Much like modern day WoW it still wouldn’t be dead if D4 was just another D3 or worse, it just would be some weird mutated thing that no longer resembles what it used to be.
Which was really unfortunate for people like myself who thought that TBC and WotLK were the best eras of the game, but it sounds like I might have my solution for that soon enough.
As much as I would prefer trading being there, I think it’s entirely possible to make a great game that doesn’t have it. If the D4 team can do that or not, is a bit too early to tell.
From my experience I would say that a good PvP scene was far more instrumental in D2’s success, at least back in the day.
I’d also say that character building with depth and interesting loot is also going to be highly important. Those aspects are just boring as all hell to me in Diablo 3.
Also, treading these days doesn’t require much in the way of high executive function. Everything is so automated with third party websites basically filling in for AHs if they’re not in the game.
Which may be why I just don’t care a ton if trading isn’t there. I tried PoE but the trading game is just boring to me now. There’s no thought or skill in bartering anymore with everything being so automated.
I can’t see the fun of having “bound to account item”
It’s like playing a zombie survival game without any zombies.
No trading = Less things to do
Restricted game = It’s like China
If people wants to buy, it’s their choices not yours. I just call them lazy suckers.
Do you actually want another D3, go ahead. Sooner or later D4 will die because same mistakes over and over again. I’m not only talking about trading now, but much more. . .
As long as the best way to gear your character is always to actually play the game, you know, killing monsters and demons and looting, then fine, have some trading as well. But trading shouldn’t be something that you absolutely have to do to get GG gear and spend lots of time doing, which is what happened while the AH was active.
No. Trading = pointless to have any ladder at all. Because there always will be people with 10+ other people funneling gold, resources and legendaries into them, who will be even more ahead of everyone else than you can see in D3.
Honestly, trading / auction was THE WORST feature of Diablo 3. It is completely unfulfilling getting an upgrade through trade with someone else, rather than looting it yourself from a demon.
The only trade that should ideally be allowed is like in D3 - between players who were present during the drop, for a limited time.
Sadly, because Blizzard seems bent on making D4 another “Live Service”, you’re gonna see WoW-style auction house.
Personally I’d say the worst feature added to Diablo series was the ranking ladder. It’s because of that players want to get trading removed, which worked just fine in Diablo 1 & Diablo 2 pre-ladder as well as Diablo 3 before the ladder even existed. It’s because of the ladder and ranking that 3rd party item selling sites popped up in Diablo 2. Because of the ladder, players are starting to see others as competition to fight against and not help out at all instead of comrades to play the game together.
Don’t believe me? Grim Dawn & Titan Quest both have trading and I have yet to see any 3rd party item selling sites for those games, nor do I see players there attempting to get trading banned. I’ve joined a lot of MP games and players are always willing to help out and play in a cooperative, friendly fashion. I rarely saw that in Diablo 3.
Trading can bring a community together as some people will find gear that is difficult to acquire and never use. They should be able to trade that with someone else to get gear they want and also help each other out at the same time.
Without the ladder, there would be no need to worry if 10 players start funneling resources to a specific player. There would be no reason to be all butt-hurt because someone can put in 12 hours a day into the game and get better gear than another player faster. There would be none of this “I have to do whatever I can to get ahead and avoid helping others as they might beat me” mentality.
Once Blizzard started pushing ladder so damn hard, Diablo 3 started changing from a cooperative ARPG into a competitive medieval time trial.
Not really. I personally just dislike it when I know I can just go and buy something better than has been dropping for me. It undermines the excitement about my loot if I know that the most efficient way to gear up at least partially lies through the Auction House. It’s not cool when I know that AH contains things better than whatever is dropping for me, and I also know I can afford it.
And before anyone says it, “Don’t use it” is not an argument. My resolve not to use it doesn’t diminish my feelings of playing sub-optimally and missing out on opportunities.
I’m not sure that for a solo+co-op game you actually need to “bring community together”.
Exactly. It really isn’t about what others do.
Unless you care about leaderboards of course, then that is also an issue.
Not really comparable. There is very little online game to be found in Grim Dawn. You can create whatever item you want for yourself, so the benefit of trading is not there.
But letting everyone cheat is not a great solution to limit the impact of trading tbh. At least not in the online part of the game.
