Wrath? Wrath absolutely was homogenized.
You just didnt notice.
Everyone got cc. Everyone got aoe. Replenishment was given to multiple classes.
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Hes wrong on wrath though. He also forgets the toolkit gains and losses by wrath (or even bc). If he wants bc balance he needs bc toolkits for classes.
If he wants wrath balance he needs wrath toolkits.
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#NOCHANGES
Neither CC nor AOE are cross role utility, which is ultimately what people are whining about making hybrids too good.
replenishement? battle rez? just as some examples.
you cannot say wrath balance is okay, without giving us wrath design to go with it. apples to apples, oranges to oranges. and before you say “okay have wrath design then”
how would talent trees work? were only 20 points short of required talents.
how about stats that existed in wrath, but don’t exist in classic?
you’d have to completely rework classes and loot and dungeons/raids around it.
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LOL, no they aren’t, they are opposed to changes to Classic that make it more akin to Refail.
YOU don’t like the hybrid aspect, YOU don’t believe they should have a “hybrid tax” ( as was the case in Vanilla and now in Classic ), the removal of it is one of the turning points that led to Refail.
If YOU don’t want to play Classic as it is, don’t project YOUR own issues onto others and twist the conversation to suit YOUR desires and goals, that’s pretty much an open admission YOU are trolling.
Reported as such, have a great day 
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I’m complaining about having to put in many times the work as other classes to be less than they are. Shaman and Paladins literally cannot function well enough as Ret/Prot or Enhancement to be usable. THAT is what I’m complaining about.
Anything less than these specializations being able to perform adequately for the role they’re supposed to fill without putting excess amounts of strain on the rest of the raid is 100% unacceptable.
But this discussion isn’t about wrath balance or wrath tool kits. It’s about whether hybrids can theoretically do the same dps/tanking without non hybrids being excluded.
And the answer is a resounding yes. For example rogues didn’t have BR’s or AOE heals or any of that in Wrath yet people didn’t just toss rogues aside for kitty druids.
exactly. if you gave hybrids the toolkits of classic, but the dps of wrath, why would you even bother bringing anything other then mages, warriors, a token warlock for HS, and hybrids?
youd need a few rogues for suppression room, and you’d need a few hunters here and there for tranq shot fights…
but other then that?
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Hybrids had major bonuses in pvp though- being able to heal, having that extra mobility as a shammy/druid- the benefits become pretty clear in many other situations. Yeah, they didn’t do a good job of making sure everyone was great for pvp as well as pve- but that’s part of the game.
Most of the talent trees had bad talents or even forced you to pick up useless ones by how they’re designed- it sucks, but it’s part of the game.
If you were to start balancing up hybrids, they’d either become utterly dominant or you’d have to nerf other areas.
I do agree they should have done things like have a basic rez for all healers, but that’s a change they should have made in Vanilla, not now.
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maybe you should look at the toolkit rogues GAINED between vanilla and wrath as to why.
also in wrath totems and auras were made RAID WIDE.
so i didn’t need 1 shaman and 1 druid per group. in vanilla i absolutely do.
so unless your prepared to make sweeping changes ala wrath. no. it wouldn’t work.
you continually again and again ignore the CHANGES THAT HAPPENED to make sure classes weren’t invalidated, but didn’t exist in vanilla.
to put this in perspective. lets assume i have a raid with 20 casters/healers and 20 melee/tanks/hunters. hypothetically.
in wrath i would need 2 dps druid to supply the auras for that.
in vanilla i would need 8.
and thats just dps druids. a full fifth of my raid is dps druids.
shamans. again need 8. thats 16. a full 40% of my raid in vanilla is now comprised of just two classes. oh wait. no its not because i haven’t counted in healing druids and tanking druids.
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And tons of world first guilds ran 5+ rogues on Zul. And how many shadow priests for that 2 boss raid? Gimmicks are meaningless.
You never felt threatened because you were never competitive, but the simple fact is, hybrid tax existed for years for a reason.
I don’t find this thread a surprise coming from a druid. As what you are explaining is what old forum-goers called the “Hybrid tax”. People used to RAGE about kitty druid doing more DPS then a rogue as they had the ability to heal/rez/battlerez/etc. it came with the territory.
Classic WoW is a time capsule, as somebody else pointed out. This isn’t meant to be balanced to look like a Retail-esque change of balancing everybody to be within 0.01% of the DPS ranking on a patchwerk boss fight. It is meant to be enjoyed as the experience it was.
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To be fair, I could use some cookies and milk.
Maybe, eventually. But probably not. Part of the charm of the game was its balance, or lack thereof.
If you were looking at fixing all the hybrids you’d have to completely redo half the talent trees. Shaman enhancement tree for example, is a complete joke compared to the other two trees.
3 things.
- Give bear a fear break
- Give Pummelers endless charges
- Give Moonkin Form +6 spell hit, regenerate 20% mana while casting.
Everyone knows what the problem is, and suggesting fixes is easy. It implementation that Blizzard messes up and starts a constant see-saw of balance and rebalance… (no pun intended)
It is this is why I would rather just see dual specs than balance changes to classic.
this wouldn’t be broken or anything…
i can totally see warriors and paladins totally abusing this.
Not really needed, this is something unique to the warrior class.
In general the warriors only need one change, and that is for cleave to hit all targets with in 8 yards of the primary target in a forward cone.
Any reason specifically why?
+6% Spell hit would make the moonkin not need to gain any gear to raid.
20% mana while casting is something that is also out of the question, because the mana regeneration is not a boomkin thing, other classes are having a hard time also. More specifically what should happen is that all in combat mana regeneration should be increased from 5% of max mana to 10%.
This would help a lot of other classes with the same issue.
So you’re complaining about how the game was in vanilla, how it always was, and how they always said it would be? Why are you playing vanilla again?
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