[Barb] H90 Focused Feedback

862 paragon SC barb

trapped/simplicity/stricken @ 49 lvl

Frenzy set w/ Aughilds shoulder/bracer

cube: Bastion/DD/RoRG

Oathkeeper/Echoing Fury

endless walk/band of might

complete gr 90 4:45

I switched to Aughilds and made the performance much smoother and fun.

paragon 866

GR 95 8:09

I’m showing the video as it happened, not trying to make me look good.

This build makes one choose, either Tough or DPS.

You can’t have both under 3k paragon.

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No I don’t think it is fun with Threatening Shout:Terrify. And you do highlight the straight issues. The skill scatters mobs as it is a AoE Fear. When you use EF it is much more focused as it only affect those you hit, and since we are utilizing a single target skill it is mostly just one. When a monster is feared it turns a 180 degree and runs away, this way you can position yourself to force it into a wall or into another group. And when there you can take advantage of Falter rune in Threatening Shout and the AoE effect of Frenzy to kill those around in a more controlled way.

And this is why there’s a difference in how you put this to use, and why I just said Terrify is a bad skill and I don’t why you want to even discuss it or try to make an argument for it. That someone theorized it should be useful in anyway is not my fault.

No I don’t but it fits it well, it has great interactions and it helps with one of the major issues the set has right now. Try it before you judge it, I get a better feeling, a better performance and a more fluid setup.
For HC I’d probably switch between Aquila’s and DD for cube slot.

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Whelp, there is a guy on HC who cleared 122 in a little over 10 min with 5850 Paragon, 130 Augs. His high mainstat was carrying him at that level though. My statement still stands…I can’t can’t clear 120 with EW/CoE :slight_smile:

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Maybe not for max push builds, but yes for me, up to 120 or so, it works great, with the extra damage reduction and extra damage to elites.
Seems more controllable and smoother gameplay…

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As many have already said, the greatest solution is to have:

  1. Enemies feared and standing in one place (no longer running).

  2. RG can be feared and takes double damage (exactly the way that Strongarm can proc 30% dibs vs RG).

Ok Free, as promised.

LoD vs H90, GR115.

H90: 3,893k sheet, 26.1k str (trapped, SS, stricken)
LoD: 4,416k sheet, 25.2k str (trapped, SS, LoD)

H90: 7min19sec
LoD: 11min57sec

H90: H90 Frenzy 2.6.8 GR115 test - YouTube
LoD: LoD Frenzy 2.6.8 GR115 test - YouTube

Sorry for the poor quality, I have to turn all the settings down to record and it still be playable. But the point is pretty clear: LoD poses no threat to H90.

So I will advocate for buffs to the supporting legendaries vs the set itself, or else the already huge disparity will continue to grow.

So finally got to test a bit tonight. Sorry no video i couldn’t get it working well but managed to clear a 110 at almost 2k paragon. Man this set is squishy. You can get one shot by almost anything. I have been playing around with giving up WoTB since its uptime is so poor. Wish they could tweak the set for some type of cooldown for it with each hit or something like I’ve seen many others suggest. And to echo the group the DR definitely needs some buffing along with the damage. As of right now I can’t see anyone playing this cause WW is stronger and its basically a single target HOTA with a little aoe.

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Well guess I’m a big fat liar…

Hardcore
GR(s) Cleared: 121 (14:39)
Main Stat: 19743
Paragon: 3303
Basic Build Info: (items + skills)
Sets: H90 6 Piece / undisputed champion
CDR: 49.24
Frenzy: 15%
Fire: 58%

Weapons: Oathkeeper / Sankis
Accessories: Endless walk, BoM, Morticks
Cube: Bastions, DD, CoE

Trapped(128) / Stricken(129) / Simplicity(115)

SKills: Frenzy/maniac, BR/BS, WC/VW, TS/demoralize, WotB/insanity, FC/MA
Passives: Juggernaut, NoS, Boon, Beserker

Strengths of the Set and Build: Pretty decent trash clearing, and great single target.

Weaknesses of the Set and Build: Still toughness

Critical Problems: Weakness to Crowd Control, and overall toughness. Frenzy stack loss. Probably the most critical problem is that you might be better off ignoring the fear bonus and that kinda defeats the whole purpose of the set.

