D4 Feedback: The List

General Discussion
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Hello, just felt the need to make a collection thread of feedback that has been yet to be responded to even though there has been a lot of talk about them. Be it for or against…

My main question would be can you engage in discussion about these topics with your community please? And can you at least show that all this valuable feedback is actually being read and considered somehow? A lot of people are putting in a lot of effort into trying to help you to make your game better.

EDIT: I will add booming topics that get added later.

Offline mode and/or Single Player Mode
At Blizzcon 2019 it was stated that Diablo 4 will not receive a offline mode option and/or a single player option. You will be able to solo the whole game however, but there is no way of making a game private as of now or a ability to play without internet.

Different sizes items / Tetris Inventory
In the Quarterly update of February 2020 there was this said:

To avoid interrupting game play with pockets of inventory management, we’re not planning on bringing back different-sized items.

It seems that this topic is very polarizing whatever way it ends up swinging, there seems to be 2 camps where one camp wants full blown Tetris and the other wants the current implementation.

Skill Trees are too simple and do not offer enough choices
Many people on the forums and Youtube have stated that they think the skill tree is no where near complicated and or offers enough choices to be interesting. From your Quarterly update in February 2020 we see the following image:

https://bnetcmsus-a.akamaihd.net/cms/gallery/AC63RWTR66G61582662147884.jpg

Even though you overhauled the look of the skill tree, there do not seem to have been added more nodes or more branches to choose from. Looking at your competitors in the AR-PG genre (Wolcen, POE, Grim Dawn etc.) all offer a much more extensive skill tree. Are you guys going to expand the tree more or is this it?

Stats too simplified/absent (Strength, Dex etc.
Many people on these forums have stated that they do not like the way the stats are simplified now. Yet from your Quarterly update in February 2020 (See image)

https://bnetcmsus-a.akamaihd.net/cms/gallery/B2I91UC3N7Q31582662150361.jpg

we can see that these ‘stats’ are still the current stance you guys are working with. Any plans on changing these to more interesting stats or are you going to keep these?

Missing Item Slots (Belts, Shoulders, Gloves/Bracers)
Whats the stance on this? Many people have commented about these items not being in the character inventory screen (See above). Are these in development or removed from the game? Because of the way this has not been communicated back to us people have started to theorize that you have removed these slots from game in order to further dumb down the game.

Trading
Can you please tell us what your current stance is on trading in Diablo 4? I know that at Blizzcon 2019 it has been said that there would be some items that can’t be traded, some items that are traded freely and some items that are trade able once. Can you elaborate and clarify on this please, I’m still seeing many forum chats about this.

Party size 4
At Blizzcon 2019 it was stated that the party size is going to be 4 players. Is there any feedback on to why this decision was made and why not more/less? There seems to be a lot of confusion about this topic as to what is the reason that this is limited to 4 players only. (Especially since Diablo 2 offered 8) and this feels like a step backwards from that.

Bots / Botters and Cheaters
There are many posts on the forum asking for Ban waves and or asking for a solution against botting and cheating. Can you please elaborate on how you are going to stop botters and cheaters in Diablo 4?

Console and PC
It’s no secret from the presentation at Blizzcon 2019 and your Quarterly update in February that you are making the game to be compatible with consoles and or for them. A lot of people have voiced that they are scared that you will dumb down features too much in order to satisfy the console controls/players in a PC version of the game. Can you clarify/rest ease your community on the fact this is not happening and maybe show how you retain enough depth through simplification?

Cool downs
Can you clarify as to why you have cool downs in Diablo 4 and why would you keep this?

Classes
I know, you not gonna tell us what the last 2 classes are going to be at launch till a later unannounced date, but its apparent that there is a need for at least 3/4 classes in order to fill the ‘wishes’ of everyone in the forums. Most debated are:
Paladin, Necromancer, Amazon, Assassin. Are you going to add more classes to the game at some later point in time either through expansion packs?

Microtransactions
At Blizzcon 2019 it was said that Diablo 4 is going to have MTX. Can you please elaborate on this since there seems to be confusion on whether or not these are going to be purely cosmetic or game play related.

