I hear you - I think any person that loves a build , you and I included, will not like our favourite builds to have less power. In saying that, there is a noticeable difference between cutting back total damage and the very skill that enables that damage to be inflicted in the first place.
Indeed, Iâve actually had plenty of experience of seeing my favorite builds being weakened or even rendered completely inert due to nerfs. One such example (and Iâm sure most within the wizard community can agree with) was when they removed critical mass from the game. So many builds including some that I had personally crafted were made useless due to such nerf. That said, Iâve always expected to see chantodo nerf ever since itâs buff in 2.6.5, the issue however was that Blizzard didnât do so immediately.
2 Likes
bard on ptr, more fury than chantodo before nerf
must nerve the bard then?
The sooner rather than later philosophy is often better in many scenarios. I do believe they must have a really smart programmer that can work out how to do a total damage nerf rather than a skill nerf. If something new is fun to play I now get the âYou gave me a toy to play with and took it awayâ comments I have seen. The way they revamped Chantodoâs and how it worked was cool. They really should have looked at the resulting damage not the skill.
The PTR boards also do not reflect the depth of the effect because I can now say with certainty that there is still a score of mine from the last PTR in the 100s. I just did a new build that would normally have registered and it does not show because my old Captain America build is still there.
The Chantodoâs advocates, in order to fully push their case, need the best Chantodo players to use the nerfed build on a CLEAN board so the developers can see the extent of the damage. I know how much now, but saying it here, any of us, does nothing. They need to see it.
EDIT:
The only thing they had to do was take the damage of VYRâs down in small increments until the balance was achieved, rather than destroying the part that made it fun.
The whole reason for the nerfs and buffs is to increase the appeal of sets you othewise wouldnât play. The only issue I see here is you and everyone else who thinks there needs to be a single best class / set.
That dog wonât hunt.
1 Like
I will have to disagree, vyr, and by extension archon, is already lacking somewhat in damage (itâs primary source of damage comes from chantodo). What should be done imo is to nerf chantodo, then buff archon, either via vyr or the archon abilities (or even runes) themselves; that way using archon with chantodo can be a optional choice rather than a mandatory one, and the archon abilities can actually pack a punch instead of being solely used for stack gaining.
3 Likes
You are obviously a FAR more serious Wizard player than I am. I see what you are saying through the depth of what you said.
I think what even mid-range players like me up to the top feel is not too different. As long as they do not take the fun out of it, there has to be a better way to scale it exponentially rather than destroying a skill that contributed to making it fun. 
EDIT: If they did most of what you suggest but worked out how to keep chantodos similar, but at the same level as other wizard weapons thatâd be great. I can do more damage with the pig sticker atm.
Did a couple 125+ on live with my non-season wizard. ~2200 paragon. With my Aether Walker variant, so a little lower than a Furnace build would probably clear.
On live:
126 - 14 min
127 - just under 15 min
128 - stayed even with timer but couldnât get far enough ahead for RG kill. Mediocre maps but some decent mob types.
On PTR with exact same gear:
120 - 10 min
122 - 12.5 min
123 - fell behind on bad map/mob type
On the surface Iâd say itâs no more than a 5 GR nerf. Probably a bit less (Squirtâs bug fix helps, thatâs a nice improvement). Seems to be similar to what Cratic reported.
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Thatâs about right. My only issue is now Chantâs is right out for speed runs. Itâs rats or nothing. And thatâs bunk.
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You guys understand based on the history of this company, these nerfs to wizard are set in stone and wont be negotiated on right? They also wont buff the archon set to compensate, so stop wasting your breath on this.
I wasnât expecting them to buff vyr this very patch. A future patch, perhaps, but not this patch.
Unfortunately this is true. Twisters never became competitive again (although channeling DMO is somewhat ok). Manald was nerfed after 1 patch and never recovered even though itâs thoroughly outclassed by almost all wizard builds. Hydra MH was a thing for a single season. Chantodo was ok for a couple of seasons with firebird, then became one of the least used sets in the game, then strong again and now ready to become automatic charsi food again (or whatever thatâs called in D3, Iâm old)
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Charsi food⌠oh man those good old memories
No disrespect to anyoneâs opinion but I think they could have left Chantodoâs, Vyrâs, and Archon alone and focused on buffing/balancing the other sets, items, skills in the game.
