would love a link to the videos for each class i can’t seem to find them all
Even without game creation limits, pindle really isn’t an efficient place for farming. Its way less mob density for farming bases/jewels/runes than cows, way less experience than chaos, and can’t drop the top elite uniques/sets. In the end you’re just farming a single lvl 86 boss pack every game creation + walk to portal + teleport to pindle, while farming level 85 areas gives you ~7x level 87-88 bosspacks and huge swarms of level 85 trashmobs. Creating games and walking to the portal isn’t an insignificant amount of time compared to teleporting around areas once you’re in them.
would u also like to have Kadala selling hr’s with gold? how about simply NO? mayby u could stop trying to ruin the game…if u like high drop rates just play D3 i think there’s enough loot for u…
You’re comparing rune drop rates to unique drop rates. The thing you fail to mention is that the top level rune words are on average far superior to even the best uniques. There are a couple exceptions like Arreat’s Face or HoZ, but these are also uber rare drops and best in slot items, that people trade HR’s for early in a ladder season. Anyway it makes sense that the high runes needed for the best rune words should be rarer because of item power. Bowazons are just lucky that WF is relatively a low demand item, for its rarity and its power in a bowazon build. It’s not a great example if you’re using it to justify lowering the drop rate of high runes.
This is also what the economy is for. If you need a Ber rune, you don’t necessarily have to find it. You just need enough wealth to be able to trade for one. That’s the beauty of battle net, and thousands of people farming simultaneously. Sure it’ll take one person 317 cow runs to find a high rune, but when D2R launches, there will probably be more than 317 Hell cow games going on at any given moment on day 2. They will be around if you really need them. You just need to spend time farming yourself so you can trade for what you haven’t found yourself.
One of the really unique and awesome things about Diablo 2 is that there are literally some items that you may never see drop, no matter how much you play. And that is totally okay. And whenever you do see a high rarity item, it is a big moment. What this extreme rarity does is create a really interesting economy and a game world that always has something for you to do. That’s one of the reasons D2 has stood the test of time. You can’t 100% the game in a month, like you can with most modern games. It’s better this way.
I think the point with HRs that you are missing is that they make the best gear in the game. So the moment you make them 5 to 10 times more common you make all the other gear totally worthless.
That windforce, which being rare and a great drop for a bowazon becomes rubbish because now they just want to make a faith bow which is really easy because you’ve increased HRs for it to drop.
You don’t need any HR runewords to “beat” this game and now with the change to ladder only stuff being available on non ladder means that you can actually do the full spectrum of gear progression.
Where you start of with anything you can find, upgrade to magic/rare, replace with uniques/sets as needed and then farm to your hearts content for runes to complete your character as you dreamed.
If you can get everything really easily then the game “ends” so much sooner. D2 is very much about the long haul MF grind.
there’s 2 things in the game that i’am concerned with.
only 2 things because both would influence my gametime greatly, i’am neutral towards anything else. (considering all the rest doesn’t impact me that much solo )
- The first thing is , i’am actively advocating for more character slot (and eventually some storage space to avoid making mules) to me 20 character slot seems like way too few , especially compared to OG diablo where we could make multiple account for free.
20 is really nothing considering the game modes and how many playstyle there is (hc , pvp etc…) and how many builds there is in the game and the current storage don’t even allow us to do the best achievement in the game : SSF Holy grail.
- the second thing i’am actively on about is…something i’am against , any kind of increased drop rate (be it from /players commands or increased overall drop rate from any kind of reasons or easier difficulty making the drop easier to get)
that would also , as a self looter , reduce drastically my playtime / the game longevity for me , things SHOULD be hard to get and long to get , otherwise why would we even farm in the first place ? if i were able to complete the holy grail and have every runewords in a few months , i wouldn’t feel like playing more than that either while i personally want to play it for years.
Also ,to add to it , it doesn’t concern me much but it would greatly overload the market with hr , even more than it is currently the case with bots in a few months even without bots and god forbid if there’s bot to top it all of xD
hence why , i personally don’t agree with increasing the drop rate of runes.