I’m sure i missed a couple more really big ones too… (Feel free too add and discuss below).

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These are different. All the feedback we post on these forums is collected by the CM and send to the devs. Obviously they can’t respond/comment on everything since the game is in an early stage of development. We have to wait until next Blizzcon where the majority of issues would be discussed publicly. Until then giving meaningful feedback and starting productive discussions is the best we can do to help in the development of Diablo 4.

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I rather like that the game is going to be cooldown based, at least for the melee classes. One of the biggest problems in D3 to me was that the melee classes suffered from EXTREME repetitiveness due to the fact that each melee ability (Cleave, etc.) has like 2-3 animations. I think D4 should bring back regular melee attacks, and not tie them to skills like cleave, way of the hundred fists, etc. And give each class ALOT more animations for their melee attacks. That way, you’re not going to see the same 2 canned animations infinitely, which is pretty lame and repetitive to me.

Here is a link to my post about this: Would love to have tons of melee attack animations in D4 over D3 so the game doesn't look repetitive

Even worse, some builds are overly cheesy and have zero skill and thought behind them (Barbarians spamming only Hammer of the Ancients, or using Whirlwind indefinitely). These things shouldn’t exist in Diablo, and a class shouldn’t be able to rely on just one or two abilities to kill monsters, especially melee. D4 being an action RPG, the way melee looks and feels is immensely important to me, and melee animation variety is a much needed upgrade over D3 to me :slight_smile:

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This ^^^

This forum is primarily for Diablo 3, not Diablo 4. Any feedback they give about Diablo 4 will be in the form of News Blog posts - like the one that just came out. We can expect those about every quarter.

Next, they asked that feedback related to the News Blog and your questions be put in the specific sticky thread about D4 News at the top of the forum.

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Is that so? I don’t want inventory tetris and they listened and not planning to make one in D4. Pretty evident that they listened but it just happened that they don’t listen to “your side” though.

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Lack of responses does not mean the feedback is being ignored.

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I know. Hence they are seperated by a slash.

Okay, you say that but i look at the forums see like xxxx numbers of players requesting feature x and when they do a update i see a response that’s either the opposite of that or not put through, and not addressed. This makes me think that they: Do not care about the feedback or purposely brush away feedback that does not lie in vision with their intended product or not receive/read the feedback.

Why? I get it, big features and announcements like classes should be saved for special events. But its kind of unreasonable to ask someone to wait 9 months (till Blizzcon) to get a response to a question they wrote or a piece of feedback they wrote on your forums. Engage with the community… Not just gather and send through.

This melts my mind honestly. It does not take that much effort to say: Thank you for writing your feedback, we have put it through to the devs. We don’t know yet if we can do anything with your feedback but we just wrote this back to you letting you know we are aware of this topic and are discussing internally how to deal with this. Or hell if its bad just straight up say: This is a bad idea, we are not going to do that.

Blizzard should be damn proud they have a community that is so helpful in trying to make their product better, and you can bet i will try and keep doing that in the future also. I mean look at yourself did 1740+ posts to help other Diablo 3 players out on the forum. :slight_smile:

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D3 is different story. Don’t expect to see made much of what we request for it.

Man, I am the last person on Earth not wanting daily feedback and discussions with the D4 devs. I even suggested them they make the blog posts monthly, but this is something even the devs themselves might not be able to enforce. It’s a big company with many levels of hierarchy.

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To ignore is to refuse to show that you see or hear something or to do nothing in response to those events.

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They are reading all the feedback, don’t worry. They asked themselves many times for it.