From what I can see there is just senseless crying for nerfs to the Wizard class. Here is why I see it that way:
Vanilla D3: Wiz can perma-freeze. When âfreeze-Wizâ shows up everyone in the party progresses. Cue the cryingâŚ
âWiz freezes everything⌠I donât want to fight frozen statues⌠its incredibly B-O-RâI-N-G !!!â
D3/RoS Release: Bye-bye Critical Mass. Bye-bye âfreeze-Wzâ. Wizard = Weak-sauce. Hello âWiz-Dogâ (aka the damage of a single unbuffed zombie-dog).
D3/RoS Wiz Buffs: New sets, new items, new buffs. Wizard is fun again after 2 years? Wizard gets new twister sword making ET worth putting on the bar and actually casting in a build. Within 1 season after Twister Sword introduction we get⌠âI hate this Wizard twister meta its B-O-R-I-N-G !!!â Hello nerfed twister sword. No more fighting in the nooks and crannies of the terrain. No more control over our actual spells we cast.
Necromancer Release: Gotta make this class strong so players see the value of buying the DLC. Necro can freeze the entire screen for 10 seconds thus creating frozen statues. FROZEN effâing STATUES! Cue the crying? Cue the nerfs? NOPE. Not a single peep from the complaint caucus. Necro left as âtheâ speed meta required class (Rat Runs) and is the strongest class in the game.
GR150 cleared with Bazooka:
Yay weâve cleared the GR cap. Rejoice right? NOPE. Cue the tears and nerd rage in the forums. âI hate this Star Pact meta⌠Wiz is OP⌠I donât want to play this meta anymore⌠NERF! NERF! NERF!â
Chantodo gets buffed:
OMG Wizard can do big damage and compete with Shadow/Impale DH and Bone Ringer Necros. Wait a damn minute. How the hell can anyone be allowed to compete with Necros at all?! So⌠happy time for diversity right? Maybe devs buff other classes as well for even more diversity right? NOPE!
Open up a fresh can of bitterness and a fresh pack of tears. Put on your best nerd rage music and log into the forums. Bring out your torches and pitch forks.
NERF THE WIZARDS!
NERF THE WIZARDS!
NERF THE WIZARDS!
Break their Chantodoâs. Poke them in the eyes. Kick 'em in the ding-ding. Wizard is not for damage they are here to serve us our beer and pretzels (LeL⌠thatâs right I said LeL not LoL).
Not only is there complaining about Archon, but they is complaining about:
- the benefits of the Vyrâs set (damage, defense, etc)
- Reverse Archon like its some new cancerous pandemic like an AIDS, Swine-Flu, Leukemia combo.
- Chantodo does actual damage versus being a set in the category of Blackthorneâs
- Wizard can Teleport every 11 seconds or all the time with a specific weapon that does not add any damage.
Barbs need love.
Monks need love.
Witch Doctorâs need love.
Crusaders need love.
Demon Hunters need love.
Wizards need love.
How about you guys request buffs to the skills, runes, sets and items in the game. Abandon your requests for nerfs.
13 Likes
Monk new set failed!. Suggestion - Templest rush boosts 10,000% Sweeping wind damage should couple with 10,000% Epiphanny Inner Fire damage. Thatâs a dream build. Everyone will play monks!!!
Yes! Please donât break my Chantos! The Intel chars are fine. Tune Barb, Sader, Monk and DH only.
2 Likes
Are you like serious in that statement or it just slipped without thinking? Necros and WDâs are fine? Like on equal levels with THE WIZARD? I want what youâre smoking haha <3
Show me a WD that does speed groups in 110-130 carrying hard or a necro that does speeds 110-130 carrying hard like the wiz does. Then letâs take a look at pushing power of WD and Necro vs wizard. Then look at the toughness of WD and Necro vs wizard.
2 Likes
ranking PTR BARBARIAN
out of season : 140 10k paragon
season : 132 1k paragon âŚlol
I have to agree with this particular response, even though I do not think wizards should have gotten toned down. They were fine as is.
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Keep in mind thatâs probably with an angel Killstreak that doesnât like the RG to even take a breath for 1 second, but yah lol itâs stupid strong.
1 Like