This is freaky; I feel like you are drinking the Purpose kool-aid. I can think of a trillion better alternatives than ferrying souls to the Maw.
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Which really backs up the thing I always harp on: the Maw is an absolute, mind boggling waste. If someone is too evil to be redeemed, why not just drain them of all of their anima on the spot (thus obliterating them), and then send the anima where it’s needed. There is literally no need to indulge in pointless, costly, infinite torture when you could just drain them away into oblivion. Sending souls to the Maw to torture them into nothingness not only wastes anima for pointless, irrelevant torture, it also squanders the anima those souls could have contributed.
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Which is clearly why you posted a two sentence response that address none of the most substantive points.
Clearly.
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If memory serves, it doesnt matter if they leave them on their worlds, isnt shadowland’s time supposed to be faster to the material world? if the ratio is high enough…i mean its like waiting 5 minuts vs being condemned to hell.
My apologies; I’m a little busy at the moment but I’ll address your points.
I’m not talking about creating a new realm.
The souls have anima. The very thing that Kyrian are feeding the Maw to torture souls.
At least they aren’t getting tortured and likely grounded into soul dirt.
I’m not claiming there is a neutral method; I’m claiming that anything is better than feeding the Maw souls. Bean, greens, tomatoes, ham, yam, hog mauls you name it!! I jest but I can’t think of a single instance were feeding souls to the Maw is better.
Maybe if feeding the Maw so much that it implodes but that would make the strongest guy in the Shadowlands even stronger. I honestly can’t think of a single instance.
Even you present a better option. Forcibly extracting anima to maintain the existing realms is better than sending them all to the Maw. Feeding them all to camp fire and destroying their very existence is better than sending them all to the Maw. //Insert the most ridiculous solution here// is better than sending them all to the Maw.
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No, not really. Other options that have been presented in this thread lead to more immediate harm happening. To the souls, to the Convenants, to the material universe and so on. Which could mean the crippling of the Convenats so they can’t stop the Jailer later on or could mean causing so much additional damage there might not be anything to save even if we beat him.
We’re rescuing them from the Maw. More every week or constantly all the time depending on whether you want to consider the weekly nature of a weekly quest “canon” or not. We’re working on the plan to eventually defeat the Jailer and save all the souls that we couldn’t get out before hand. If it works that is an infinitely better plan then either destroying all the souls just to keep them out of the Jailers hands temporarily. Or turning the Covenants into exactly the kind of anima factory farms that so many, yourself included, were decrying would be worse then the Jailer and the Maw in the lead up to the expansion.
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Because one of the classic tropes of magic is that suffering of the innocent makes things like necromancy more potent. That was the whole point of the shenannigans… to make sure that the innocent were sent to sufffer.
You misunderstand me completely: I’m saying the Maw is a waste from the perspective of the Abiter and the followers of the Purpose, I’m not talking about the perspective of the Jailer and his people. It’s a waste in that in should never have been made to begin with.
Something else to consider is that those souls Ardenweald, Bastion, Revendreth, and Maldraxxus would destroy to provide themselves with anima, were destined for other afterlives as well. There’s more than just the four and the Maw. So, the main four Covenants would then be depriving other afterlives of much needed anima as well. That in and of itself could spark even more of a civil war in the Shadowlands.
Like, imagine the afterlife Cairne Bloodhoof is in; wide plains and fields with game to hunt, etc… now imagine it collapsing. Would the souls there just let their afterlife collapse while watching Ardenweald, Revendreth, etc… getting gorged on anima?
I suppose the alternative would then be to share the anima among different afterlives, but who exactly is going to decide who gets how much anima and why? Even then, who is going to transport all this anima? The four Covenants have their hands full as is dealing with their own domestic issues.
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You’re losing me.
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Aren’t the Kyrians* sending them to the Maw in the first place?
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Aren’t we entering in the dreadful “what if souls reach other realms other the Maw” scenario?
I think the Kyrian are doing more bad than good; considering the only reason given for these monumental atrocities is simply “The Path” bids it.
Refer to my previous comments.
I’m sure the souls that are being made into weapons and pounded into dirt or who are the brink of becoming Mawsworn would think otherwise.
Can they give the soul the option or does that not follow the path? Temporarily join our realm and give us anima or be sent to WoW Hell and be tortured, pounded into terrain/armor.
Nope, currently we’re seeing that the covenants have ok’ish intention opposed to Zovaal.
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You’re making the mistaken assumption that the Arbiter and it’s Purpose are benevolent. The suffering in the Maw may be what’s been fueling the entire setup all this time. In Warhamer 40k the souls of a thousand psykers are horribly consumed EVERY DAY. This is by design.
So, they decided to run a lottery system instead. Whichever soul is found by us in the maw is rescued. Imagine if word got out in the maw that if you get notice by maw walker you got rescue. Limited seat. 
Shadowlands could have just do like other civilizations do. Create a policing system. Make rule like make trouble = maw. Even a militia system would do. Instead it’s everyone to the maw.
Anima doesn’t leave the Maw, it’s a black hole of sorts. Nothing comes out once it enters. It’s not possible for the Maw to fuel anything but the Maw itself.
Furthermore, as seen in the Arbiter-shutdown cinematic, the flow rate of souls into the Maw prior to the red ball was absolute insignificant—so small that you almost can’t even see it. There is no way this could fuel the Shadowlands, when so few souls went there.
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Technically? No. They’re doing what they’ve always done; taking the souls to Orbius and dropping them into the big “soul flow” that runs through it. Before that brought the souls to the Arbiter who then sorted them. Now though that flow only goes to the Maw.
