Op,they took a good idea and made it worse,changed it into a race and added stuff just to invent something to just keep you busy and when you’re busy there is no complaints yet the game still …
Exactly this … Up until this announcement, everyone I knew did mythic plus because they enjoyed pushing high keys … or did one a week for the weekly chest that offered mythic raid level loot.
This change impacts none of that.
I think this is more of a psychological problem. People see item levels are a little bit lower and are auto triggered … “ERMERGHERD!!! NERFS! HOW DARE YOU BLIZZARD.” … And because they are so emotionally troubled, they can’t think logically to realize this will have very little impact on game play (if any).
Glad you agree you have absolutely no idea what you’re talking about
Well then, I don’t know what your issue is, really.
The difficulty isn’t going away. The rewards that would benefit someone of your skill level aren’t changing. Unless you relied on those heroic ilvl pieces of gear.
What exactly did they change since the inception of this system that is bugging you, that would legitimately effect you?
I suppose I’m just not understanding why you’re getting so outraged by this. Mythic raid has always had loot that was better than your M+ cache. Hell, it’s better than it was in Legion, where a +15 cache dropped 940 gear, which was literally what Argus dropped on normal, or 5 ilvls less than every heroic boss (15 less than Argus on heroic).
So what’s the big issue? If this system is irrelevant because of the Shadowlands changes, then how was it ever relevant in the first place? Because Shadowlands is handling it like Legion did, but with choices in your “casino box.”
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Problem is that every group thinks their end game is the most challenging and deserves as good of rewards if not better than everyone else’s end game.
And they’re all right.
The beauty is being able to choose your challenge if you want, or do them all and have access to more rewards. Now doing more will give you more reward options. Is it that big a downgrade? You can still farm M+ with your friends like you always did. What changes? Do you only time a +19 later in the expac now instead of a +20 because of a couple ilvls?
Like I said, I want M+ to be more relevant than my weekly casino interface and “pRiDe lulz”, it’s not hard to understand.
Of course Mythic raids have always had better loot than Mythic + dungeons? lol. I ain’t salty about it?
Most of y’all keep posting like the only thing I care about baseline is item level /facepalm
It’s almost like
M+ would have been better off having a currency and vendor attached to it
You know back like in a system we used to have
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Because nobody really understands what your issue is. I’d wager that if a developer was reading this, they wouldn’t either.
I’d suggest laying out what you would like to see, rather than complain about the system as a whole.
Do you not like the loot box?
Do you feel that gear rewards should be better than mythic raiding? Or better than they are now? If so, by how much?
If item level isn’t the issue, then what is? It can’t be that it’s not difficult enough, because that never stops increasing.
Should there be more pets, titles, xmog, mounts? What would you like to see if ilvl isn’t what you seek?
I mean, I’d be down for more incentive to run these things too. But right now it just sounds like you’re shouting at clouds.
These sky is falling posts are getting old. The only thing that’s changing is the front end of gearing in M+ (of which I also disagree with). The back end of gearing is staying the same (and is actually getting better…).
Taking this tier as an example, using this new system you’d get 455 from end-of-dungeon chests (blegh), but… you’ll still be 475+ by the end via the weekly box. And that box got way better by giving you multiple options of gear to better improve your chances of getting an upgrade.
Long story short, this will slightly hurt you on the front end for M+ gearing, but will actually be better in the long run.
Want to just do M+ to progress? You… can still do that with ZERO impediment to your top end performance.
Yeap i agree with you… Blizzard does not want you to be rewarded anymore they want to boost their gold sellers their boost sellers who sell for 300K gold a Mythic raid boost. You will see lots of spammers in the trade chat selling those boost as you see now in BFA. Shadowlands will suck so bad you will scream mama!. I wont buy this abomination i hope blizzard listens to people who scream of agony. Hazzikostas a person who studied law is the game designer yeap a non game expert is responssible for this mess.
See you in shadowlands!
this is it. I’ve noticed as the game gets older less and less new players come in. Especially young ones with all the time in the world.
I’m 26 so I’m not old yet but sacrificing a weekend to raid is annoying. Especially in an outdated game type. If blizz is going to keep up with new exciting games they need to make this one more accessible (they know this and they are already working on it)
Raiding gear already has its own appearance so tbh that should be enough on its own to differentiate someone spending hrs in game. Mythic should always be the top but I should at least be able to get heroic gear from high end mythics.
