Are we pretending horde doesn’t premade the other bgs lol? I got news for you they do. I bg with a few friends and some nights it’s nothing but full premades to the point we stop queing.
This is my main problem with the av nonsense. The horde get to premade ab/wsg and if they feel like solo queing they just que up av and abuse the cave/head start situation and get handed honor in there as well. Alliance choices are be forced to premade or lose in av. There’s no decent option for solo alliance pvpers while horde get both.
I never said that but horde tend to play more AV because they have the advantage and there are no premades, i know I will rather run that than solo que vs a premade in any other BG, at least I will do that when I get to 60.
Bro lo. Go read your OWN post history from 8 months ago.
When Horde was asking for 1.5 AV or Korrak’s revenge because of premades, you’re repsonse was always “#nochanges 1.12 AV should STAY at 1.12 AV! If you dont like the current state of AV, just defend.”
NOW that Blizzard removed AV premading your tune is suddenly “Change 1.12 AV! Defend = scorched earth and its unfair!!”
Funny how your script flipped when the win % flipped eh? pure coincidence or…?
And why did Blizzard remove Premading in AV ? …Awwww yes because you… great horde players were crying about premades.
So let me understand You crying because of the premades was cool but us crying because of the map imbalance is not acceptable . The Script FLIPPED when you horde were crying. Now the game didnt flip for 7 months !!!
Correction: horde AND alliance whined about the premades. Though I think it was a bug but Alliance did whine they wanted removal of premades too. Not only that, people in general hated the premade AV meta because it made WSG useless and fosted AFK AV botting. People were legit getting over 1M per week just by botting.
So dont try to act as if it was “only the horde” that hated AV premades though they were the main whiners.
The Alliance issues with the map aside, what youre asking for is essentially TBC AV. TBC AV belongs in TBC. If you’d like, you can argue for 1.5 AV or Korraks revenge (which were what ppl remember when they think Vanilla AV and the map was balanced for 1.5 AV anyways), but then you’d have to eat your own words 8 months ago
Alliance were complaining about matches starting short, which was an actual legitimate bug unrelated to premades which was gasp fixed.
Blizzard could have just fixed that and left the rest alone.
But if they were going to apply the post vanilla changes horde wanted they should have also applied the post vanilla changes alliance wanted. As it is it’s pure pandering to horde.
Yes exactly. However, the PERCEPTION amongst alliance pug players was the it was Alliance premades that were causing it. Whining is whining regardless and if the alliance pugs joined with the horde to get it removed (for whatever reason even if its the wrong one), Blizzard decided to listen. Do you now understand why #nochanges is a thing?
Obviously the alliance pugs were wrong, but there were other issues with Alliance AV premades too. AV premades RCR fellow faction puggers until their premade friends got in. (That got removed that too even though GY camping is a legit thing that existed). GY camping (which also got removed). Then there’s the whole AFK-bot-your-way-to-rank-14 that AV promoted. Then there’s other small imbalances ie. the whole paladin bubble pull vs the horde flee-pull (which i was fine with but thats another topic).
Obviously, AV was causing waaaaay too many issues all over the place so the simplest (and IMO, LAZIEST) solution was to just get rid of AV premading. And honestly, it pretty much “worked” in that it resolved all these weird situations.
Oh i understand premades were causing it, but it still a bug in the match making. Not just a change players wanted, and the fix was to simply fix the bug which blizzard did.
They should have left everything else alone.
Or if they were going to make changes that horde wanted they should have also made changes for alliance. Otherwise blizzard is just pandering to horde.
Did you read what I wrote? There were OTHER issues that came with Alliance premades that affected ALL players. Alliance AV premades did everything they could to gate guard their own faction. It also created the AFK-meta.
I’ve said it 8 months ago and I’ll say it again; the only reason why anyone would want AV premades while not being open to 1.5 AV or Korrak’s revenge (the patch AV was originally balanced around) is because they either want to bot or AFK in AV to get rep/honor.
