The op might want to ask her ex guildies why they would rather face roll farm Molten Core in WoW Classic for the next year and a half instead of doing these “challenging” retail WoW dungeons and raids.
It is all really kind of comical. Even the streamers beat feet to Classic to avoid this great challenging content in retail. Hard does not sell.
Because overtuning is not fun.
It isnt over turning. it is challenging content. overtuned is when with near perfect play something is mathematically unkillable. Something like mechagon was never over tuned. I cleared it a couple of hours after it was released with far from perfect play
The majority of the people that post here are very bad at the game but don’t realize it so they try to justify it by saying that anything hard is too time consuming/overtuned/based on gear ect.
Wow needs another mage tower but with hard-locked scaled gear so that people can get a wake up call
That’s pretty much the opposite of what the game needs. The game lives and breathes on delivering the illusion that each player is better than they actually are. Being honest with them is a good way to drive them off.
I dont welcome Sanguine and Grievous on the same key… but thats just me.
you are on the first step to understanding the ways of the soloist.
you can make this as extreme as you want it lol. I prefer my mythic dungeons and tries at solo raid in legion.
I have some issues with a final “normal” boss before my dance with gul’dan and elisande. I will get past this one day. Hopefully before 9.0 when the new gear and levels make this way easier.
Thing is I know this is a me issue. When you hit a wall in solo raid there is no BS blame game. Or even legit blame game…if the melee is actually that bad call them out on it really lol.
You know its you and you only. In my case it is the huntard that is causing the wipe. Since I usually like my hunters here lol.
I personally like the vanilla feel where you can pull only 2 mobs max because it’s risky to pull any more. I was also a very big fan of the mage towers because that actually put your skill to the test.
What I DON’T like is time-gating and time consuming content. That’s not challenging, it’s just a chore. The allied races for example don’t even feel like they were “earned” but more like paid for with time and money.
A lot of people love challenge but hate the elitist insanity that a lot of the players bring with it.
“big DPS or kick”
“AOTC or no invite”
“one mistake you kicked”
“one wipe and group disbands”
“big raider IO score or no invite”
“wrong class no invite”
“went afk for 10 seconds kick”
With that type of stuff going on constantly, many people just aren’t even going to bother to try harder difficulties.
There are different playstyles. Solo players also like to play the game. I do like a challenge but part of the appeal of mmos is a constent updates. I would very well like to play other single player games if they had updates like mmos constantly but they don’t. It’s nice to talk to people in the game but I don’t feel like playing with them all the time or to attach my progression based on others as well. I would like single player progression options while also being alt friendly so I don’t get bored of my class.
I do enjoy the group content sometimes, I just hate forming my own groups. A lot of the challenging content is gated by group making and even the playerbase gates it further with addons.
When you have to qualify something…
“I don’t wanna sound like a jerk, but…”
I welcome challenge when it has a satisfying reward or achievement. Earning my Werebear and Fury skins from the Mage Tower is something i constantly practiced and attempted until i learned its mechanics.
However BFA doesnr really have any of that, and this expansion also has a gearing issue. I cant find myself devoting time to raiding when i can get the exact same ilv gear from WQs. With tiersets gone, i have even less of a reason to.
BFA might not have a Mage Tower equivalent, but there is plenty of challenging content out there you have not comleted.
Yes and no.
Keep in mind the other motive people often have for video games:
Not everyone plays video games to push themselves, quite a few people play them to relax and forget about their worries. This is why one of the constant complaints about WoW in general, particularly when looking at the endgame, is that it can feel like a second job.
The other thing to keep in mind is that challenge is not the only driver for the RPG genre in particular. Other things that come into play are the narrative, a sense of discovery (often when exploring the vast world), and sometimes working with a team. These are ALL areas where WoW struggles, though the last one is mostly due to the current state of the community (too many jerks, or at least people refusing to consider something other than optimization as a motive).
Heck, even WoW struggles on challenge for the vast majority of the content. Unless you choose to leap head first into endgame content and the higher difficulties, it’s too easy… and with the unhealthy community there and that really not being much motive for quite a few people, they’re justifiably disinclined to even consider doing any advanced endgame content.
Long story short, challenge is only ONE motive for playing an RPG… and quite frankly, games in general (particularly those aiming for a larger audience) tend to fare very poorly when it becomes the primary motive.
Well, I guess Dark Souls capitalized on the absence of challenge in the genre as a whole… but even that series of games has other motives built into it, such as the puzzle-like nature of the narrative that’s fun to piece together on its own.
Nevertheless, challenge is only one component of an RPG’s appeal… and how much challenge people want varies significantly.
One risk with online games in particular is that the vocal minority can demand for too much challenge and make it more important than a significant chunk of the silent majority enjoys… and I think this is a longstanding issue with WoW.
And didn’t they scale back the difficulty after the first game?
Exactly this. I raided a lot in Cata but even there got burned out fast. I might try raiding again in 8.3. I just came back to game a few months ago so for now just want to do story and other aspects of the game. With work etc. I just do not have the time or energy for hardcore raiding.
Well said. 
Not really… if anything, it arguably went up slightly with time.
The biggest difference is that people got used to their type of difficulty and were quicker to adapt to it.
I play to relax-- My life is challenging enough that I don’t feel the need to do challenging content where the challenge has no external meaning.
I think it’s that there’s different kinds of difficulty and people feel like only one kind of difficulty is being privileged over others by Blizzard.
For example, macro-scale RTS games that are heavily focused on resource collection, management, tech trees, diplomacy, etc have a type of difficulty, mainly knowledge based difficulty, that isn’t really represented in modern WoW, which focuses mainly on twitch reaction and boss mechanic timing.
Things like, guild bank resource management, mana management (5 second rule), spell down ranking, overhealing, etc etc etc all sort of were chipped away from the game over time to create a more streamlined raiding or arena experience and have resulted in a lot of people feeling left out of the game.