Wow you gear fast then.
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Only playing for gear gets really old really fast. This season going from 1800 to 2800 gave me two upgrades. Thatâs a lot of hours with very little to show for it if paragon wasnât a thing.
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But isnât that only around 20 hours?
20 hrs with just two upgrades? So that is 10 hrs of nothing, an upgrade, and again 10 hrs of nothingâŚ
Sorry, but playing 10hrs without any reward is not a good game design (especially if you do same thing over and over again during that time)!
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Yes and no imo.
Inevitably, there comes a point where you wont get frequent gear upgrades.
Does it happen way too fast in D3? Sure. But it always will happen. It isnât a flaw to fix.
If 10 hours is too long without an upgrade, that seems like the time to stop playing that character. Which is a completely fine decision to make.
Some others, with questionable sanity, might play for thousands of hours for a chance to get that theoretical upgrade.
Actually, I donât remember the last season that lasted 3 monthsâŚ
I agree but that hasnât been uncommon with this game. Iâll go days without any kind of upgrade. I just grew used to it.
Paragon levels did fix that for casual players!
During that 10 hrs we get paragons after each and every GR cleared. So we get this feeling âyup, I just got strongerâ
And that is what we are saying⌠After 2 days there will be nothing to do, since grind for gear will become tedious chore that wonât be any fun at all!
Most players in games are casuals. And they wonât stay around for that!
Yes, but the point is that you get paragons ion between upgrades. So that means you get some progression still!
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In groups maybe, solo itâs way more than 20h for most classes.
Which is good. People should obviously not stay around longer than they want to.
Imo XP and item droprates should be significantly nerfed, so it takes longer to reach that point. But when it has been reached, yeah, for most of us, it is time to stop.
10 hours between upgrades; too long. 10 upgrades in an hour; too fast. The whole curve could be so much better balanced. Even though the end result is always the same.
It might have given some kind of sense of progression, but it does not give you any more item upgrades.
It just isnt fixable in any meaningful way.
I mean, you could make items scale endlessly, making it similar to D3 paragon. So today you get max 4000 DPS weapon, tomorrow max is 5000 DPS, and in 3 months you get 20000 DPS weapons, etc. But that would also be terrible, and not really âfixâ the perceived issue of finding better items. Being on round 1000 in a hamster wheel is not better than being on round 500. It is the same thing.
Even D3 paragon will reach a point where you wont get a lvl in 10 hours.
So forcing people to leave earlier is good in your opinion?
Then why not start at level 70 with 800 paragon and call it a day. Then we can be done with the season after character creation!
And this is a change that casual players would appreciate. Because if journey to p800 takes me not 15hrs but 90 hrs of steady progression I will feel good for all of those hrs. But as for now it will be âI fly to 800 and then I am doneâ⌠Which is bad game design if you canât give players anything meaningful after only 15-20 hrs of game play.
So? Progression is progression! I still felt good after each and every one GR. On PTR when I hit cap? Not so much!
The issue is not ânot finding better itemsâ but rather âno sense of progression at allââŚ
It could be fixed many ways, but they decided that we donât need it. It just looks like they want us to be done with the season and move on to d4 or something similar. Well, I just wonât do it. When I am done with season I am not playing d4 or immortal.
Sure⌠But that does not affect casuals, since we donât get to that lvl any way!
True, this is literally a factor 100 difference between your two scenarios.
Or like Diablo likes to express things, a 10.000% droprate difference.
Nobody forced them. But stopping to play a character after you dont have fun anymore seems very positive.
Because the game is already way way too fast.
Hence being in favor of greatly reducing XP gain.
Agreed.
My point has always been; lvl 800 paragon cap is great ( = canât get all paragon upgrades at the same time)
The speed in which you reach that cap is not.
Definitely cant agree there. Some progression design is good, some is bad. +5 strength or whatever, not so good.
Yeah. Or â2 legendary itemsâ worth of a difference 
p800 is forcing this! You canât deny that in the context I already gave you!
And, again, I am fine with reducing xp gains. But I doubt this community will take it lightly!
And I would be OK with this being a cap when XP gains is adjusted. As for now paragon cap that low is just bad idea!
Well, you just missed what I said. I didnât say it is a good system from balance perspective. I said it feels good to level up after each GR. Those are two different things!
Sure, I acknowledge that some people like that.
I have also argued in favor of keeping an endless paragon lvl system, but offer some other types of rewards from it. Which do not constantly increase player power.
Something simple as getting a bit of crafting materials, and less frequently get bigger rewards like keys for EN, Dream GRs, or some currency for gambling primal ancients etc.
Hmm, depends on what rewards are. But I would be willing to try that system this season after 800âŚ
Oh wait, but that would fly in the face of making us bored after 2-3 days so we will go to other diablo games (-;
That could be dope, and would give some incentive to grind that⌠I mean getting free primal from gambling, or getting some mats for reforges would be nice.
Youâve consistently argued that it takes at least 30 hours to get to 800 something that requires 3,196,623,480,000 XP, now suddenly getting from 1800-2800, something that requires 226,296,890,000,000 XP or about 70 times more XP takes only 20?
Youâre not being very logical.
Doing 3 min 135:s with no downtime is 23 hours 1800-2800. Iâm sure I played quite a bit more than that as you have to factor in key farming and less than 100% efficiency, so likely closer to 40 hours in total than 20.
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Sure whatever you say, im just surprised that you manage to get near primal gear within 2 days of the season start. Apparently you also reach paragon 1800 in that time too.
Man youâre ridiculous.
And you clearly canât read.
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Nah, you just love overexaggerating things.