I feel sorry for the people who feel that raiding is needed to good gear. Some people are just stuck in there old ways. In the words of our old warchief “times change”
maybe, but I think it’s more likely the multitudes of people who complained that m+ made heroic raid near-obsolete and was an infinitely grind-able gear source. It still is, just not as lucrative.
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Relevancy has been the common thread of all of my posts.
So yes, if I need to dream up some ideas for Blizzard developers:
A vendor with a ‘marks’ system. Dungeon set bonuses. Or even MoP style cosmetic rewards, mounts, anything.
Incentive.
I like the vault. Gesus. 
2 Likes
I hope it doesn’t feel like a chore to do week after week.
Is a 3 iLevel difference between a 15 and a Heroic Raid drop really that game breaking for some people? I do agree that they should take a second look at the number of drops from M+ with the iLevel changes but we’re still talking about content with me gear lockouts and a huge loot pool.
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We’re also conveniently forgetting why Heroic is easier in BfA.
Back in Legion, raiding still had tier sets. Sure you could spam run M+ as much as you wanted, but Tomb of Sargeras was rough, as was Antorus. Compare that to the state of Eternal Palace and Nya’lotha, both of which were cleared significantly faster. It’s almost as if there was a reason for that…oh, could it be that one could sit there and run M+ as much as possible to get Titanforges or Corruption to the point it trivializes the raids so thoroughly that they became laughable? Surely M+ couldn’t have had an effect on raiding.
Oh wait…
With the removal of tier set bonuses, it was raw stats that consumed the game. M+ was so much more lucrative than raiding that people were outgearing the content the week it came out. A huge issue with BfA was it was all M+. Unless you were a mythic Raider, raiding was practically pointless outside of a few trinkets, and plenty of M+ people joined the constant raids to hit up those trinkets. Outside of that, you might as well do the raid once and then be forced into spamming M+ for your gearing progression.
M+ should be an alternative, not the end all be all best way to gain gear. So reducing its potency by a tiny amount (3 ilvls is not a huge difference) is a good step in reigning M+ in during a time raiding offers such a minuscule benefit that people just write it off.
So do I! And being forced to run +15s of the same dungeons I’ve been running for two years is boring and annoying, but raid loot was so pointless that once I had the trinkets, I had to bum rush M+ because it had the BiS everything else all expansion.
M+ was way too rewarding. It’s good that it’s finally being brought down from blowing PvP and raiding out of the water.
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I didn’t play BfA, but even considering that, I’m not ‘conveniently’ forgetting anything. I didn’t play BfA because of the systems I disliked.
This is blaming M+ for both broken Corruption and Titanforging, both of which do not have to even exist. Take those two out and it’s not the same.
I would be very happy if ‘heroic’ raids were upped in difficulty, but I don’t trust Blizzard to do that.
I’m obviously not even talking about BfA here - I didn’t play it . So I can’t imagine how much easier these ‘heroic’ raids (that are supposed to feel rewarding) are now.
I am hoping like you say, this “slow” gearing system will make it “more difficult”.
It is the same because we also lost tier sets this expansion. So M+ got dramatically buffed and raiding got dramatically nerfed. Not to mention raiding didn’t get some pity chest that would give you high ilvl loot even if you didn’t time the dungeon.
I played every raid tier in BfA. M+ made it miserable because people were already disenchanting loot by week two. Everyone had M+ gear already. It was absolutely ridiculous.
3 ilvls for something that is spammable being lower than something on a weekly cool down is a fair trade off. You can spam it to your hearts content while raiders get the small benefit of getting very slightly higher ilvl by doing content once a week.
At the end of the day, and after a few months of gearing, both heroic raiders and M+ people will be at the Mythic raid level. The end week chest is getting buffed to compensate the end of run nerf.
When raiding lost tier sets, it hurt. Now that M+ is losing the absurdity of loot acquisition, it will hurt. But raiders survived, you will, too.
Actually it’s “No feature is safe from Raiders “complaining”, and Daddy Blizz bending everyone else over for them”.
It’s going to be sad not playing for the first time in nearly 15 years. Up until now things like WF/TF, Benthic and M+ have kept me paying through the PF spitegates. Shadowlands has finally made it not worth it, and blizz loses at least $200. Oh well, at least I get to see FFXIV now. 
