Let's Discuss Teleport and Mobility in General - Sorc / Pal Shouldn't be 90% of players

General Discussion
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TL:DR Teleport as is, makes the game worse. Make it not affected by Faster Cast Rate. Make Attribute points increase movement speed so others can have the power fantasy. It’s balanced, see below as to why.

Enigma has always seemed like a last hurrah patch content effort to feed on the energy that currently existed at the time. Was it good for the longevity of the game? No. It forces class choice into an ugly corner. Why? People feel forced to play what they don’t want to.

Considering the targets of D2R content changes, they clearly want to make changes that are more in line with what is better for the game overall. The teleport issue WILL LIKELY be targeted eventually.

Teleport gives a very pleasing power fantasy affect to whoever plays Sorc as it should. This is a good thing… but it allows you to ignore a significant amount of the game, in terms of content, and challenge. I think we can preserve that power fantasy but with a series of changes.

As a baseline i propose to change teleport so that it is no longer affected by FCR and simply functions as a zero FCR teleport, essentially a skill with a cooldown, like Meteor or Frozen Orb. This is still extremely usable and will still make every class very jealous.

Also, this would totally screw bots. Not really a goal but a nice plus.

She’s still going to be able to skip content, just not nearly as easily. With careful timing she can still dodge around a bit and kite most things. She may have to sacrifice some several dozen thousands of damage to focus on survival a little, but she has stupid amounts of damage to spare.

Afterall… why are other classes SOO SLOW in comparison anyway? Sorc is essentially a double threat already just by nature of her abilities but, teleport, nothing really compares in speed, even at 0 FCR.

This would affect other classes to a certain degree however, because Enigma.

I propose that an entire “content patch” is focused on allowing them to achieve higher levels of mobility not necessarily on par with even the nerfed Teleport. But just significantly better.

Why not let other classes experience a little bit of that power fantasy. Particularly classes more aligned with physical prowess, but not necessarily limited to.

I like simple solutions, so it really is as simple as the movement speed stat. But how to implement? Easy enough. Attribute points.

Attribute points already have different values depending on class. So obviously these can be tweaked.

Maximum Assignable Attribute points is approximately 500+.

Keep in mind, no one actually puts all their points into one stat. Vitality is typically too important.

100% movement speed is NOT EVEN CLOSE to double run speed. For some perspective…

Base run speed for all toons naked: 9 yards a second.
Run speed at 100% movement speed: 12.6 yards a second.
Run speed at 295% movement speed: 14.94 yards a second. Yes there are serious diminishing returns.
Paladin Charge 22.5 yards a second.

And the only thing that compares to teleport speed. Paladin Charge with vigor, probably pushing 30y/s, and calling it comparable is a kindness, because, walls and everything else in between.

And we’re stuck on average with less than 12y/s… Again, WHY ARE WE SO SLOW!!!

Some baseline value suggestions:

STR: 0.25% movement speed per point = 125% movement speed at 500 points.
DEX: 0.35% movement speed per point = 175% movement speed at 500 points.
NRG: 0.15 movement speed per point = 75% movement speed at 500 points.
Vit: 0.08 movement speed per point = 40% movement speed at 500 points.

Power fantasy is incredibly important to the appeal of a game like D2. It boggles my mind that movement speed hasn’t been exploited to extreme levels by the Developers to increase game appeal.

Keep in mind, 500 points into one stat is unlikely to happen by nature of gear and vitality requirements. This would also require level 99. So no, we’re not going to have level 1’s zipping around at almost decent speeds. Also by nature of diminishing returns it’s not really super affective until high level anyway.

Even if my suggested bonuses above went live, and Teleport remained as is currently live. Everything that is Teleport will still be significantly better.

LET’S GET THE MOVEMENT SPEED MOVEMENT MOVING!

4 Likes
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All I see on this forum are countless threads where people obsess on making the game less fun for others.

Why should the devs listen to you? 90% of the player base does not think like this. If you do not like a particular mechanic do not use it. It’s really that simple.

The obvious solution to your problem is to give all classes access to teleport, not shoehorn in a ridiculous movement mechanic which would still be inferior to teleport.

5 Likes
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Shoo Karen Purist, you’re not welcome here.

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Uh, all classes do have access to teleport, unless you are referring to a hard skill in the tree?

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Ideally a charm to free up the armor space. That would actually increase build diversity in a fun way unlike OP’s far inferior suggestion

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Well there are staves as well…

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Here’s the problem with that. Teleport changes every class significantly. It becomes an entirely new build. It’s so jarringly different, the original developers would have never approved something like this.

It was a side-show separate development team that created Enigma, after the original development team left. While a brave and daring idea to introduce, it DOES NOT MEAN that it was COMPLETELY WRONG.

Can you really see a teleport skill tree box in every class… just because? I mean it doesn’t even make sense. It’s so out of place, gameplay, lorewise, everything wise.

