See there’s that spoiled attitude right there you think the dev’s changed flying just to spite you…thats awful full of yourself.
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Things can always be better. I’m not sitting here just pissed off about all the negatives. I will jump into conversations trying to improve the process like leveling or flying.
Yeah, it’s no guarantee, but it does help prevent the easy mistakes.
… but history also helps tell us why things are as they are, why we have the nerf curve, gear resets, dazed effects, etc. When people ask for changes, it really does help them to know how we even ended up in the situations we’re in.
Actually rep was almost worthless in Vanilla. The only time I ever felt I needed to grind rep was in AV.
If your best argument was that rep grinding was far worse in Vanilla, you better get back to the proverbial drawing board. It’s far worse now.
Devs wanted to remove flying going forward. Player backlash was so great they reverted that decision within 3 weeks. It doesn’t take rocket science to see the time gate is nothing but a spiteful move. Otherwise why not let us fly once we’ve:
Completed loremaster
Explored every zone
Got revered with all factions
Completed 100 WQs
Sounds like spite to me
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For conversations about lore it’s relevant.
Vanilla was awesome though, before lvl 60 up to 75% of your time was spent taking in the scenery instead of fighting. Even after 60 because you couldn’t afford a mont.
Unless you gave up your marriage to raid you didn’t have a bunch of gold in your wallet bothering you.
And the hate on the forums for none raiders and how irrelevant you were as a person just couldn’t be beat.
But there was grinding you weren’t grinding for rep, you were grinding to train your self up in weapon skill, or to train your pet…so on and so on…so there is comparison when you talk about the two.
I guess if people are just phrasing it as a “You should’ve seen it in vanilla” sort or statement then yeah it doesn’t really have much relevance besides sharing their opinion that “it could be worse”.
However if they’re actually comparing the pros and cons of old systems vs new then I think it’s very relevant.
One common example: Grouping for dungeons. Grouping now is much more convenient and quicker, however you’re much less likely to get to know the people you group with.
Additionally the current model makes kicking or leaving groups much less punishing. On the plus side, if someone is pulling down your group or you have an emergency you have to take care of the only punishment is a 30 minute wait time. On the con side, this can easily be abused and discourages groups from showing patience.
This form of discussion of Vanilla vs Retail is relevant and constructive because it assess the merits of both. That’s the point of a discussion forum.
And in the grand scheme of things, if someone takes solace in the fact the gold farming now is easier than back then, it doesn’t really hurt anyone for them to bring it up here.
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No you seem to be pissed off about people being positive. Which seems…interesting.
Improving the process is fine, no one’s against that, but a current trend online is complaining about the same things over and over for the sake of complaining. And those kind of people seem to do so without acknowledging the good changes that have been made.
That’s why people remind others of what things used to be like. So you don’t forget that there have been changes, things have improved. You don’t need to act like no one ever listens, or that nothing ever changes. We could still be running at half speed and struggling to get 1000g.
Larger perspective.
And now we grind azerite… omg so different!
Agreed there have been tons of improvements over the years, they just want to sit here and continue to make same threads over and over complaining about what they thing these small inconveniences and how it hurts them so.
When we bring up how things used to be in vanilla is like grandpa reminiscing about the days when gasoline was 5 cents a gallon. Just harmless ramblings of old players.
And trying to teach the newbs not to complain so much when things are so much easier today. It USED to be worse and we did all the complaining for years and Blizz changed some things up.
So instead of scoffing at the oldbies, you can thank us.
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If you compare grinding azrite to doing weapon skills then you never did weapons skills. 1st azrite is easy to do, you just fall over and get it, and there are lots of options on how to do it, but you will complain that you will “have to work” to do it. 2nd, Weapon skill to let you know say you were using an 2 h- sword for last 3 months, great…you all the way up on it…and bam…you just scored a elite 2- h axe, well guess what you will be doing for the next 8 hours killing pigs in front of Razor hill to get your skill up to a usefull lvl…hows that for grinding fun…
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Hydraxian Waterlords unless you were a free loader
Brood of Nozdorum/Cenarion Circle… I don’t remember which one was connected to the gear.
Argent Dawn
All were necessary if you wanted to progress.
Then of course the three PvP reputations, which were all necessary if you wanted to progress in PvP.
I’ve only really seen the two compared in mocking an OP or something.
Like… “ugh BFA is so grindy, why do I have to unlock stuff. I’m unsubbing until classic.”
Which is then when you see the, “You think BFA is grindy… try classic” response come out.
At least in my experience.
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Um. What. No. Rep was not worthless.
Hydraxian Waterlords you had to have to summon Majordomo.
Cenarion Circle gave nature resist patterns and gear
Argent Dawn shoulder enchants and frost resist gear recipes (without which is was impossible to do Naxx)
Steamwheedle you even couldn’t use some ships or the AH without your being attacked if you didn’t have rep with them.
Everything had a purpose.
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Weapon skills were super easy, lets not kid ourselves. Literally everything you did in the game leveled your weapon skill. When you leveled, it would go up 5 points… and take you 5 minutes to level it. If you ever did more than that, it was for goofs to level weapons you never used.
Sounds like “be grateful for what you have and never ask for better”
I’d never go back to vanilla because I like a lot of the QoL changes. Doesn’t mean things can’t be better.
It’s not “be grateful for what you have, and never ask for more”, it’s just “be grateful”.
You don’t have to stop asking for more, but many people who are asking for improvements don’t seem to include any appreciation or even acknowledgement for anything that has changed for the better.
This sentiment is just a reminder that not all we get is bad. Be grateful for what we’ve gotten, and ask for more. But don’t just always complain. We have gotten improvements, things could be worse.
Complaining attitudes don’t seem to be a very effective tool in getting what you want. Maybe initially, but after a while it’s wearisome. Seems much more a detriment to our relationship with the hand that feeds, than an effective method of requesting more food.
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I don’t look at Vanilla at all and couldn’t care less about it. If I’m trying to explain something is frustrating, I go into detail as to why, and maybe sometimes pull from Legion as examples as to what I liked, since it was so recent.