I do hope people reading my message would understand why i’am therefor against it , of course it is merely my opinion based on my way of playing. My opinion doesn’t weight more than anyone’s else. But i wanted to say it 
i’am only For one thing and against one thing , for the rest i won’t be active much aside from giving my opinion and that’s pretty much all.
but this topic does touch the one thing i’am against.
from what I understand the Highest the hellforge can drop is Gul and that holds Very little value. This Method you describe wont get you rich just abunch of toons &&&& I’m pretty sure the Fixed Glitch rush especially if they’re fixing abunch of other glitches…
Three cheers for humility.
But I have to say, on the contrary – I think that an opinion holds a lot of weight when one can give a good explanation for why Diablo 2 works, and does not need to be changed. Diablo 2 has proven itself and stood the test of time, and understanding why that is, is very important. Not everyone understands why though, because it’s a very complex game.
An opinion that advocates for changes in D2R’s case, debatably holds less weight and requires far more justification, because these are just unproven hypotheses or ideas. Maybe a given idea worked in another game, but it is unproven in Diablo 2 complex web of systems.
I know this is an inequitable philosophy, but inequalities are not actually problems in and of themselves.
Oh no they are not, you guys who demand constant change need to understand that some things are rare by the definition of the word, as in, hard to find. If you are a casual, be a casual, just play casually, stop demanding radical changes that would allow you to jump in to a game once every two weeks and find a host of HR’s after 15 mins then log out again, if you are a casual, play casually.
Why would you comment if you don’t fully understand D2 runes? Because Hellforge can drop 3 great runes: Mal (used in grief), Ist (duh) and Gul. Gul is very valuable because its half of a Vex rune. The rest of the HRs have insanely low drop rates that are only going to be found randomly while MFing for other things. They also create the most powerful gear in the game, so they SHOULD be extremely hard to get no matter what.
If you want a casual game, skip diablo 2, it is not for you. Items come with effort here and that is what makes this game be as good as it is.
No to your requests to increase drop rates. You can now farm runes and make ladder runewords on non ladder. You have an eternity of non ladder D2R to find them all and build any runeword you want. That’s enough of a shift. Let’s just stop.
I feel like I should go back and address just how incredibly wrong this is. I already stated how long it takes to get runes with the fastest method, cows. But let me compare grinding hellforges.
Each hellforge quest gives a random rune from Hel to Gul with equal droprates, 1:11 each. That’s an expected value of 0.179 Gul runes per hellforge, but taking an absurd and impractical amount of gems. You get 0.176 Guls per hellforge by just throwing away anything lower than a Pul. So lets say 0.176. Now it takes 32 Guls to make one Ber, and 64 to make one Jah. That means it takes ~182/364 Hellforges to create one Ber/Jah respectively. What’s the fastest way to farm Hellforges? Classic rushing. With maphack and exceptional game knowledge you can get as fast as 20 minute runs to A4 hell at best , but each leecher either has to be a bot or another human who’s gametime counts towards man-hours, or the exceptionally slow method of multi-client rushing with 8 cdkeys and tabs and sandboxes. Without bots, with the fastest rusher ever (who is coincidentally, me), maybe you average 30 minutes to rush 7 leechers to A4 hell. Then you need to actually clear hellforges after converting to expansion. Maybe you optimize and do that in 10 minutes including downtimes by having players do each other’s hellforges in pairs with prebuilt hammerdins, then switch roles- unlike the lone crusher and 7 leechers, it would be 1:1. Well lets say that’s 40 minutes per cycle to make 7 hellforges, using 8 people. That’s about 45.7 man-minutes of labor per hellforge. About 139 man-hours of work for a Ber, about 277 man-hours of work for a Jah. Your team might make a Ber every 17 hours of work combined, but split that across 8 people.
