Has anyone played on both sides and can explain what Horde does that Alliance does not do, or does the map favor Horde?
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Outside of AV weekend, they donāt try to win. When winning is better HPH because boosted bonus honor, alliance get consistent wins, despite the alleged imbalances.
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They do not try as hard
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Lack of the heart to fight.
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Itās basically because the horde āscorched earth metaā is nearly uncounterable due to the horde respawning in the cave nearby if alliance take IB GY. The hordeās cave location gives 2 key advantages: 1) horde has initiative in deciding how/where to attack by reaching Bal when alliance reaches SH GY, and more importantly 2) it allows horde to defend IB GY with a smaller group.
Hordeās strategy is to take SF GY and SH GY while holding IB GY. This allows horde to pursue a 30 minute scorched earth win by taking all the GYs and forcing alliance into the cave.
The main reason this strategy is possible is that a smaller group of horde defenders at IB GY can take it back by respawning in a larger group at the nearby cave and rushing IB GY. Itās very difficult to overcome 3-4 waves of 15-20 defenders rapidly rushing IB GY from the cave unless alliance has an unbelievable comp.
Thereās virtually no strategy that would allow an equal alliance group to defeat an equal horde group as long as the horde group reacts quick enough defensively while taking SF GY and SH GY.
Yes in imbalanced games where horde have no healers or alliance have perfect comp (lots of mages/hunters/paladins to secure IB GY), itās possible for alliance to win.
But thatās probably doesnāt happen often, and itās created a cascade of other advantages (more horde rankers/better geared horde players join AV) that lead to the imbalance becoming more exaggerated between the factions. And now horde wins 95-99% of AVs.
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Map wasnt designed for alliance to have much of a chance
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The BIG reason is, short queues attract the ābadā element of AFK leechers. I saw the same attitude back in Vanilla on my battlegroup (horde side), which had instant queues for Horde, with the same results.
The map issues are minor (for both sides) but get compounded by uncooperative peers. Most Alliance who go into AV want the exalted gear, which requires farming rep, so they set themselves to maximise the Rep farm, which isnāt the same as trying to win.
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because horde have a 2 hour queue and we make sure to get the win.
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Wonder how they won back in the day? Thatās right. They didnāt give up.
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Because back in the day people didnt understand strategies or how much better horde racials were for PvP
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The root of the problem is the horde cave. After IB is capped, horde revives there, not at FW. The cave has 20 revive slots, double any normal graveyard, meaning up to half of the horde raid can revive every cycle. This makes it nearly impossible for the alliance to get south vs a defending horde raid. The horde can simply throw its weight at IB again and again, and through shear numbers of revives; will stonewall the alliance offensive. The alliance have to kill horde at a 2 to 1 ratio or better to advance.
The alliance have no such advantage because their cave isnāt used until after SP is capped. So to compare themā¦ the horde cave is used to retake IB, along with defending the captain, 2 towers, and all the nearby elites. The alliance cave isnāt used until all of that (on their side) is already gone, G G.
BC did fix this problem by removing the cave respawnsā¦ but Blizzard refused to apply that here, even though they were willing to apply a bunch of other irrelevant fixes we didnāt actually need. There are other imbalances (for both sides), but this is the worst one and itās why alliance can never get south.
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alliance was the larger faction back in the day and bgs were server only so alliance probably almost always had the player advantage
But thatās wrong. The reason Ally struggles holding IBGY is because they leave 4 people there and then try to RIDE SOUTH TO WIN before getting flanked and destroyed to the point where only 4-6 guys make it to FWRH.
To push past IBGY, Alliance has to hold it until it turns, then burn IBT and kill Galv. You should also take SFGY first.
YOU SHOULD NOT EXPECT TO WIN GAMES IF YOU CANNOT WIN FIGHTS.
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Thatās not how objective based PvP works. You can lose every single team fight and win WSG/AB you know, right?
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Its EXACTLY how objective based PvP works you fat nerd. If you canāt win fights at objectives, why do you think you should be allowed to expect to win games based on said objectives?
You donāt try. You havenāt tried since the third party premade maker was broken by Blizzard. You threw up your hands as a faction and went off into the cave to pout.
Keep pouting. Nobody needs gear from AV anymore. People play it for fun only now. Keep hiding in premades in AB/WSG and desperately dodging every Horde premade you encounter because you just want to stomp PUGs. Thereāll come a time where itās only you and the Premades leftā¦ and then youāre right back where you started. Completely forced out of PvP because you expected to win games without being able to win fights.
Iāve gotten to the point where Iām done arguing with you people. You donāt want to listen. You want to be spoonfed wins with absolutely zero possibility of even so much as taking damage, let alone losing.
So Iām going to just sit back and watch the entire PvP system in Classic cannibalize itself and laugh. And laugh. And laugh.
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You need to calm down bud. Thatās a ridiculous over reaction to what I just said.
You donāt have to win any fights to win a warsong. You just have to get the flag across the field without letting them get the flag. Killing their FC and getting your team wiped, is losing the fight and winning the objective.
AB is absolutely the same, you can out-rotate and stall your opponent while losing every major fight and still come out the victor.
You can lose every single fight in AV, but if you kill the general, you win.
Clearly, itās easier to win if you can win fights, but itās absolutely not a requirement or a promised victory just because you can.
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Hallmark of someone that canāt handle what theyāre being told.
See I was just ignoring all this nonsense you spewed since you seem upset for no reason, but like come on dude.
Go read through my post history on that topic. Thatās ideal bud, that would be what I want.
Thereās clearly a lot of pent up anger about something in there, so maybe just calm down and understand what Iām saying to you.
Thereās nothing for me to āhandleā in that pile of nonsense, other than someone attempting to insult me for absolutely 0 reason.
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Dude chill out.
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I feel like lately its been 75% of the time ? Alliance stepped up their game a little bit I find.