As for community. Seems to me like having to play together to share loot does more for the community factor, than being able to spend 2 seconds interacting with someone through a trade window.
They have been fairly popular, but I dont think the amount of players matters that much. It isn’t like a RMT seller can only focus on one game at a time. Bots solve that issue. Afaik even small MMOs and online games tend to have RMT sellers.
There is just no market for selling anything in an game where you can get any item you want in 2 seconds. If you are willing to pay real money to get an item, you are most likely also fine with cheating to get the item for free.
I don’t see the problem with open trading. Sure there will be third party sellers trying to make money and I can buy any item I want any time, but ultimately the choice is mine and I’d rather play, kill, loot and find my own stuff. So what is the problem? Let’s have freedom and choices.
My choice is not to bot, my choice is not to cheat, my choice is not to use third party gear. My choice is to mostly run solo, in that way I do not worry about other people who are only looking for the easy way. I kill it, I get it, if you want it, work for it. Diablo is not an entitlement program.
I’d say people kinda overreact when it comes to longevity of a game and kinda draw secondary conclusions. To ensure longevity of a game it has to have 2 conditions satisfied overall
Replayability
Attractiveness to greater audience
It’s kinda vague to what are the parameters for achieving those overall are and can differ from person to person, and usually do. Here are mine “top reasons” why I’d replay a game (or care about trying to be better at it) though
Dynamic content. Keep in mind this doesn’t mean randomized sh*t all over the place though. Could mean some dungeons have elites/bosses altered for a while for special events. One thing that D3 taught us is that replayability must come into “fruition” EARLY in the game itself, NOT just a part of “late game ladder”. Under different circumstances/options the game should feel relatively new for a different build/character from lvl1 (well, make it at least lvl10 or so, but not higher than that though)
Attractiveness toward competition. That’s why I still think the devs should prioritize PvP/dynamic-progression over other stuff. IF the game ships out PvP/fast-arena-mode viable people are gonna re/play those more often than do a “run” through some act or whatever. Heck might even have coop arenas where goal is to get as much as possible crafting mats faster for ex.
Diversity increases rate of replayability also. Don’t pigeonhole classes into two vastly different archetypes (i.e. self-sustain machines and glass-cannons), make the game be viable (not ideal but still viable) for things like Melee build for Sorc/Mid-range class as well as Range-build for things like Barb or other Melee type fighter
Weekly special events might create spikes into the Attractiveness to greater audience requirement. These could differ from altered bosses, dungeons with altered mobs, runs with curses over your character, arenas with more bosses at a time
Guess here comes trading after all, probably not the highest factor. As you can see, placed trading as #5 lol. Personally think it’s OK for trading to be in the game as long as the chances to get something useful are kinda higher if playing solo. For ex. Class-only type items not be for only 1 class but usable for 2, that way the NEED for trading goes down, and probably it’s impact overall
Viable late game mechanic. Yes I know this is something that wasn’t a focal point of D2 (other than Ubers), and D3 did super terrible at. BUT, think there’s a nice way to make features that give more of a unique feeling PER CLASS for the lategame to make them feel different overall. For ex. only Barb being able to forge "lvl2" legendary jewelry into equipment, only Druid being able to use Charms, only Sorc being able to use a Library with non-equipped skills (Kanai Cube style, but for skills, not stat increase)
Speaking of “late game” features, there might be a nice trophy room where you could have things "exposed", fangs/heads/claws/teeth/artefacts that you don’t use currently from bosses and/or world boss. Those things sometimes could be equippable, very slowly regaining durability in the trophy room and not repairable, so it’s not just a “thing” that lies down for no reason but if/when want to use could do so (for a small while). Should probably not want to destroy those things though
Yes I know, got overly-descriptive at the very last one as it’s obviously a “cosmetic” of some sort but think it might increase/promote competitiveness/replayability overall
Regardless if they claimed it or not, anyone with a shred of common sense can figure out that bind on account had an impact on how many people run a bot. I’m not disregarding that it’s also for stopping hacks and dupes either.
Open trading would give another reason for people to run bots. You could not only get 10000 paragon, your bot farmed primals are now tradeable for more desirable primals making the bot user more powerful.
There are those that don’t care to get 10000 paragon, but may be more interested in bot farming gear and trading, which would result in someone using a bot that wouldn’t have otherwise.
Not to mention the item stores they can set up and make some quick cash…
