Ptr version 2 early feedback

General Discussion
1

Hi,

Barb:
I loved the changes on barb. Attack rating was always needed. But the best change was the one you did concerning quanti on throwing :slight_smile: i have been asking for such function for a while and glad you implemented this for the new ptr.

Amazon bow skills:
Physical amazon was always the best bowamazon for both pvp and pvm.
With the recent change to fhr and not beeing dodge/avoid/evade stuck anymore made bowamazon inzanely strong, now by adding this ammount of syntenergies for the physical bow skills such as ga, strafe and multi she will be very op for pvp… Inzanly op…

Plague:
I like that you went back to long duration on plague javelins.

Druid:
Armageddon:
I love change where armageddon is no longer have a prereqesite from hurricane.
The skill itself May be a little underperforming still.

Summoning:
Allowing all summons at once on druid is a huge nice add for pvm, but for pvp people look upon this as Inzanly op meatshield for druid. I believe with such a change there need to be made self made gm pvp rules to only allow one type of wolves/grizzly. In combi with oak/how and raven. (there has always been gm rules who dont allow nec to use other summons than golem and (oak from charges))

Now the attack speed of shapers:
Ill start with the easy part, the werebear:
The werebear has been nerfed into a max 6 or 7 fpa attack. Thats 25/6 = 4,16 attacks pr second instead of the 4 frame 6,25 attacks pr second it could get before.
Adding 7% ed in werebear skill, and 3% skill ias on maul will not help nowhere close to same dps. Especially as fireclaw build. I do however agree that you now can use hard hitting wepons as forexample grief pb + Phoenix shield as an example.
But to gain 6fpa attack with polearm, and 7fpa with swords with this require a lot.
In pvp we are by self made gm rules not allowed to use merc. And maul is useless for pvp since we never have time to charge up the skill in pvp. So we are at 0 skill ias(exception is if we use beast or faith).

Example grief:
Ceiling(19x256/floor(256x(100+EIAS)/100))-1

You need 138 eias to reach 7 frames with a grief pb. 150eias will also only give 7frames.

Ceiling(19x256/floor(256x(100+138)/100))-1
= 7

Ias needed to reach 138 eias:
Skill ias: 0
Wsm: -30
Eias breakpoint: 138
Ceiling(120x(EIAS- SIAS + WSM)/(120-(EIAS - SIAS +WSM)))

Ceiling(120x(138- 0 + -30)/(120-(138 - 0+ -30))) = 1080 ias needed!!!

So, even a fast base like pb will never reach any ias.

Another way of showing this:
EIAS = ceiling(120xias/(120+ias)+skillIas-wsm
EIAS = ceiling(120x1080/(120+1080)+0-(-30) = 138

So… For a werebear u have made it inzanely slow… No1 is getting remotely close to hit that breakpoint unless you already hitted it 16 times with maul already xD

The formula for paw attacks should now be same for both werewolf and werebear now that you only use druid human form framesPerDirection. The difference is that werewolf will get skill ias for free, which means he will very easy hit max ias breakpoint.

And fury, this patchnote about the 40% faster between attacks is wierd…

Now immagine a werewolf using a eth tombreaver.
Druid frames pr direction with such wep is 17.
The wsm of such wep is +10
You can have up to 100ias including sockets with it since u need to fit a zod, but Ideally 90ias can have 80% more ed in wep.

A typical SkillIas from werewolf on a fully decked build is 75.

The last EIAS break on the wepon type “staf” is for paw attack for both wolf and bear should then be:
143 eias.

Wolf with setup explained above:
Ias needed= 120x(143- 75 + 10)/(120-(143 - 75+ 10))) = 187 ias needed.

This is pretty reachable.
100 in eth tomb’shaelshael’
+
Hl
+
Loh
+
Nosferatus or goldwrap
+
3 x 15ias jools in helm, or a treachury armor.
Not an ideal pvp setup though…

Wepons like eth breath of the dying giant tresher(-10) wsm May benefit way more than a eth tombreaver now that ias is not locked to wepon slot.

