Why no warlocks in keys?

Warlock among other classes seems extremely underrepresented in mythic plus. It isn’t just for a lack of damage but utility. is the only reason to bring a mm hunter or fire mage just for utility or damage as well? can the locks get some love with our class being non existent in keys?

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locks bring brez , healthstones and portal (usefull here and there tho…)

this is all true but people will just have lock alts standing outside dungeons to drop stones and even with the bres some people just take balance druids instead. not saying those classes don’t deserve their spot in a key but lock is so under represented as a ranged in keys

Affliction is #2 in CN and #6 in M+. Seems to be doing fine.

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yeah they’re fine in raid, im talking about keys, keystones 15 and up the only thing less represented than locks is warriors.

At the 95th percentile of M+ perf, Affliction, as mentioned, is #6.
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/25#metric=playerscore&dataset=95&class=DPS

If it was an issue of viability, surely Aff wouldn’t be up there in the top 6, so they’re clearly desired on the high-end. As far as absolute representation goes, Warlocks are the third least played class, so unless they were wildly overpowered, you wouldn’t expect to see extremely high rep.

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That’s not really the baseline you should be looking at.

Top end players are much more likely to log their performance in keys than low end players. Most of that data is from people who play on the highest competitive level to begin with.

What you should be looking at is average to above average player performance in keys.

But since you want to use logs. It’s an easy explanation. You bring 3 dps to keys, not 6. Why would you bring a warlock when you could bring a dps from the top 3 instead? Warlocks also have a variety of weaknesses in their play style that make them an easy nope for pug groups.

The people playing warlock in high end groups are all premades. When people talk about class viability in mythic+ they’re almost always referring to the pug scene. Or the very top keys in general. There is no room for a dps that is #6 on the list.

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Top-tier single target, uncapped AOE, brez, unique class utility in the form of healthstones and gateway. Serious question, is that not enough? What else do you feel you need?

Good warlocks are good

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I can’t seem to get any aoe damage out of my lock in mythic+ but I’m a fairly old guy playing a class I haven’t played since BC. It’s anything but trivial to do AoE as a affliction warlock. It’s a pretty viscous cycle since I won’t get better if I don’t run the mythic+ as affliction, but I can’t even pull my own weight so I don’t want to run them.

I will probably switch to demo and hope for the best. I’m pretty sure then I will be disgusted with my single target damage. :stuck_out_tongue:

Its all about dotting and malefic rupture for aoe as affliction.
Some classes aren’t great for AoE scenarios but excell at ST and smaller groups (2-3)
Once you’re comfortable knowing that you’re good to go.
Also a lot of the smaller packs have an enemy you want to burn down fast. That is where Aff can shine while the other 2 dps take the rest out.

Wat.

https://raider.io/mythic-plus-rankings/season-sl-1/all/world/leaderboards-strict#role=dps:mode=all:minMythicLevel=15:maxMythicLevel=99

That’s timed 15 and up. Warlocks sum to ~6% representation, warriors to 4%. Warlocks aren’t at mage, hunter, or druid levels, of course, because the meta rules at >15 key levels, but warlocks are still the next most popular ranged spec behind those 3, and they’re ahead of every melee DPS in the game except rogues.

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I need bloodlust and if I don’t have one yet that last spot is never going to a Warlock

blizzard think is ok to let warlocks out of m+ and pvp is ok, just because affliction do well in raids. FIX THE CLASS BLIZZARD!

Warlocks are also one of the least played classes in general, so their M+ representation really isn’t so bad at all.

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First time WoW player here. Started a couple months into Shadowlands.
Chose Warlock because I have a history of liking casters, and Destro looked fun.

Now, I’ll say, it is fun. But it’s obvious, that unless I get super luck on summon infernal casts recasting, or someone has haste, that I can’t keep up with other classes like mages.

Still, I’ve been able to grind my way to 500+ rio score, but it definitely feels like something is off with the balance of the class. I hate that boosts cost $60 or I would have gotten into a fire mage already.

The gap between Fire vs Arcane/Frost in M+ is about as large as the gap between Affliction vs Destro/Demo. So what’s happening here is that you’re comparing the worst Lock spec to the best Mage spec, instead of comparing yourself as Destro to Arcane or Frost, which offer very similar performance.

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Fair point, but I did pug with a frost mage that was just insane. Player was obviously really good. But it was impressive.

Honestly, I’m just hoping they tweak destolock a bit to make them more viable at higher levels.

All of this is null & void without the mechanics. Ran with a 210 hunter yesterday that rq because he kept dying. Apparently standing in puddles can be bad for your character. Who knew?

Gear also makes a difference. Not sure which run it was, but if you’re referring to the +5 SoA you did a few days ago (or the +7 Plaguefall you did afterwards with the same group), that frost mage was 208 itemlevel to your 194 at the time.

Also worth noting that Frost just got a pretty considerable buff a couple weeks back, and their strength in SL is and always has been their single target and 2-target cleave, especially if they’re running Venthyr for Mirrors, so looking at boss damage will show a pretty skewed perspective. That’s especially the case given that you’re running a full AoE build (Wilfreds + Inferno + Rain + Soul Conduit, even have the Havoc conduit slotted), while he was largely running a single-target build (Rune of Power + Thermal Void + Splitting Ice + Lonely Winter).

It’s also worth noting that you were using Kleia as your soulbind, when Pelagos is nearly always better from a DPS perspective. Kleia is the defensive-oriented soulbind, good for solo content, while Pelagos is the DPS-oriented one.

Edit: oh, also, due to the mechanics of the infernal and Wilfreds and Rain of and Soul Conduit, Destro really only hits its ridiculous scaling stride in AoE with that build when the AoE fights are fairly large and when they last a while (at least 25-30s). It’s rather likely the packs were simply dying too quickly in a +5 to +7, and that the tank wasn’t pulling large enough due to it being a PuG, for you to really see the AoE that Destro can pull.

Anyway, my point is, comparing your output to someone else’s in any given situation has a ton of variables involved. Enchants, consumables, covenant pick and strength in that content, the specific soulbind (and path) and conduit you’re using, your actual gear level, how well you and the other person know the instances, how well the two of you are playing, etc. All of that applies bonuses and maluses well above and beyond the actual tuning of the classes and specs at play.

Blizzard could absolutely be doing a better job of balancing, there’s no question about that. But in many of these cases, the actual tuning is only a piece of the puzzle.

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I appreciate this insight, and totally agree with you!
I actually was grinding some dungeons last night, had some leavers (absolute worst pet peeve), and one of the guys in one party stuck around and after chatting a bit, said the exact same thing as you did. Packs are dying too fast and destrolocks are better at higher keys.

So I’m holding out for that. But I’m super competitive, I like moving up consistantly… That being said, I’m heavily considered swapping to Affliction. But I’m going to stay with destro for a while and see where it goes.

As for my soulbind, I thought I read somewhere that Kleia was the best. I’ve been basin on Icyveins, but looking back, you’re right. I’ll make the switch.

Also, another thing to look at, that is reducing my damage, is my consistent use of stuns, especially getting into higher keys, and especially this week when tanks are kiting more for the affixes.

I dunno, I’m just ranting at this point, but I appreciate your input!