OR you can just simply argue for the RETURN of AV premades by adding the AV number back in (so revert the change). But based on your post history you were never interested in joining an AV premade since you also rail against premades in the other BGs.
You can say “pandering to horde” all you want but thats straight up not true.
No one cares stupid. The point is horde have a head start and easy mode cave that make ibgy ridiculously hard to take for alliance pugs in av. It is ruining av for an entire half of the player base.
I don’t care what you guys argued about or what your opinion on it is. People wanted no changes and the moment they stepped in and broke alliance premading it stopped being that. Since it stopped being that they need to do the obvious and fix the bg so everyone can enjoy it. This doesn’t even require changing the actual map. Delay horde gate opening by 20 seconds and disable caves being chosen as the respawn point until all grave yards are lost and done. Doesn’t fix some of the other issues but that would be enough.
I got my first classic character to exalted during the alliance premade heyday. Pretending that there was measurable outcry from horde during the period is some disingenuous absurdity.
Alliance were winning more than horde during 1.12 in vanilla WITHOUT discord premades (discord did not exist, and do not even suggest that premades were happening at the frequency that they were in classic), and yet you cannot manage to figure out any strategy beyond zugzug to SH and dismount.
My response would be the same as every other thread. Vanilla Horde lost all the time because queue times were flipped around and the Alliance utilized their back base advantages etc. etc. The arguments been done million times over. Blizzard shouldnt be rewarding bad play. The map is very assymetrical so to expect TBC changes I want earthshield and Hex on my Vanilla shaman.
Upset about AV premades being patched out? Just ask for the number to be put back in. Its very transparent what your real motivations are when there’s an easy alternative like this one but you decide to ask for TBC changes in the “Vanilla” game.
Here you go with your bone headed in actual vanilla blah blah nonsense. Practically everyone mindlessly ran around in their tier sets and knew virtually nothing about the game back then. What a shocker people learned during the last 16 years and now have enough sense to take advantage of imbalances better than when they were clueless little kids.
Kind of like how the majority of horde warriors are orcs to abuse the cheesy racial. Wasn’t as much of a thing back then either.
Regardless back then has no bearing on actual imbalances existing that ruin the bg for alliance. Evidence of this is them breaking premades so horde didn’t get smashed every game. This is why you guys flipping to defend this on every topic don’t ever discuss the 20 second head start, the cave res situation when defending ib or the lok spawning situation and so on. You keep pretending it’s purely player created as if knowing you just lost your 50th av in a row thanks to the cave making ibgy impossible to take for your group isn’t discouraging enough to cause people to afk.
My motives are to be able to enjoy solo que av just like the horde can. I don’t want to pre-made anything. Horde can choose to premade wsg/ab or simply solo que av and still have a good time while honor ranking.
There isn’t a good option for alliance if you don’t want to premade.
You say I’m transparent lol? You think it’s not obvious you guys want to keep your effortless spawn at cave flatten ibgy attacks with double the numbers free wins meta for easy mode ranking solo que?
I see you do not get it: You are asking me if I’m upset about AV premades being patched out…patch what came in because “YOU” Horde players were upset about.
I’m upset because of the positioning of the Horde cave.
Do you know what I would love in an ideal World ? Put the cave back … Something what was FIXED in later games because every damn human with at least 2 neurons realizes the huge advantage… Not possible because It was not in Vanilla ? Ok …compromise… Let Blizzard do a “BASE SWAP” every two weeks… Lets see how you horde will perform If we the alliance had the closest Cave.
Then just roll horde? The reason why Alliance do terribly is because of the fast instant queues = low emotional investment into that particular game.
But then you’d probably complain about queue times.
Sorry you cant have your cake and eat it too.
And if you dont want to premade, you should really quesiton whether or not ranking or even classic PVP is really for you. This is a remake of a 15 yr old MMORPG. Warts and all etc. Play what you enjoy and if it’s not for you, move on