Now comes the thing that is not good enough explained in patch notes:
Fury:
“40% faster attack speed between attacks”

So im guessing:
Ceiling((FramesPrDirection+1)/2x256/floor(256x(100+EIAS)/100)) is not changed. But do you just add in a 0,6 multiplier here?

Ceiling((FramesPrDirection+1)/2x256/floor(256x(100+EIAS)/100)*0,6)

Cause then we are on the fast attack breaks talking easely obtainable 2 fpa attacks.

Can you please elaborate better how this is done now? Cause the new ptr dont seem to be up and running for test…

Conclution:
Werewolf seems same as before attackspeed, maby faster if really invest into it.

Werebear nerfed into the ground. I get what u want with the heavy hitter, however 7% more ed via skill contra loosing 3-4 frames attackspeed is a huge nerf…

2 Likes
2

I am very curious as in how easy are we talking about on obtaining 2f fury attacks? Would you mind punched in some numbers to showcase? Like…maybe a non eth tomb reaver, ribcracker, doom great poleaxe?

Thanks

sorry I am just bad in math so I get dizzy looking at those formulas

3

I can give you that after blizzard confirms how fury is done on the new ptr as the “40% faster between attacks” on fury is to vague for us to know exactly what they mean.

Im not 100% sure if what i think they did to fury is correct. And im not able to test it now either.

I also see a plausible scenario where they just use the paw attack fpa and multiply with 0,6.

Or that they take 40% faster rollback of animation, but i though this was already at 100% rollback only using the action frame… But i dno for certain yet. Which is why i hope blizzard explain this a little better.

1 Like
4

I highly doubt they would ever explained it in detail.

Even with the new IAS chart, it is people like you and others who backtrack and figure out the formulas

Salute to you all.

1 Like
5

Would be really nice to know what:
Fury:
“increased speed between attacks by 40%” means blizzard :slight_smile:

6

I have good news and bad news

Tomb Reaver with IAS on gear…does seems to break 4F to reach possible 3F, or even faster.

Slow weapon like Earthshifter also benefit from gear on IAS and finally make it very useable…no longer the slow 8F fury speed, or even grandfather in that case

on the other hand…Bear is quite ruined as you expected

4 Likes
7

They did an horrible job providing items again, what a joke this company is. They cannot even put a proper PTR together i am hopeless for this game

8

why are you even playing this game jared? you hate it. at least according to everything you write. go to WoW or something else.

1 Like
9

Dude its my favorite game of all time!!! WOW ?? seriously LMAO never played it never will i like D2 and other ARPG. I am not playing this game by the way, i want to play it but blizzard cannot get it together. I have played D2 20 years. Have a nice day fanboy, blizzard is trash!!! They asked for my feedback and i am giving it to them :slight_smile:

10

Nice tests :slight_smile:

I ended up offshore at work, so i cannot test atm.

Anyway about the fury ias breakpoints:
The initial paw attack formula is stright forward:
Ceiling(FramesPrDirectionx256/floor(256x(100+EIAS)/100))-1

The serial attack is hard to know what they ment.
I believe its one of theese:
Formula 1(Old formula setup, without the delay/custom animation speed, which is aboutly 40% faster…) :
Ceiling((FramesPrDirection+1)/2x256/floor(256x(100+EIAS)/100))

Formula 2(“old formula setup” but 40% faster) :
Ceiling((FramesPrDirection+1)/2x256/floor(256x(100+EIAS)/100)x0,6)

Formula 3(just making it 40% faster than standard paw attack) :
Ceiling(FramesPrDirectionx0,6x256/floor(256x(100+EIAS)/100))

By using a 0 wsm berserker axe with a werewolf level 22(70% skill ias) the ias breakpoints should be like this:
Formula 1:
40 ias drops from 6 frame serial to 5 frame serial attack.
Formula 2:
40 ias drops from 4 frames serial to 3 frame serial attack.
Formula 3:
26 ias drops from 6 frames serial to 5 frames serial attack.

