Yeah, that’s a big part of the problem. If they’ve only seen the game when bots and dupes made runes plentiful, they don’t know what it would be like without them. The numbers to see just how rare runes are compared to everything else aren’t hard to calculate. And we had a few weeks in one ladder without runes being available when dupes and bots were temporarily shut down, where jsp had price points of 5000+ fg for a rune and 5 fg for most elite uniques unique, in a market flooded by meph farmers. And even that was kept artificially low prices because people didn’t want to spend excessively on runes only to get undercut when bots/dupes inevitably returned.
Getting runes from drops is by far the most idiotic way of playing the game and thinking that you’re going to make the runewords you want by simply finding the runes yourself is absurd. You legit have the trading system at your finger tips to trade up into the runes you want. Please play the game from level 1-85 and record all the drops you get. I promise you that the amount of things you find will be able to have you trade up to the things you want or damn near close to it. Don’t make this as if someone is farming and not getting anything useful so they have to increase it for the likes of the people that don’t understand how to trade or how to intelligently work their way up. Literally anyone can start from starch and get any item they want if they tried hard enough in this game. That’s why it’s a masterpiece. You control your own fortune.
I’m pretty sure there will be bots in D2R
The trading system of D2 was mostly botters though. You’re kind of blind if you didn’t ever see that aspect of the game. Botters supplying the vast majority of in game wealth.
It definitely was not, the trading system actually flourished before bots and the fact that only thing you can remember is when bots were around tells me you didn’t play the game enough to feel what it was like without it.
So you think all that high rune requirement runeword gear was supplied by mostly legitimate gameplay? For real?
Runes have to come from somewhere. Try wrapping your mind around the very basic concept of supply and demand. You can’t trade for runes if no supply exists. If an extremely disproportionately low supply exists of runes compared to their high demand, but a large supply of other MF’able, tradeable items exists with relatively low demand- then the value of a rune becomes astronomical.
The only reason you have been able to trade your items for runes is because those runes were duped and/or botted by people who flood the markets. When people can create arbitrary amounts of runes by cheating, you can go out and use that trading system at your fingertips and work your way up from the start and trade for an enigma. Enigmas are so cheap on nonladder I could afford 1000 of them and pass them out in-game for free. You can trade for them on jsp cheaper than the price of a bolded thread title.
A game without dupes or bots doesn’t give you that option.
Never said that and I never will, when bots became available for joe shmo down the street, yes that’s when it became flooded with insane amounts of runes. Especially with duping, but before that, the trading games were always popping and always had people wanting to trade. The game will flourish without bots because people will get lucky and the items will drop. You legit just have to PLAY the game and your items will come.
There was no ‘before duping’. Duping has existed since classic. Duping was so widespread in early LoD that 1.10 added the rust storm and dclone quest specifically to whittle down the number of dupes in the wild. Duping predates enigma, the only reason people duped runes back then at all was to stick an ohm in their CCBOQ. When you entered public trading games, you were trading for duped runes. That’s where the supply ultimately originated.
The way I see it is that if high-end runewords are so hard to get that almost no one has them well after release…THEN maybe Blizzard might do something about the drop rates. But at this point, we don’t really know what the rune economy is going to look like. People are arguing about something we don’t even have access to yet. Let’s see how hard it is to get a rune before we get all flipped out over it.
The most likely scenario that will probably play out is that we will see botters supplying the vast majority of runes and runeword base items again. The system remaining unchanged due to unwillingness to fight against botters. Look to other games as an example, the botters persist. The game was basically tuned for bot drop rates is the best way to sum it up. People are happy with their gear when botters supply them because they can’t find it themselves or even trade their friends who also don’t use bots.
Is it not possible for Blizzard to stop botting with some AI technology in 2021?
I was so naive in D2 that I didn’t even know botting was a thing, I just assumed that I was extremely unlucky. My way of getting runes for high-end runewords was to just MF enough to find something I could trade for a rune.
Drop rate is fine as it is, with the ladder stuff ungated you have years to collect what you need/want and no time will be wasted.
Not really no, because that same technology is available to the botters. Its a general problem with cybersecurity not exclusive to D2 or games in general. The more strict barriers you put up to weed out the attackers, the more you inconvenience your userbase and get false positives- but anything you use can be eventually circumvented by attackers who figure out exactly how it works and plan against it, and they have a larger pool of manpower to expend on attacking it then you do on defending each workaround. And legitimate users don’t figure out all those traps you set and set them off in error and get caught up. You put up captchas, they crowdsource captcha solving, but legit players get severely annoyed. You put in rangebans and suspicious activity detection, you sweep up legit players and ban them. That sort of problem.
No rune drop rate is fine as it is now, the rune drop rate in 1.11 was what you would call too rare.
not everyone gets a trophy
Only the botters get their trophies while they sleep soundly at night and wake up the next morning to look at an inventory full of shinies to sell on jsp.
Are you trying to get that away from people:
Its the most exciting and interesting thing they can do with their time.
Such a negative outlook on it. Only a tiny minority of players use bots and I hope with modern bnet and D2R, Blizzard wipes the floor with botters and especially dupers, but aside from those guys, just try to enjoy D2R and the thrill of hunting for prestigious items. You will feel immensely better finding or trading them yourself and you will also be more respected in the eyes of others.
Botters and dupers on the other hand live in the shadows of the D2 community, like if you turn over a rock in the garden.