Retail WoW and D3 is Chain pulling and killing - Endlessly. I really hope we will get actual battles out of it in D4. Played all D3 seasons in HC, I don’t remember when i stopped, but im not looking at affixes on champs anymore. It doesn’t matter. You start the lawnmower and mov em down - Nomatter the affix. It takes a lot away from the game, and from the loot you get. The exitement is not really there, compared to D2 (Or classic vs. retail) D3 had the combat pace in the beginning, but the AH was ruining things. But at least you had to fight mobs, and not just mov them.

Also hope there will be XP penalty and having to retreive your body in SC. Im normally not a fan of HC, but in D3 there is no penalty to dying in SC, so I had to switch to keep the game interesting. Even if I normally prefer SC.

As said, Sadly it looks like the combat pace will be like D3, which for me, most likely means a no-go, even if Diablo is one of the franchises I have the fondest memories of.

PvP and multiplayer is not something I personally care about, I normally find the MP community to be toxic. It’s fine to add PvP, but please don’t make balancing or other things in solo affected by PvP.

If you do decide to make it “always online” (Which I certainly hope not, was nice you could take D2 on a laptop and play, even if you had no internet) but IF you do, make sure we don’t get “Error 37” for a month after launch.

Also hope the emphasis on “You’re the hero champion master commander cheif” will be severely reduced. Again, D3 vs. D2 and Retail vs. classic. You’re constantly reminded how much of an hero you are, despite it really not feeling like that.

Golden rule to good story telling: Show, Don’t tell.

Fingers crossed

2 Likes

Embrace the darkness… Well it’s not awesome but it’s an improvement.

However, if they don’t embrace a commitment to the depth and integrity of D4’s skill, itemization, and character building systems to create impressive diversity and replayability, The. Game. Will. Suck.

Attack, defence, and life appear to be a further homogenization of content and this gives me no confidence that the core mechanics of D4 will be anything but the same dumbed down garbage D3 had.

5 Likes

Attack, defence, and life appear to be a further homogenization of content and this gives me no confidence that the core mechanics of D4 will be anything but the same dumbed down garbage D3 had.

Exactly ! Diablo without attributes, unbelievable, even Diablo 3 looks like a complexity monster.

Know, they will works, on runewords, well it can be balanced very well. Not just as Enigma was OP in D2, and some OP stuff like Grief or every mandatoy items, for builds. But now I feel confident with the way they choose, to bring this future game to us. By that, I’m not worried about the ‘‘color’’ of the game well, we wanted something out of D3, this is what they choose and I really dig it. Now for the part of items soul bound and some we can trade, I think is for avoid ‘‘Third party’’ seller. Again I don’t see in that something we can be angry with them, I’am totally fine with it. Now for me, one of some idea I’ve got, how they (or they ?) will implemented some ‘‘ladder’’ stuff, just as D2, maybe yes or not ? I would like to see some kind of items be, only in this mode or another. I don’t wanna burn down the game yet before getting my hand on it. :sunny:

As a player of d2 for 12+ years (mostly a pvp player), and as someone who thoroughly hated d3, here’s some changes/suggestions I’d like to see for d4:

If you’re gonna reintroduce runewords, actually reintroduce runewords. When i played d2 back when i was 8 or 9 years old, one of the thing that stuck with me through years of not playing actively was things such as: TalThulOrtAmn the recipe for spirit. It was a recipe that as it turns out I have never forgotten and probably never will forget and it was extremly memorable and a good system.
If you wanna introduce a new rune system (which… I obviously don’t like), then atleast not call it runewords, its disingenious and just trying to get a reaction from the diablo 2 crowd.
As it seems from the beta i’ve watched, u can use the runes in magic/rare/Unique gear, which takes away from some of the complexity of finding the perfect grey 3sox archon plate with 15ed to store your valuable jah ber runes.
It just seems like this system dumbs down runewords tbh.