Should be fairly simple to see which one acts correctly.
Test1:
Berserker axe with 1 shael, put on goldwrap or nosferatus and see if ias break improve with 1 when putting on the belt. If it does its worth to go further and test every breakpoint on this formula.

Test 2:
Add bloodfists.
Or
Remove belt and add either hl or loh or cats or Sanders gloves or smt to have total 40ias.

If ias change between 30 and 40 ias then formula 1 and 2 is worth checking all breakpoints.
If ias seems decent fast, but not as fast as good old 4 frames tombreaver build then formula 1 is most likely to be correct.
If attack speed seems nearly bugged fast, then formula 2 is most likely correct and its worth to check all breakpoints of that formula.

Anyway how use 30 and 40 ias dont matter. If u need other skill level of werewolf or so let me know.
If we find 1 formula that seems to fit i can post full ias breakpoints of that so it can be tested fully.

11

Thanks

one thing I can tell the difference is that the attack speed of BOTD great polearm shows the difference as soon as I equip Highlord

same thing for ribcracker with shael. There’s clearly a attack speed difference between equipping a highlord and without

12

Damn, with theese formulas i see no change in any of the 3 formulas of serial attacks.
Frames pr direction: 17
Wsm: 0
Werewolf level 20: 68 skill_ias

However the initial frame, or paw attack if you like changes from 8 fpa to 7 fpa at total of 72 ias.

Are you able to see if its only the initial attack that change or if its the serial fast ones that change speed?

With this setup the botd polearm:
Formula 1 serial attacks changes from 5 to 4 frames at 109 total ias.

Nothing else happens before 200ias where initial paw attack again changes from 7 to 6 fpa.

Its always easier to test on slow bases with low base ias. Due to more changes in fpa at less ias. Also be carefull with andariel helm as it increase werewolf level to 22 which is 70% skill ias instead of 68%.

I will have a look at earth shifter and come back to you with some breakpoints for the 3 formulas i think May be in use.

2 Likes
13

When I do the testing for ribcracker the char is naked, only ribcracker and highlord (equip and unequip)

as for Botd great polearm, I have jalal, egnima, dracul’s grasp, manald heal, Verdungo, raven frost, gore rider, 7 ss GC, torch and anni, with the amount of +skill, EIAS should be capped by then

sorry for not making clear on my gear part, hope that clarify and helped a bit

14

Don’t know about PVP, but for PVM the “best bowazon” doesn’t mean much. Mine has top gear and sucks big times compared to any sorc, necro or trapsin.

15

Wolf Barb 2 3 vs 2 4 PT v2.0 - YouTube

This is the Wolf Barb side by side video…I feel that in 2.4 V2.0 the attack speed is a bit slower, but I am not too sure

16

Okay earth shifter:
Avoid using andariel. Keep lvl 20 werewolf.
Wsm: 20
Frames pr direction : 17
Skill ias: 68

10ias(only earth shifter) :
Paw attack: 10 fpa
Formula 1: 6 fpa
Formula 2: 4 fpa
Formula 3: 6 fpa

29 ias:
Paw attack: 9 fpa
Formula 3: 5 fpa

46 ias:
Formula 1: 5 fpa
Formula 2: 3 fpa

65 ias:
Paw attack: 8 fpa

109 ias:
Formula 3: 4 fpa

2 Likes
17

looks like fast attack speed is still archivable for bear assassin…as long as you use BoS instead of fade

18

Unfurnately a ribcracker has 2 different wsm speed depending on if its upped or not :slight_smile:

Is urs upped?

Assuming you not bo/battlecommand urself the great polearm setup has +17 shape skills.
Jalas(4), enigma(2), skillers(7), torch(3), annie(1) = 17
Lvl 37 werewolf: 75skill ias.

I do not see any change on the 3 formulas. Which then mean its not done like any of those :frowning: damn… At 90ias i see difference…

Then i dont know what they did to the fury serial attack, cause it dont seem to use any of the old logic conserning the fpa formula.

About the bear assa, does it look like 5 frames?

19

It is upped

It looks close to 5 or 6, I will record a video and post it once available

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1 Like