In other words, again, impossibly prohibitive and extremely unrewarding. Making a single javazons enigma + infinity would take 694 man-hours of labor, which is absolutely out of step with drop rates for other items and amount of time people invest in games. I don’t think people appreciate just how much gametime 694 hours would be. Most single player epic AAA games get 40 hours of gameplay, and that’s people playing it over a week or two. There are games I’ve played to death and know every facet about, that I’ve got less than 694 hours sunk into. And that would outfit ONE character in a profile. If you were paying people $15/hr to farm for you, that’s over $10,000 to make a single enigma + infinity.
Yes. Wants, but not gets. Infinity should be a dream, but not an item available to everyone.
Runedrop should not be increased, but decreased back to 1.11.
It has begun. The amount of people begging for drop rates increasing are going to be insane. Everyone wants everything handed to them like in Diablo 3. In Diablo 2 there are going to be DAYS of mfing where you find absolutely nothing. There will also be days where you find 5x uniques in a single night. It’s called RNG. Every ladder season I’ve played or anytime I’ve picked up a new character and legit just played the game through I was always able to find good stuff. If you do Andy/pit/trav/chaos/Diablo/Baal. I promise you will find more items and runes. I found a ber rune from chaos, online so p1 private game with a walking hammerdin and then two days later I found a jah rune from trav. Just play the game and the drops will come.
Yep and what is more, if the habitual demanders just embraced this, they would see how rewarding it feels to finally get something you have wanted for one of your chars for ages. What they want, is everything handed to them on a plate, stored in their stash (which they demand be made to infinite size with gem/rune stacking), and if they feel like playing for 15mins at the week end, they can pull out a breath of the dying, then put D2R down for a month, then come back and try a nice Infinity, then put the game down again, that is what they want, dulled down casuality.
And that RNG is subject to drop rates. Which can be calculated and compared. We can see the exact droprates for any item from any mob or boss. And when you compare those droprates, the droprates for runes is incredibly imbalanced next to all the other comparable elite uniques and top-end gear. That’s the point. Even if runes were 10x more common, you’d have days of farming without seeing a single rune. Between the old drop rates and the time since the new ones in 1.13, people played years of diablo II without seeing a high rune drop. Because the droprates were, and still are, astronomical. When you’re farming mobs that have a 1 in 730,549 chance to drop a Ber, then your odds are on par with lottery tickets.
The droprates for every other item in the game are so much higher than trading communities have no problem finding and trading enough copies of each elite unique and set and jewel and charm that average players with average MFing or services can afford to outfit their characters within the first week or two of ladder with all the best-in-slot non-rune gear they want. That’s the result of a healthy economy doing its thing. But without duping or 24/7 clientless bots, runes have absurd prices and extremely limited supply
For most of Diablo II’s lifespan, we’ve had those attainable runes. Thanks to dupers. Thanks to botters. And that is a crutch that shouldn’t exist to prop up an economy. That’s a horrible way for a game to be set up. And if the dupers and botters can be suppressed in D2r, we’re going to be confronted with what we saw in that one ladder a few years ago when Blizzard did some silent anti-hack patches on serverside and stopped the dupes and bots for a few weeks- people trading a high rune for the same price as 1000+ shakos
But but we work 40 hours a week and mf wife only lets me play 45 mins a day and 2 hours on the weekends. How am I ever going to compete with the no lifers. Wahhhhh it’s not fair please blizzard I need everything to drop with no amount of effort.
Most people truly do not even understand the rarity due to bots farming these items and supplying the player base for years. As I stated in an earlier post people are used to the rune system with botters creating the supply. It’s a very fun system with the drawback of a bot foundation in order for people to even utilize it.
I think if you were to eliminate all bots completely the rates would need to be increased as you stated, but how much for players to feel rewarded I don’t know. In all my playtime I’ve found one Jah. Several seasons of gameplay and only one Jah worth of enigma is kind of funny. It’s good that you are showing the odds to give people more perspective on the topic though.
Lol yes exactly, that assuredly goes through their minds. The thing is though, and I would have thought that they would have understood this from the beta - but they don’t need uber-prestigious equipment to enjoy or even succeed in D2R.