This right here is why your argument is invalid. Pay to Win is only an issue if there isn’t another way to get whatever benefit you are supposedly purchasing in game. None of the things in WoW are unobtainable in the game, except cosmetic things like mounts and pets. In game gold is obtainable without spending a thing, so it’s not pay to win at all. With the possible exception of some pets, but really, complaining about pet battles being P2W??
Ah, so you equate any advantage at all to winning? Is this perhaps indicative of some sort of failing on your part to secure the wins you think you should have and therefore must find outside validation for failure? You focus only on the one word and not the entire phrase? Bad form there old sport.
Also as you are specifiying a definition that would be “in specific” not “in general”.
But hey, continue to nitpick in your attempt to drag out a win if you like.
I’m here all week, try the veal!
The only p2w is in a forced pvp game like BDO or Archage. There is no option to not pvp. In a game like WoW it’s more pay to cheat yourself because there is nobody to win.
Hrm…just to be clear you mean when they changed the pet charms?
i don’t recall them making a change to the wow token that would do that.
Leveling pot isn’t pay to win. It’s a time save.
It’s not pay to win. You guys need to go play a real pay to win game before you can say stuff like that.
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You’re right, I meant the charms.
Someone thinks in an expansion where gear is thrown at you, getting BoE bought via wow tokens is “pay to win”.
And you can’t?
100% you can by earning in game gold. I don’t understand how this “can’t” thing came up.
If you don’t have the cash, you farm the gold, save the gold, and rick roll it into Bnet Cash to make the purchase.
This is available to every single player that has an active account.
So again-- You can’t? Show me where you Can’t get the cash shop items/services.
Pay to win is any system where a player can purchase something that is not superficial or cosmetic.
Leveling at this point, is Superficial-- I don’t consider a boost P2W.
The token is just a way for them to better control their own economy.
I’d consider any gear or runs purchased with tokens as a form of pay to win.
It may not be a huge advantage, it may not give you the skills you need to actually play that character, but it is still technically an advantage gained with real money isn’t it?
Can you really win an MMO? What is winning?
Is winning collecting all the collectible things?
Is winning having BIS gear until the next raid comes out in 3-6 months?
Is winning having a high PVP rank that resets every season?
Is winning being able to complete Mythic+30 in 15 minutes?
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And can be crafted, picked up as a random drop or bought for gold earned in game. Not pay to win.
Wrong. Those pets have similar or identical abilities as others you can get in game. They aren’t OP.
Except it doesn’t.
You’re entirely wrong.
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This entire set of responses gives you a good idea of what I’m talking about: the wow forum community will come out hard against this argument, with the three typical attacks I gave. It’s weird to see the ppl who are being cheated fighting so hard to attack the idea they’re being cheated.
As for the idea BOE’s don’t matter: many of you know that mythic first was obtained by vigorous BOE buying. If it doesn’t matter, and won’t give you a world first: why did they do it? They did it because it IS an advantage, a significant one. True I won’t be a Mythic lead because I get 3 BOEs…but it does make a significant difference…to deny that reality is to talk your way right out of the argument in the first place.
Personally I hate this move to micro-transactions and agree with the excellent boiling the frog analogy. But my bigger concern is a player base that will deny their own peril…customer reaction is the ONLY thing keeping activision from turning this into pay to win fully tomorrow.
So in reality, since you not able to gain an advantage that is not otherwise available to non-paying players WoW isn’t a P2W game?
You are getting pretty abstract now friend.
AaO is available to Alliance in general, for being Alliance. There is no transaction involved in that process, everyone who is Alliance gets it.
If you pay to change to Alliance, regardless of if you do it for AaO or not, you are paying for the character faction swap service. You are not “paying for AaO”.
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The Mythic World First wasn’t achieved with real money transactions though, the guild used in game gold to buy those BoEs in the exact same manner that players have been able to do since the game was released in 2004.
No one is justifying the act of doing it, we are simply saying that the game isn’t suddenly all P2W.
Personally I also dislike micro-transactions, but in a game that has a hard time capturing new players whilst it steadily loses current players I imagine the company decided it needs another stream of revenue to keep it active.
I refuse to buy paid services within the game at this current stage in time because I don’t agree with a lot of the design choices, but that’s my choice.
If someone else wants to pay $50 so that they can buy a BoE does it really matter to me? The entire game is currently designed around free hand outs and random upgrades. Having someone purchase something makes very little difference in the grand scheme of things.
ROFL. I know you are gonna cling onto the word “required”, but the notion that the Store pets aren’t frequently quite strong and recommend both in PvE and PvP is just ignorant. There is a strong correlation in general between which pets are strong and how they are obtained. The vast majority of wild pets are garbage in battle.
So the whole premise of your ptw argument are boes and battle pets?
Thanks for the laugh OP
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I wouldn’t consider that P2W, since the gear is still available to players in-game that don’t spend money, and they’re not buying the gear itself from the shop(since the gear isn’t sold on the shop).
I’m not being “cheated”. I have gold in game that I earned playing the game, and I have never bought a token from the cash shop to sell on the AH.
You know what their true advantage was? It wasn’t the gear, it was them being on the PTR and learning what they needed to do for world first before w/e it was they were getting world fist for went live.
I’ll agree to the game being pay to win as soon we start seeing people win from paying. The best players in the game pay LESS.
They don’t even pay for their subscription because they get scrubs to pay for it with token gold.
Who gets the best gear? Free to play players
Who gets realm firsts? Free to play players
Who gets the highest PVP rating? Free to play players.
In fact, free to play players are trouncing paid players in every aspect of the game.
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Funny bc arguably the most powerful pvp battle pet is extremely cheap and very easy to obtain.
Blizzard tend to have alot of fanboy from when they’re still a good company (which is no longer the case), even HOTS have alot of rabid fanbase defending Blizz and saying the game is not dead even after its game director is being moved to other game.