Additional Impressions or Notes: Had to fish for this one and had to abandon many decent rifts due to proccing, but it was OK with CoE/Sankis

Video Link:
Well poop that was the correct link for some reason it cut off after 18s.

Had a good festering with speed and conduit, then A5 dungeon (one with rotating furnaces) which I mostly skipped, then high heavens with a power that I used on trash to spawn RG with about 1:10 remaining.

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Hey bud!

Were you replying to me? I have mine on Right Mouse because my brain has been conditioned (from lots of WW) to have my main attack there. If you were talking to someone else, my bad.

Me too. I just think in its current incarnation, it’s not quite working. Thematically speaking, when I think of fear and being terrified, and I blow it up to fantastical proportions, I think of being so scared I can’t move–frozen to the spot. Personally, I’d like to see the Terrify do that to elites–scare them so much they can’t move a muscle while we hack to them to bits with Frenzy!

There are other ways to fix the issue, though, and I thank you for posting your great ideas!

That’s true, but that also means that fewer enemies are susceptible to the damage bonus. If we could spread it around via Terrify, we could get more out of our Bastion’s chains.

Sometimes. This depends on map environments and mob composition, and it actually increases the value of fishing. Not a good thing IMO, but I understand your point.

Bear in mind, a lot of my post was written to be comedy. I think you raise some great points, and we absolutely have more testing to do, but I also think the consensus–which is that the Fear part of the set is broken or insubstantial–is valid, and I think it needs to be addressed in the next iteration. If mashing Terrify scattered trash but froze elites to the spot in terror, we would have an excellent reason to put the rune on our skill bar and less of a requirement on DR.

Same. I’m having success by stacking CDR, using IP on the bar, and using Parthans with a freeze roll. The mitigation is amazing.

@ Everyone posting videos: I’ll update the thread tomorrow! Thank you so much for contributing. Y’all are amazing! Keep up the great work, Barb community!

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As WotB isn’t permanent.

You need 50% CDR to synchronize WotB with your element’s CoE cycle.

This way you pop WotB right with start of your element (say, physical), get two physical cycles in one WotB duration, then miss one physical cycle while WotB is on cooldown and this cooldown ends right as your next physical cycle is about to start.

50% CDR seems to be the breakpoint. Less - and you have to lose 2 physical cycles before cooldown ends, or not even bother with synchronization.

GR(s) Cleared: 117 (video is a 115) pushing for 118
Main Stat: str, AD, chd, Chc, cdr, atkspeed
Paragon: 1343
Basic Build Info: (items + skills) echoing fury and falter, 146% area damage. using unity

Strengths of the Set and Build: love the area damage, but hate that the damage is split evenly

Weaknesses of the Set and Build: toughness and the fear proc is useless.

Critical Problems: the 2 piece fear effect.

Additional Impressions or Notes: just happy there is finally a frenzy set.

my personal frenzy guide and clear vid 115

actual clear of the vid begins at 28min 40 seconds

gr clear: 118 (10:55)

main stat: 18000

paragon: 2776

build infos: cdr 40%, 19% phys el., 30% frenzy dmg, echoing f., coe, warcry veterans warning, battle rage bloodshed, ts falter, morticks b., no additional ad, crit.-ch. + crit.-dmg prio

strengths: good single target, can clear bad maps ok

weaknesses: super squishy, relies on coe window to clear trash grps (which needs to be cleared now and then)

crit. problems: no way to get perma-berserker for halfway decent toughness, might get oneshot now and then when pushing to its limit, fear is annoying

impressions: i was procted like all the way through the rift with somehow not dying, the healing is good but the toughness is really scary sometimes ( again: needs a little more dmg and much more toughness overall)

I think 80% is a little too much while at 0 stack it’s too squishy.
My idea: 4p bonus: When at least one shout is active, gain 30% damage reduction, plus 3-4% for each Frenzy stack.
And 2p bonus: Enemies feared by you is frozen/rooted/99% slowed and you deal double damage to them.

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I have a suggestion that could do a lot for this build without changing the actual mechanics of the build. Make this set have an amulet instead of a leg slot. This will allow us to use DD and perhaps cube stone gauntlets or aquila, while the amulet slot is really not much use here. Of course we can use FoT, but this is over used, and not of specific set value here. I thought of using Ess of Johan to keep mobs, with such high attack rate; but while it works for grouping, it does little for survive.