It hasn’t been confirmed wether this will be relevant or not, since they only mentioned legendaries being more useful in d4, but rare items and specific magic items NEED to be relevant. In diablo 2 the community has dubbed some items as trophy items. These are specific rare (or crafted) items, that has the best possible rolls on a rare item, making them insanely strong even compared to legendary coutnerparts of the same type. And even if the rare items doesn’t have the perfect rolls on the items, there’s plenty of slots that are almost exclusively taken by simply good rare/crafted items, such as the amulet slot. The best legendary choice will generally be a maras in d2. Maras is a strong amulet indeed, but whilst strong, it’s also pretty common (1/15 unique amulets that are identified), while on the other hand you have to go through a heap of trash rare amulets to find something really good (talking many hundreds or thousand), this system is extremely good at keeping an economy going, because of just how rare these good rares can be. A few magic items are also remarkably good, relevant and rare, such as Jmod or “armor” of the whale.
With rares having randomly rolled affixes and stats it has the fortunate upside that every character feels more unique (compare it to d3 where every single class figures out which set is the best, and then every single person has the same set, with the same stats, and the same legendaries with the same stats).

Rerolling should never make it into the game. Please don’t put it into the game.

Smart loot should never make it into the game. Yes sometimes a sorcerer is gonna find loot that’s not suited for them, boohoo, go sell it if it’s good.

One of the things i really hated from diablo 3, was that the number you could reach would litterally just be displayed as 2000 billion dmg. ??? what’s the point, just have us do 2000 dmg, it’s so silly.

Screen crowding. go look at some1 playing d3 and then look at some1 playing d2. You really can’t tell wtf is going on in d3 at times, because there’s litterally sooo many trash mobs and particles filling up the screen. It’s terrible from a gameplay perspective.

Resistance mobs. Having monsters be 100% resistant to a specific element (as in d2) makes the game feel a lot harder and more complex, as there’s some monster you litterally have to flee from, because that fire sorc can’t deal with the fire resistant mob. This would also encourage players to group up with different players.

As you probably know, most of the diablo 2 community are pvp’ers nowadays, and a lot of us are extremely competitive. So if you’re gonna introduce pvp to the game please do be accomidating to it. Make it skill expressive (also again u can look at some d2 pvp videos, and realize just how skill expressive this old game was, if it isn’t reaching similar lvls of skill expression, i seriously would doubt that any d2 players are gonna be sticking around). Give us an actual competitive mode, with an mmr system, so we can grind and reach the top.

Questions for the actual team:
Are mercs gonna be available? Are they gonna be relevant Like in d2 or doodoo like in d3?

Are there gonna be any acts at all or just 1 big world?

Are we gonna have attributes back and str/dex requirement on items or a similar system?

5 Likes

Any chance that game will have support to Linux and Mac OS?

7 Likes

I wasn’t praising it or condemning it.

Weaver said you cannot play Solo. I said yes you can. That was the gist of that conversation.

If it has forced MMO elements, then I’ll have to pass. If I can enjoy the game solo, but join world event (e.g. Neverwinter), then that’s good.

If the towns and overland travel are open shared worlds, but I can enter my own instances of quest areas, then that’s good too. There are times when I miss the open world travel and adventure. I made a few good friends that way. But times are different and I like my space and time.

Skills and items need to be meaningful. If I have to go down a particular path for a capstone ability, but I never touch the skills on the way, then something’s wrong.

Grinding for perfect versions of items is fine, but getting a build-around item should be easier. RNG should be not a limiting factor in build design and diversity. I.E., RORG/RROG should not be left to RNG, as it is a critical piece to multiple competitive/casual/fun/serious builds.

Since D4 sounds like it will have at least partial MMO aspects, then class and build balance are important. Otherwise you’ll leave those players that want to group, but may not have the perfect stats or gear, out in the cold. Every build/option/class/ability/item/skill needs to be applicable or useful. No more dead-end abilities, especially in the development levels (between capstone/top-tier skill), where a player sees no measurable improvement.

There should be solid returns for choosing to be narrowly focused or generalized jack-of-many-trades. And until they get that right (assuming that’s even possible) there needs to be an option for respec’ing or changing paths, or doubling-down on a choice at the very least. And very clear descriptions of skills AND a way to test out builds.

Perhaps have an instanced area where a player can go to test an unlocked ability before committing to the change. Trial by error is a horrible way to go. People are spending time and money on this game, neither of which is unlimited. There was a time when I could max out multiple characters, with multiple builds, across multiple games. Ain’t no one got time for that now.

Don’t treat the customer like test subjects. Put in the effort and make sure your game is solid. Start small if you have to, then add more. A great quote I heard once, “Don’t give me more, give me less, and make it perfect.”

You are correct Perusoe. Sorry if it sounded like a personal attack, I imagine it did. I’m fairly frustrated over turning the game into a dark WOW!