10 years of intended to be abandoned game, is why Enigma is a thing. People are so instilled with the concept of Teleport normalization that it is hard to see why Teleport, as is, is so bad for the game.

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Make the +2 Leap on Gorefoot and the +2 Vigor on Tearhaunch be O-Skills.

Add an item that grants Dragon Flight as an O-skill. (I suggest Tyrael’s Might)

Make it so Faster Run/Walk increases the frame rate for Leap and Leap Attack.

Make it so Increased Attack Speed increases the frame rate for Dragon Flight.

Add crafting recipes for body armor with Teleport charges, and boots with Dragon Flight charges.

Instead of eliminating Enigma or nerfing Teleport, make the other mobility options more available and better.

1 Like
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if skiping content is something fun, bc you have no interest in killing enything in between your teles
devs have failed miserably on their game design

i already said this
sorces tele should be nerfed or changed into something else and i think enigma should stay as it is and be desirable by every spec

2 Likes
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Wasn’t Enigma released in 2003 with patch 1.10? You really think you are going to get this runeword removed because, in your opinion, “the original developers would never have approved”?

I am literally LOLing over here… Do you see how much crap Blizzard gets for even trying to do anything with this game? Can you imagine if they tried to remove Engima ???

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Honestly I don’t think Enigma is bad at all. Teleport being available to everyone is ridiculous don’t get me wrong, sorc needs teleport to not just die but anyone else with it is just unstoppable. But it’s hardly something you’re going to be getting straightaway, it takes ages to find even half of the items required for Enigma to the point it really may as well not exist.

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I would do anything to get my feral druids mobility. Teleport in form, a leap, a charge - or just added FRW on lycanthropy. For the love of god… ANYTHING- not a one of thr above would make the class OP. Just more viable. Even with ALL of the above casters would still vastly outfarm a single target melee that is mobile by MILES.

You cant get enough uplikes from me.

Only haters to giving shifters mobility are content being the ones on the top of the pecking order and never want to be challenged. (Even though they still wouldnt be?) Its pure denial. None of them will play shifters even if they can TP in form.

I write this on EVERY ptr iteration in the comments directly to blizzard and i ask everyone else does aswell.

2 Likes
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Yes… Diablo 2… miserable game design. Checks out.

Or maybe it’s just a really old game?

Look, most people accept D2 for what it is at this point. Enigma makes the end game grind, which is 99% magic finding, a lot less tedious. You don’t have to use it if you don’t want to.

1 Like
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please

just ask yourself
why does it make the game less tedious?

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It’s the 80/20 rule.

80% of the player base is low cognition, so only play the easiest builds, while 20% of the player base has high cognition and enjoy playing the harder builds.

When your country enters ww3 in the next few years and conscription knocks on your door, pray to God that you are put in a platoon with high testosterone men that are in the 20% and not the ones that are going to cry for QoL warfare and nontoxic enemies. Sanctuary is about to be cleansed for the 3rd time in 100 years.

1 Like
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For all the things that D3 did badly, movement skills are the thing done much better than D2. Every class can have efficient movement, one way or another. Run speed can actually compete with (and sometimes outperform) teleport…

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Thats a very long winded post for not realizing that every char even sorceress can wear enigma. Jesus what a waste of time.

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For the life of me, I never understood why a person would run just as fast in their base form as they would as a freaking WEREWOLF. It should have FRW, and honestly, massively so. The fact that you literally transform into a half-man, half-wolf hybrid should absolutely boost your running speed.

1 Like
19

These are all wonderful solutions.

Not that I’ll go shouting it from the rooftops because strongly suggesting any kind of nerf seems to incite a special kind of rage… but I think the “fix” for teleport (and Enigma by extension) is to simply add a range component like Leap has. If a level 1 could clear a small gap or free you from being pinned, but not be used to breeze through a full rush in 20 minutes, I think it would feel a bit more fair.

The real problem with teleport is that it’s already at maximum effectiveness at level 1 (not efficiency, but effectiveness). You can teleport a full screen away at maximum FCR if you have the stats… with a level 1 teleport. One-point-wonder skills are weak points in build diversity by their nature.

If anyone wants to zip around with the current effectiveness? I think it should require you spec that way. Almost any other character and skill doing anything at maximum effectiveness requires stat/gear investment, but not teleport.

If you need to reach level 20 for half screen distance and ~35+ for the current distance on teleport, I think it becomes a skill that requires investment to become extremely powerful. Mana cost should be reduced through synergy with lightning mastery, levels should give you increased distance. This way, no Enigma-decked Paladin could ever teleport as masterfully as a properly specced Sorceress… as it should be. Also, not every Sorc build would be a master teleporter by default.

3 Likes
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Pindle bot doesnt need teleport.

Because classes are very different. Every class have some speciality.