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Frankly, we haven’t even seen all the skills… We don’t need a clutter, we just need meaningful choices each with an exclusive pro and con… Having a clutter often leads to redundancy and frankly that’s not what anyone would ask for tbh

Kinda slightly torn on this but think it’s not a must-have though… It’s also easier to balance if not having the Offline mode… They surely would need to introduce some sort of DC resistance though

Good move. Frankly don’t like when the critiques goes into details to “next level” and not being able to recognize important from less important issues. This is quite frankly one of them tbh

Some “pros” think it’s good to be forced to not be able to carry everything that drops… I could see why they imagine it as a feature/resource. There are other ways (probably better even) to do Economy management within the game

  • Lesser gold drops
  • Higher repair costs
  • Identify scrolls super rare and/or expensive

Things like that. People just stick wayyy too much to what they “already know”… It’s called “Curse of knowlede” and frankly I don’t like that obstacle being a part of the feedback overall

You have not full information… Frankly I don’t like the “overall power” either but it’s I guess… whatever

The important part is that you have the “trinode” balance between Angelic, Demonic, and Ancestral… WAAAAAY WAAAY BETTER than Str/Dex/Int ever was… OR, at least looked like that with the potential it has and the choices offered rather than pigeonholling classes into a certain direction they can’t get out of…

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Oh definatly, if they did not ask specifically to post feedback (like everyone is doing) on the general section of the forum.

I took this from this post on the Diablo 3 website:
https://news.blizzard.com/en-gb/diablo4/23232022/system-design-in-diablo-iv-part-i

Note: Comments on all Diablo blog entries have been disabled. This is part of our website migration for GDPR compliance. We apologize for the inconvenience; please continue your conversation over on our General Forum!

Where does this say, write in the sticky post? The only reference i could find to that is towards the Quarterly Update from February that has just been posted a few days ago and that is for that specific update, there is overlap of feedback already posted on the general forum and in that thread about Diablo 4.

To clarify further: I would love it if we had a Diablo 4 forum or subsection where we can discuss the upcoming installment, but there isn’t one.

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In the Sticky post. Also in all the Blue comments from the day of the Blog post where they kept locking the threads.

Your issue seems to be that the Blog post does not contain information yet about topics you are interested in. Feedback about what else you want to see covered in the Blog posts for future releases would go there.

You will not get any answers to those questions you have, here on the D3 forums. The CM will simply make sure the D4 team sees it. Many of your questions are either answered already - as far as they can - or will need to wait until the game is farther along.

We would all love that, including our CM. Having it all here makes it harder to follow and does not accurately reflect player engagement numbers. The only good part about using this forum is that you need a D3 license to post so it avoids some of the spam and trolling open forums come with.

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You never played Diablo 3? I mean, if you do, then you know what is the function of “DETAILS” in that picture.

Here is some idea on how “DETAILS” does in D3.
https://i.imgur.com/NGFEfef.png

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Some people here are trying to turn the game into D2 or POE. That’s not “better”. I really hope this kind of feedback gets ignored and they make a game that is fun to play and not bloated.

And many of your items did get responded (offline mode, silly stash tetris), just not the way you personally like it.

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Firstly i want to apologize, but i feel as though we are not communicating well here: [quote=“MissCheetah-1661, post:13, topic:13323”]
In the Sticky post. Also in all the Blue comments from the day of the Blog post where they kept locking the threads.
[/quote]
I know that. I even said that just after that quote. Also i gave a example about how its misleading now and you disregarded that.

Look, why would you just assume that? I’m simply stating that is what i read on the forums and i collected some of the largest ones.

Maybe, maybe not. I get it, the CM passes along the information to the devs, i am not blaming anyone here, in fact i really like our community manager too. Many of the answers have not in fact been answered that is the exact reason people are still discussing about it and or are not content with the solution provided at the moment. (This is also feedback.)

I did play Diablo 3 and Diablo 2 and Diablo 1 etc. I’m talking about the stats (Strength, Dexterity, Intelligence and Vitality) not being there anymore and are consolidated into Attack/Defense/Life. If you look closely on the Diablo 3 screen you see ‘Damage, Toughness and Recovery.’ I consider those 3 stats to be the same as Attack, Defense, Life hence the Stat points of your actual character are missing. And this has been removed from items also. I’m pretty sure that is what all the fuss is about.

They don’t want a exact copy of Diablo 2 or POE. They would play those games if they wanted that. They are simply saying a lot of features from those games were really populair back in the day and it would be nice to see some of those features back in Diablo 4. This does not make the game bloated, unless you consider Diablo 2 bloated or POE bloated.

Can you clarify which? I will remove those.

