You too
Have fun trying to derail somebody else topic with falsehoods and manipulations
Lol someone doesnāt like your idea and explains why and you lose your mind.
Call it a derail because you donāt like that someone doesnāt like your idea
I pity you
Oh you are perfectly allowed to dislike something
I feel itās more you that dislike not being allowed to give your biased& fabricated opinion without having it challenged back
Iām sorry you feel that way, have a good day
do vengeance + conviction. then get 3 piece trang to do firewall. uāll clear stuff easily lulz
So you agreeā¦ vengeance sucks
If it needs 2 other skills and half a set from another class to be viableā¦ itās blatantly not good by itself lol
yes vengeance is subpar. it is ok for skills to be subpar. d2 isnāt esport so its ok to have skills that are only useful in niche situations and forever stays as a niche skill.
This is where we disagree
All skills should be at least decent
Because why is to decide which is has the right to be good and which deserves to be bad?
For the sake of players entertainment and game diversityā¦ all skills should be good
Iām not talking about Op
But good
i donāt know man. currently you are able to beat the game with vengeance. it takes forever, but it is doable (like all the non aoe builds, mostly barb lmao). i think being able to beat the game is good enough for the vengeance build. this makes it subpar but not impossible. this is good enough for a bare minimum i think.
if u buff stuff u either reduce itās point costs, or u make it do more dmg. doing more dmg means u still hit 1 guy at a time. reducing point costs means uāll do something else along with vengeance. then u might as well just do the other thing lulz
Not a fan of values
I prefer mechanic buffs
Itās like having a raw steak at a restaurant values is like giving you more raw steak
But mechanics is cooking and adding spices to your steak
Sorry I prefer flavour over quantity
Thereās no reason to leave skill as awful on purpose when we have a re-release of the game that is trying to improve the most useless skills.
You may as well make a topic arguing potion throwing barb is viable
uh ā¦ pot throwing barb is viable thoughā¦ u can beat the game in LoD ?_?
uhā¦ and how would u buff vengeance mechanically? it kills everything since it does 3 elemental dmg types (and physical :p). give it aoe is gonna turn it into blessed hammer xD
- Make off-weapon ED actually work for vengeance, like +min/max off-weapon works with it
- 80 points of synergies is way too much, cut it down to 20/40 - especially since itās going to be combined with a conviction aura which is another 20 investment
- Make deadly strike damage be converted by vengeance
If that doesnāt do enough we can look at the damage itself
Again for me a skill being viable isnāt just being able to beat the game
Why
Because in the course of a character lifespan the campaign from act one normal to killing baal is only but a fraction of the whole game time
I saw a survey that showed that campaign represents like 1-5% of the game time of a character
So that is why I donāt bass viability based on the first 1-5% Of a game
For me being viable is about being able to farm endgame at a decent pace
when i say beat the game i meant kill baal in hell 
again i dont see anything wrong with the content completion survey data uāve presented.
also like iāve said earlier u can kill stuff pretty decently with vengeance + conversion if u do the 3trang piece firewall route. just like hammer is tedious before u get to spam teleport (the point of dependent on gear).
soā¦ shrug
The vast majority of the community not considering it viable or extremely underpowered is an issue.
Youāre arguing that an extremely bad skill shouldnāt be fixed in D2 Resurrection just because you can very very slowly eventually maybe kill baal with it; or you could just kill him with something else 50x faster
Thatās exactly what I meant
Thatās the campaign
uh ā¦ wat? I just said twice that with vengeance + conviction you can kill horde fine if you do firewall. u sure weāre talking about the same thing here?
u kill stuff with firewall and smack the people firewall cant kill with vengeance (and bosses).
vengeance also kills everything (albeit slower) but theres nothing wrong with being slow.
vengeance is already really good at what its good at (which is can kill everything). is that not good enough :V?
Look Iāll make it simple for you
You keep saying that vengeance is fine when you pair it with Trang firewall
Same thing can be said to Throwing potionsā¦ they do almost as good with firewall than vengeance with firewall lol