Neither the Alliance nor Horde can field massive armies after Nazjatar parted and swallowed the ships.
Sorry for the slow response. Coincidentally, the war event procced in Nazjatar and I had to kill Horde and claim strategic points of interest.
https://i.imgur.com/auAXDlC.jpg
Lest we forget THIS is the point this particular part of the argument was coming from. Thank you for walking yourself back again.
And there is.
Alright I think this is done for. The Dwarves are untouchable because Blizzard likes ignoring some races. There. No need to talk dubious lore and stuff anymore. Bye all.
Mcgowan had a legitimate excuse for not understanding that there were armies fielded. You, however, specifically lied.
https://imgur.com/a/3osgO42
Ironforge is too well defended since the Dwarves in the area have strong doors that stand against the Orcish Siege during the Second War and Plus it would be difficult for the Horde to even invade Dun Morogh due to the Mountains and no way for them to get through the Area.
Whatâs your excuse?
Excuse for what? Quest texts back me up. NPCs definitely back me up.
The same way we beat every army.
The Justice League of Azeroth wiped out the enemyâs troops and command structure while the factions of Azeroth stood around with their thumbs lodged in their ears.
The PvP quest frames ongoing battle between the player champions who accompanied the two fleets that got wrecked. Which is why the quest doesnât send you to go kill NPCâs at the other factionâs camp and flight points. Thatâs why itâs a PvP quest to kill other players from the enemy faction. Itâs canon, but it isnât Alliance and Horde armies clashing in Nazjatar.
The Alliance and Horde players arenât their factionsâ armies. Theyâre a bunch of mercenary âadventurersâ with partisan faction sympathies who win wars for the factions because their actual armies are fundamentally ineffective at fighting anything that isnât each other.
Neither are the Ankoan or Unshackled. Theyâre friendly to the respective factions, but they arenât actually in the Alliance or Horde, let alone their armies.
There werenât Alliance and Horde armies in Nazjatar. There were the tattered leftovers of what were armies before the ships sank, seeking aid from the locals while the available superheroes-on-call (players and lore characters) actually took the fight to the naga.
Citation.
Both sides had tasks they saw to.
It absolutely is.
Citation.
Double citation.
Yes there were. I posted screenshots proving that to be true.
This much is true, but thatâs also true during the end of the War Campaign where both the Alliance and Saurfangâs rebels attack Durotar.
My citation is playing the game. The playerâs there. Have you not played the game? Well no, you clearly have. Youâre on the ships when they crash. You accompanied the ships.
Credit for that quest only comes from killing other players in War Mode. Hence, PvP quest. Theyâre explicitly targeted only at the player-represented âchampionsâ of the other faction. One of the quests you cited even specifically says outright to âdrive their champions into a watery grave.â
SoâŚforty guard NPCâs and a few questgivers? Who areâŚsomehow clashing in the field with the Alliance off-screen while at the same time always guarding the quest hubs?
We arenât our factionsâ armies because if we were, we would have no choice but to do as weâre told without direct compensation. Thatâs what any professional army - which the Alliance and Horde employ - is. Obedience isnât elective and paid for case-by-case when youâre in the actual army. Being paid per mission and via loot pilfered in the field is effectively mercenary work.
You did post pictures. And neither quest citation mentioned any army. They say thereâs a bunch of Alliance running around encroaching upon and disrupting the Hordeâs efforts in the area, but thatâs not saying thereâs an Alliance army. Itâs saying there are enemy agents in the area causing trouble that need to be killed.
I.e. the enemy champions/players.
Like it or not, the player-represented champions have been repeatedly established as existing in canon as their own agency within the lore, and when we do something itâs not the same thing as the Alliance or Horde army doing something. Both can happen in tandem, but itâs not the same thing. We arenât just non-canon stand-ins for the actual faction armies; weâre our own âthing.â
Iâll worry about what armies can or canât do when we get Total War: Warcraft.
Until then, weâre left with Blizzardâs Zero-Vulpera-Given approach to everything regarding how things get to places, how logistics work, or how much numbers matter.
âŚsee⌠see what I did there? Because Vulpera are like little foxes, and foxes sound like, see?
It funny. Ha. I kill me.
Thatâd be cool
Dread-Admiral Tattersail:
This is like you not knowing about the Theramore Citizens shown in the Siege of Orgrimmar raid. Youâre not a very reliable raid lore source, are you?
No, it isnât. I provide quests, you claim they arenât canon. Then you claim that gameplay is your citation, despite that gameplay is factually mine.
This conversation isnât going to go anywhere.
Dreadmoore is clearly not willing to actually argue this in a productive manner. He lost the first few arguments about the Dwarves so now heâs doing his best not to lose this one.
Iâm gonna offer a view point I havenât seen yet:
Yes, an assault on ironforge would be incredibly moronic from a military, economic, and morale standpoint, but how many players realistically want to see the dwarves get kicked around?
The reason the dwarf trope hasnât changed is because of how nigh-universally loved they are as creatures. Even your most hardcore of Horde cultist would gladly have dwarves on their side because theyâre just freakinâ charming.
You all saw how many jimmies were rustled when the night elves got kicked around, and weâre used to elves getting kicked around. If people were that upset on both sides about that, just imagine an expansion pre-patch based on kicking dwarves around and having to save them from their home city crumbling to the ground?
There are lore reasons for Dwarves to be untouched, but I would bet money that a vast majority of players would not be up to seeing dwarves suffer because we all remember Gimli and Gloin from our childhoods/adulthood and theyâre always nothing but good vibes for the most part.
I was generally surprised people kept feeding him until I remembered I was on a video game forumâŚ
Just saying things doesnât make them true, even in an echo chamber.
Dreadmoore: Teleporting will work.
Echo chamber: N-n-no it w-w-wonât!!
Dreadmoore: Sure it will. Here are examples.
Echo chamber: T-those arenât c-canon!!
Dreadmoore: Yes they are. Look at this quest text.
Echo chamber: The h-hero isnât a c-champion, theyâre m-mercenaries!!
Dreadmoore: No they arenât. Provide sources.
Echo Chamber: Dreadmoore is w-wrong! Right g-g-guys???