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Who knows, maybe the stats were in the DETAILS or the stats were replaced with Angelic/Demonic things? It is pretty premature to assume that they simplified the stats when we know very little on them.

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I really doubt there is an overwhelming desire for that. But that quote kinda is the response. People who disagree should continue to voice their opinion of course, if they want to.

Now that is one of the major topics I want to hear more about too.
It looks really bad right now.

Likewise here. Well, we already know there will be a bunch of stats. So that is not really the worry imo. But we should learn more about which stats there are, and what the design philosophy is around them.
And it would be great to get responses to all the concerns people have with the three Angelic etc. stats. The current design sounds insanely problematic, even if the basic idea seems good.

Really looking forward to more about these as well.

Others have certainly voiced their opinion that cooldowns is a good thing on its own (and what matters is the implementation)

Overall, I wish they would be quicker with more information. If they actually do care about feedback, it should be extremely important to get that feedback sooner rather than later. Too much cant be changed when there is less than a year left to release.
Now is the time for feedback.

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In D3’s case, lack of responses, for a good 5 years straight, or truthful responses, does mean that our feedback wasn’t cared for, listened to or not.

F/e, "d3’s got all these problems, why did this happen, what can we do?’
Response “hey folks, look what we have in store it’s a necromancer! that’s right folks, im going to talk for like a huge page about this new add on, instead of talking about the problems with this game”.

Make sense, refresh your memory a bit?
I know i’ll never forget that necro-post day, it was like totally off topic to everything the forums were talking about for years, and by nature, is insulting to the max if like 95 percent of the forums is like help with x, help with y, d3’s got all these shallow shortcomings, and the response is “look at the necro yo!”.

It was totally a sign that we weren’t cared for for that half decade, which eventually led to the on-stage aggressive defense of D immort.

They get so wrapped up in their new add on content, or new IP nobody cares about, that they don’t TLC the game they have going on, or ask us about it, or care.

D4’s case is different, and its a fantastic first-step.
Why is this?
New people in charge.
New people who (so far) have shown they care.
Unfortunately, they haven’t been involving us from the get-go, pre-art.

F/e, they went ahead and made the art all earthy, all brown, all grey, and its a BIG deal, its super subjective, and they went ahead and rogued it, and its not turning out great.

The art style in D4 isn’t good, it looks extremely bland.
Who said “dull” is a keyword to attach to?
“medieval” is, “gothic” is, “dark” is, but so is “color involving” and “Brightness”.

F/e, D2 had bright colors, D3 had A LOT of bright colors, D4 has 0 bright colors.
In other words, D4 is dull looking, which is really bad.

Once again, they don’t get it, the whole D4 art style looks like an xbox game or PS2 game from 2005, with less colors, and more sand and dullness and greys and beige and light brown.

I think D4’s color inspiration was a garden pot, including the stone pot.
Lets make everything grey, brown, and beige, that color tone, all game long, as dull as it looks, which isn’t “dark” its dull.

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First off, as stated before, just because feedback is not addressed or changes are not made does not mean feedback is being ignored. All feedback is collected, summarized, and given to the dev team.

With that, all feedback is not equal nor useful. Much of the feedback is complaints with no reason other than I like this over this. Where reasons why feature x worked for me over feature y is better. So, once that is weeded out, the feedback pool is much smaller.

Next, devs are not obligated to make changed just because players suggest feedback, even high quality feedback. Imce again that does not mean it is being ignored. There are certain design philosophies devs have for a game that are unchangeable despite what players want.

Also, players are not entitled to changes they ask for. Too often players feel they have an absolute right to guide game development just because there is communication between players and devs. All that does is allow devs to get a feel for the room. As mentioned above, they still have a philosophy for what they want, and if feedback contradicts it they are unlikely to change.

Specific to D4, the game is not being designed for offline play, so no matter what some say, ask for, protest against, no matter how well thought out and present ted, it will not happen. Thi gs like stats, item qualities, crafting, endgame, are things they will consider. But too often, players are quick to bash devs for not listening or ignoring because they are not implementing or commenting on feedback. Players are not entitled but sure feel and act like it.