So what’s the problem then? D2 hit the sweet spot.
No, since you traded items that you found. Meaning you didn’t get anything handed to you.
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You really think the issue is that black and white? Come on dude, i know you’re better than this. Stop getting wrapped up on your own ego.
… this isn’t the definition of trading. People giving away free stuff all the time. The term you’re looking for is charity.
Come on, shadout, I know for a fact you’re some what of a reasonable person but you are really getting wrapped up in your own crap now.
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Which sweet spot? The item acquisition rate with trading or the one without?
The one with trading obviously, since that quote refers to D2.
edit. Also, should you choose not to trade you can still gear up and experience the game without it, relatively fast at that if you know where to farm. If you don’t, then you will still enjoy the journey like millions of others did.
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I mentioned it before. it isnt about people literally giving stuff away for free. It is the market crashing early on, and anything but “BiS” items being cheap. Meaning, you can get pretty good gear, without finding good gear to trade with. Just trade some easily accessible crafting mats or whatever. This is what happens in PoE.
Heck, if we really wanted a decent end-game trading system, then maybe we should turn it on its head.
Only allow Mythic item trading. 1 item for 1 item. Would have the least bad impact, and allow for meaningful trading of actual good items.
Great. What I am saying is, that amazing sweet spot item acquisition we had in D2 with trading, is what we should have without trading in D4 (and also with trading; hence two modes being required)
I’m all for two modes if the alternative is to destroy trading.
Again and like i said, you’re putting way too much importance on one aspect of the game.
Edit: lemme put it this way, you’re focusing too much on end game and not enough about the journey getting there.
If you don’t need “BIS” items to complete every difficulty like in Diablo 1 and 2. Then it doesn’t matter because all the games content is still available to you and the only difference is which how quickly you can get through.
Although, i do think there should one more difficulty just for bis builds.
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My feeling on this is the opposite, this allows me to come in and enjoy the season fairly quickly.
Due to the way items stack in D3, build diversity is fairly limited but in terms of getting the items you are seeking it’s fairly enjoyable in pace.
It might not be what you personally enjoy but I’m fairly sure there are a lot of people out there who appreciate that you can get what you need completely solo or just with a small group of friends. Probably especially relevant for console players maybe.
I’m not saying D4 should be doing exactly the same stuff here as D3 but one thing I think D3 has got right is that you don’t have to live inside the game to enjoy making a build you want. Build defining items do sometimes take some time to get but you do have a path to get to them in a reasonable amount of time.
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I suspect this is where the disconnect for most anti-traders happen. They think of D3 and how items are mandatory to complete a build and therefore can’t imagine a game where they can’t find every single item there is pronto.
Yet D2 is right there starring down at them, and none of them can claim that the journey wasn’t amazing. If they don’t lock entire builds behind items (along with attributing all power to those said items) then players will be able to enjoy them even without BiS slots.
Then the loothunt can be extended instead of having to be replaced by an abysmal infinite expgrind.
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I’m focusing on end-game, but not “BiS”, as described in my previous post, quite the opposite.
The journey to endgame is not going to matter after the first few times. It didn’t do that in D2 either.
As you might know that is what I think too.
Not endless scaling, but a meaningful difficulty that is still relevant in good gear.
If that gear takes a long time to find, fine, but no, it taking a relatively short time with trading and a relatively long time without trading is not a meaningful choice. Anyone saying people can just choose to trade or not are being dishonest imo.
That is not how things work.
This isn’t even remotely true since most players didn’t even attempt getting a 99 level character in d2 nor did they care that much the gear. Sure some hyper elitists try to say, “your item can make or break your character depending on low rolls.” But this mentality was not shared.
Outside the hyper competitive most of the diablo 2 crowd didn’t care about getting engimas or reaching 99.
They just wanted to have fun in a game they enjoy and this is one of the biggest difference between diablo 2 kids and diablo 3 kids.
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You’re right, but it wasn’t because the player base needed higher drop rates, They did it because the majority of the player base suck at the end game grind and the tools that actually increased the drop rates were garbage players at the game as well, so they didn’t know any better. Also, they did it as a feeble attempt to curb duping and selling. The only people who should have access to elite rune words are players who play at the highest level, not the clvl 80 jsp squid that was rushed and bought his runes with last season’s fools gold.
Not true at all. 99% of the player base buys their gear off botters who sell their hack-gathered gear for fool’s gold on jsp. They are not buying junk, they are buying elite gear to stay alive while they leech experience off Hammerdin bots.
Can you explain how a system completely reliant on rng and getting a lucky drop out nothing you did but simply go to a mob and kill it?
Yeah, great skill is needed when the only way archiving items is rng.
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I’m not sure I understand what you said. RNG isn’t luck based, it is work based and the kind of work required is skill based. Botters are getting 6 - 12 high runes a day off storm casters, champions and uniques just by running Chaos 24/7. This of course doesn’t include all the other elite gear that drops in a 24 hour period, which is a lot.
So… people suck because they have, i don’t know have a life… work, kids, college, things that are called responsibilities.
Rng is luck base entirely. You’re literally rolling dice and hoping it lands on that .5% to drop that item.
But, truthfully, I’m not going to actually entertain your logic after this.
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No, people suck because they can’t do the work to get past clvl 88 and even then, to get to clvl 88 they had to buy their gear off jsp. They can’t get past clvl 88 because they can’t kill anything, all they can do it follow bots, so their ability to lvl greatly declines. 6 hours a week for three months will easily get a good player to clvl 95.
RNG is not luck, it is odds that lead to inevitability, but it requires hard work. Luck is winning the lottery, where only the people who selected the number win, RNG is grinding monster kills and popping chests. Eventually, if you keep at it, you will get elite items. Or you can be a loser and buy them off the jsp botters.
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Imagine having someone tell you that they don’t want to continue a conversation but you’re so self absorbed about your own opinions you have to reply even the other person is done talking.
/inb4 someone falsy compares what I am doing with what I claiming someone else is doing. Intent and context and neither of my reasons is about getting the last word.
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Imagine being so insecure that you feel the need to make a post that is nothing more than a feeble attempt at insulting the person you disagree with.
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Personally I think they should just set the drop rates to a single player experience, and just allow trading. If kids can’t help themselves but run to trade despite being able to find the items they want in game, then they have deeper issues or are trying to be “competitive”, in which case, they already get outdone by bots or streamers who use their channels/followers to gain advantages.
If this is too much for people, then just create a self found mode that increases drop rates ten fold or w/e they require and call it a day. Make both camps happy.
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