I have in mind here the Invoker (thorns) set for crusader. Blizz made it have wrists instead of chest so aquila or heart of iron could be used (though universally people choose the former) and this would solve a few problems in the build overall, giving us an item we really need to have (DD) and taking away a slot which is of marginal use (amulet) - and maybe give the amulet some interesting effect or roll chance, like +30-45% frenzy dmg?

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Yeah, I thought it interesting to see Frenzy on right mouse. My first guess was that it was out of habbit, but I wanted to make sure that I was missing some new play style that might give me an advantage. :grin:

Just wanted to comment on a few things I missed yesterday:

Pshh, those skeletons aren’t off the hook yet, I took them home with me, they’re in my closet…

So, assuming you’ve got about 50% CDR / 60% CHC / +610% CHD, which I think is optimal for this build, whatever setup you’re using, your overall multipliers from CoE / Aughild’s / Insanity by itself are:

CoE: 2.188x
Aughild: 1.83x / 2.38x elite (assuming you don’t have elite damage elsewhere)
Just Insanity: 1.41x

CoE setup is about 20% stronger than Aughild vs trash, Aughild setup is about 9% stronger than CoE vs elites.

I can post the full numbers on this if anybody wants, but I think the major note to take away on the “CoE vs Aughild” conversation is “both are good offensively, Aughild considerably better defensively”.

Of course, if you are also factoring in the loss of either Mortick’s or Vambraces, then taking Aughild’s also means you lose either a considerable amount of toughness, precisely at the time when you are doing the most damage and can least afford to die, or some significant healing.

Better to drop CoE for RoRG and wear Aquila-- DD adds more damage than CoE.

Just wanted to quantify the max difference you’d be likely to see between Falter and Terrify, if you could get full efficiency out of the Fear bonus:

Assuming your dibs pile is 20% BR, 30% rolls on gear, 25% Berserker Rage, 20% Brawler, that’s 95%, or a 1.95x multiplier.

Falter takes you to 2.45x, a 25.6% increase.

If it worked perfectly, all the time, on all enemies, Terrify would effectively take you from 1.95x to 3.90x, a 100% increase, or a 59.2% increase over a Falter setup.

So, that’s the absolute max you could expect to see, if you found some perfect setup that let you actually get use out of the bonus all of the time.

I agree. Personally, I think the Fear bonus will be most interesting if Terrify still makes mobs run away, but the damage bonus is greatly increased. This allows Terrify to be a sort of multi-purpose tool, usable for major burst damage, for defense, and for some level of elite isolation.

Again, you can also use FC: Cold Rush / Ground Stomp to prevent the mobs from running away. As long as you Charge / Stomp first, and then hit Terrify, the mobs will stand in place, with Fear bonus active.

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Been really thinking about this 2pc bonus. How about the following as a solution?

“Double the effect of your shouts, as well as your inspiring presence and rampage passives. If you have cast a shout within the last 10 seconds, extend the duration of your rampage stacks by 10 seconds, up to a max of 60 seconds”

This would allow us to keep up rampage permanently even through the boss, my only fear is that is simply way too much power?

Thoughts?

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Or cube/wear unity.

To add to Aughild argument:

I tested Aug and Coe in 118-120s.

Aug is better defence. Cleared 118 with it. Started trying 120s. Didn’t like damage output. Switched back to CoE. Damage is better. Cleared 120.

Coe is better damage.

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Cool, thanks for the notes. Agree about Unity: almost certainly a better choice than Aquilla (don’t have to worry about resource level).

Think I’m done testing till the update. I’ve tried pretty much every variant in GR120-121 and don’t think there is too much else to learn. If something comes up that is promising I’ll give it a go. For now, gotta get back to pushing WW in season.

Closing thoughts:
-Overall toughness should probably be tweaked up
-Frenzy stacks duration needs to be increased. Way too much of a disruptive playstyle to try and keep them up while charging through the map.
-Fear mechanic is underwhelming and can be completely ignored while still posting good and maybe even better results.
-Right now the build plays very much like HotA and we were kinda promised a unique playstyle.
-If Fear is to shine in this build and elite isolation (Terrify) is the goal…the damage needs to be greatly increased to make it worthwhile.

Good luck testing Barbs!

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