Why allience loses almost every bg

Ret pallys.

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Paladins are insane in BGs. Even meme spec paladins can make huge plays. Idk why people complain about a shaman crit when paladins can make themselves immune from the entire other team.

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I play a ret pally and I win almost every game so you are wrong. You lose because of bad players and people who aren’t engineers or consumable users.

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Actually, it’s bad players. It’s always bad players.

Good players make bad specs good. But it doesn’t matter what spec a bad players is. They’ll make it bad.

And I’ll let you in on another secret. If you find yourself always losing you just might be the bad player.

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Most serious PvPers rolled Horde, for both the racials (as they’re vastly superior in PvP in more situations) and the established community which is the same on retail (though the racials are not a factor as much there).

Given the huge population discrepancy, most people on the Alliance would rather take a quick loss than a grindy loss, as it’s just more H/ph due to very low queue times.

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Trolling.

Experienced wisdom.

In addition to the base kit (LoH, BoF/BoP/BoSac, Cleanse), Repentance is insanely, absurdly good. It stops a FAP’d fc. It stops a flag channel in AB. It stops the enemy priest right when he was about to land the life-saving heal on the warrior. I have even used it to stop my own team mate who was MC’d, right at the edge of the cliff at the lumber mill (yep, saved him).

Sadly, this also is experienced wisdom. :frowning:

More wisdom (damn this is a good thread)!

If we’re looking at the factions themselves, then in my personal experience, I find I can usually predict the outcome of a BG as follows: who has more [geared] warriors? In general, the answer is Horde. Racials might play into this. Think about it: a front line of stun resistant (Orc) and fear-breaking (Forsaken) armored killing machines? There just seem to be a lot more PvP warriors on the Horde, and I can see why.

Anyway, OP, you’re not losing because of Ret paladins any more than Horde win because of enhancement shamans.

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Probably not the reason alliance loses BGs, but ret pallys actually are a real disadvantage.

Ret requires you to actually play well to even have a moderate level of impact compared to other classes. Meanwhile horde has ele shamans which will have an enormous impact even when played by a toddler.

Hpal should have been the savior of alliance, but they are rare since playing them in unorganized pvp is a headache and the rewards for ranking are awful.

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Make themselves immune…and do what? Kill you? Run away then die? Use a short cooldown and blow up 3 poeple at the same time?

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Oh my God, so this. In a random PuG BG, it usually becomes quickly evident that there is no one worth healing, if for no other reason than they do not understand the concept of peels!

Whereas I can queue in as Ret in full healing gear, and because I have HoJ + Repentance, I rely on peels less. Just today I got jumped by a rogue and warrior at the same time. I HoJ’d one, Repented the other, popped BoF and got away. No Divine Shield. That’s ridiculous. My mana efficiency is bad, but my survivability is higher – again, this is in non-organized PvP – so I heal just as much if not more.

If you are not taking advantage of the Horde focusing on the paladin who just saved himself, then you’re doing it wrong. Whether that means killing Horde or getting away, that paladin just created a window of opportunity.

If the horde are still trying to murder an immune paladin who is saving himself, and not blowing up the rest of the team, i think horde are the ones that missed an opportunity.

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No no, I mean they just blew cooldowns to take down an exposed paladin, but he popped Divine Shield. Paladins are tanks in PvP. It takes a moment or two for most Horde to recover. (Plus, you’d be surprised how many Horde simply loathe the sight of a shielded paladin – especially Ret! – and will stick around. :laughing:)

I’ve done enough PVP to know that most horde teams simply ignore the paladin due to lack of threat. Healing an MS’d target is nearly pointless, and blessing of freedom is only an issue in WSG.

The only real annoyance of a paladin is to shield himself and cap a flag in AB, but you just kill him and recap, wasted about 20 seconds of your time.

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Oh, I agree that paladins as a class are not the PvP gods that people make them out to be – outside of organized PvP. Mostly they’re indeed just annoying, regardless of spec.

Given that, well-played Ret paladins bring unique utility to the table as well as some where-did-that-come-from burst damage. It is disingenuous of the OP to assert that Alliance “loses almost every bg” because of ret paladins is all I’m really saying. :slight_smile:

20 seconds can be an eternity if Alliance is hitting another node at the same time. :smiley:

But then you have an Ele Shaman deleting 1-2 people on that node.

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You don’t need a whole group to take down one paladin though. Just one, because they can’t fight back or pose any meaningful threat to anyone.

For the Alliance, PvP is really just a typing game where they try to find the easiest person to scapegoat for losing BS push or first flag push or they get mad and troll their team so hard everyone just forgets about the actual PvP objectives.

This is probably why you see more Alliance premades overall than Horde.

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The majority of the BGs I do on occasion, I face premades as an Alliance PuG. Both sides do it.

It doesn’t help that Horde reach the BS flag first, and have an advantageous position, or that as I said Ele Shaman can delete people.

I don’t know if you’re trolling or not, but it’s because those Shaman crits happen every 8 seconds, but Paladins can only make themselves immune for 10 seconds every 5 minutes.

This is such a naive reductionist view on the issue. Class balance is a thing.

You think Fury Warriors and Rogues are topping damage meters because they’re good players, and Balance Druids are bottom of the meters because they’re played by bad players?

It’s not as simple as “lol Alliance bad.” While I’m sure there is some truth to the statement that Alliance players tend to be worse, that doesn’t negate the fact that some specs are just bad.

So does Blind, Sap, Polymorph, Scatter Shot, and Freezing Trap.

Y’know what breaks all those? Skull of Impending Doom.

Paladin isn’t uniquely capable of CCing a flag carrier with FAP. Not that a flag carrier with FAP is ever a problem when you can purge them of all their buffs. Good FCs are saving their FAP for when they’re clear of the flag room and in/past mid. That means they’ll likely be in range of healers.

What type of debuff is Repentance? Oh, right. Magical. Dispel.

The Horde arguments against Shamans being better in PvP than Paladins are always hilariously misinformed.

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