Granted I’m pretty sure the quest that discusses this in the kyrian campaign shows that the kyrians can see this happening. They’re not unaware of whats happening but they also haven’t been told to stop. And while that’s their reason for still doing it, as I’ve brought up, there are other factors that could make changing course problematic.
No? To keep with the kyrian example their method is able to harvest the anima while the aspirant is separating themselves from a portion of their memories. The two operations there are inter-twinned; without one they don’t get the other. So souls brought to Bastion can swear a pledge of allegiance to the Archon all they want. Bastion isn’t going to get what it needs though unless they’re actually capable of walking the path. Which most souls aren’t.
Of all the Covenants the only ones who’s methods don’t really require the souls full and honest cooperation is Revendreth. And frankly? I think the Shadowlands would have to be on the literal cusp of collapse before Renthal and the Harvesters would consider torturing innocent souls for anima.
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I mean, I don’t know about you, but I find souls in the Maw trapped inside of rocks.
Seriously, who do you expect to staff this policing system? The Kyrians who are still ferrying souls to the Shadowlands so that all of reality doesn’t collapse? Maldraxxus which is in the middle of a Civil War? Revendreth that is going into over-drive on anima production to try and keep the rest of the Shadowlands from crumbling into nothing while also fending off the remnants of those loyal to Denathrius? Ardenweald which is fighting off a Drust invasion?
The attendants in Oribos have their hands full with the city being packed full of Maw-Walkers, Brokers, and folks from all kinds of different covenants. Would you trust the brokers with a job like that?
Not only that, but what anima could they get? Their methods produce Sinful Anima. They’re literally extracting the sins from the souls in the form of anima. If they get sent a bunch of Argent Crusader souls ready and willing to give for the good of the Shadowlands, what pathetic trickle of anima are they likely to get? It’d be a waste of time and resources. Also, I might be wrong, but aren’t Sinstones made in Oribos as well?
My apologies I thought you would read between the lines and not be so technically. So, technically the Kyrians are knowingly and willingly factoring all souls through the wickets in order to be sent to the Maw because the path.
I can’t think of a more stupid and short sighted covenant. Willingly and knowingly sending all souls to the Maw takes the cake.
I wasn’t talking about the Path, I would prefer to keep them as far away from the Kyrian as spiritually possible.
Of all the ones that we know of, but the Kyrian are so mind screwed and horrible that their only solution is to follow the path no matter how many souls the condemn to WoW Hell.
Do you want to go through this pain process and live(loosely) until we get this sorted out or do you want to go through a even more painful process in which you may get turned into armor and dirt and/or have your soul destoyed forever?
Its rhetorical(an ingame convo between NPCs). Just presenting actual solution to the current atrocities.
Sounds like they should get a chance at the path(as much as I despise it) instead of getting tossed to the Maw. If they actually came up with solutions other than the Path maybe I could get on board.
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We already have what must be tons of existing non-vital realms of the shadowlands, the covenant realms are pretty much the pillars that keep the shadowlands going. We literally could start dropping the souls off in other realms and at the same time sending some souls to Revendreth to let them extract anima with their superior anima extraction methods, which can later be sent to the other core realms to alleviate the drought.
You might argue that the souls being dropped in realms they don’t belong is bad, and it is. But any realm is still better than being dropped into the maw, both for the soul and for the greater cause. The soul in the maw will be tortured, ground up into stygia, forged into weapons for the Jailer further empowering him and his army. It’s essentially super hell, the worst possible place you can end up.
Having their anima extracted by Revendreth even if not meant to be there would be a nice vacation in comparison.
Yes, the whole deal with the kyrian is that they’re unquestioning and follow their purpose, it does not matter that they know their actions doom countless souls and empower the enemy, the very enemy that the current system of the shadowlands is made to contain. Which makes the Kyrian the worst covenant for me personally as they refuse to think of themselves and just follow the guidelines.
I’d put them at Lawful ignorant or some would say Lawful stupid.
Any other solution would in theory be better. You all act like we have few realms of the afterlife, but we’ve been told there are essentially unlimited afterlives and that we’re only visiting the most important ones. Dump the goblin souls in Revendreth, the afterlife actually made to make people repent and to extract anima that can be sent to other realms if needed. And all the other souls that are too much should be dumped in non-vital afterlives where they can’t interrupt the important realms.
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The Path is flawed.
I’m hoping in a near future patch they realize that the Path is flawed and start looking at option until they sort this mess out. I’m looking at other realms, pocket dimensions, plans anything other than the Maw. I think its a little too late for the souls that they’ve already ushered into the Maw.
Imagine if we had smart writers that would maybe create such things, and give us world quests about that content, and stories about such content, we the players are literally a megacomputer capable of solving all the worlds problems. so why not? The purpose is basically the 4th wall of saying “we do mythic + because it is the purpose you might not like doing what you are doing when you are lvling your character but it is the purpose”
Aside from that your stuff doesnt make much sense at all since the souls in revendreth are powerless against the venthyr etc. Same logic applies elsewhere too. the Souls are not revolting aside from being frustrated for an unknown amount of time.
as for your “Redeem helya” that is so stupid That I dont even see blizzard pulling it off. because they would deem it stupid, thus making it stupid beyond the literal definition of stupid.
OT: Yes the kyrians are omega levels of stupid. they seemingly lack free will and cant judge anything. because they want to be mindwiped slaves that are robots. or Automated machines. while creating said Literal automated machines because ???
They are literally machines capable of thinking that are literally mindbroken slaves that dont have any ability to judge, that would be required for them to do something, yet they can make decisions (see devos) but they remove their memories because it might make them bad taxi drivers.
Its all really really stupid.
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