Where is the horde (spoilers)

I didn’t say that.

I asked which Horde characters would make sense being added to the narrative, and explained why the ones I could think of didn’t, or rather, how their addition would likely end up as tacked-on as Baine’s quests in Dragonflight were.

So, which Horde characters would you have added, and doing what?

Literally any of them, Solarion. They all want to save the world.

Jesus wept.

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The only reason horde characters ever feel tacked on is because nu blizzard utterly refuses the write compelling content for them. Nu blizzard uses them as set dressing, or not at all.

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That’s not really an answer. Blizzard could park every single main character in the Horde around different parts of the new content, doing nothing, and you’d be satisfied? I don’t believe that for an instant.

Which is part of the question I asked you:

What do you want these characters to be doing? What, to you, would be a compelling and well written story for each of the characters you want to see present?

Like how it made sense to ignore the race that has had it’s one main lore point being believing in the soul of the planet as their god completely ignored when the whole world soul gets confirmed and then that story gets stolen by the dwarves?

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Forsaken are damned near immune to all things void as are all undead. Void fears death.

Forsaken should be on the front lines.
They should be leading the entire front as combatants and strategists both.

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Citation needed, but let’s run with it for a moment.

Which Forsaken characters would you want present, and how would they affect the stories we’ve seen unfold in a way that, to you, would be satisfying and compelling, without changing the outcome of the story as its been told thus far?

Will of the Forsaken, ICC quest chain re Saronite, Sylvanas shadowlands comic.

I want to see Belmont and High Executor Anselm as grand commanders. Anselm needs to be a DK.

Then plague lad, I’m spacing his name, and Lilian.

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I kinda feel like it’s a dead-ended question because it seems like the expansion’s setting was built from the ground up not to consider the horde at all, therefore any character inclusion would feel out of place.

Like, it wasn’t a set-in-stone thing that we had a surprise underground kingdom of Arathi half-elves. The writers chose to make space for them. They could’ve done the same thing to make a horde character matter too, but so far it seems like they simply didn’t.

I don’t see any reason why a horde player couldn’t simply turn right around and walk through the portal with Thrall instead of sticking around to exist in TWW. And that’s assuming you even cared enough about Dalaran in the first place to want to go get backup to help them.

But screw it, I’ll say Gamon. No, he wouldn’t bring anything useful to the story, nor add an interesting perspective. But at least he’d hypothetically be able to spare me questing alongside Anduin, Alleria, and the Bronzebeards?

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I don’t see how this makes them immune to the Void.

That was in regards to mindless undead under the thrall of the Lich King, not the free-willed sort.

There was a comic?

Commanding what, though?

Let’s assume they were in Dalaran. How large a force would they have brought with them? Would that force have been safely evacuated, or aided in the evacuation, and if so, how? What skills or assets would they have on hand to use? Keep in mind, Dalaran barely had time to evacuate people, let alone supplies. I’m not sure the Forsaken commanders could count on Blight or reinforcements until Thrall’s return.

So, which characters do they interact with, and what meaningful, compelling story would you see unfold for them?

Speaking for myself I recall the quest where an Earthen Caretaker is going senile as he’s approaching shut down. I think that could’ve made for a powerful bonding moment between Forsaken and Earthen characters, as the Forsaken suffer a similar fate. How the Earthen handle it, the idea of memory gems, etc… could have had a profound influence on the Forsaken approach to their own final death.

Granted, that’s not exactly a heroic moment, but for the race of Death to see how a race that’s more animated than alive embraces their unique concept of death could have been interesting, and opened up new views into death itself, and the legacies left behind.

The cult of forgotten shadow was retconned to be an alliance organization when it was a forsaken religion, so there’s that, too.

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I see you’re intent on fabrication and pretense.
When I get home I’m going to write a long in depth post complete with citations.

I’m intent on a conversation. Thus far, thanks to talking to you I have found an instance where Horde characters could have been inserted into the setting with a deep and meaningful connection to the Earthen and their culture. If I had to pick, I’d say Master Apothecary Faranell would’ve been a good choice for it. Granted that’s out of my own desire to see the Royal Apothecary Society veer off of researching weapons of mass destruction, and more towards research that enables them to better support the unique biological and psychological needs of the Forsaken.

How much comfort might the Earthen practices for death bring to those Forsaken facing their final death, for example? How might those practices be adapted to better suit the Forsaken and bring a sense of peace to them in their final days?

The use of a lamp as a symbol for death might’ve become a new aspect of Forsaken culture; their deeds keeping light in the world long after their own has been extinguished.

The funny / frustrating thing for me is like… okay, BFA sucked the big one, and the prepatch ruined everything forever. I felt like I could at least try to justify the expansion purchase to myself with “well at least maybe I can ignore the faction war and try to enjoy Zandalar”.

I didn’t, but at least that little temptation was there.

And I was concerned about how relevant the Dragon Isles would feel to me as a horde player, but at least that expansion promised dragons. Shame 10.2 ruined the ending for me, but I was already bought in at that point. And I got my tauren mage in the end, so there was something.

But I don’t feel any of that temptation for TWW. And I feel bad for it because I’ve never felt like missing an entire expansion before, but kobolds don’t feel worth the $50 price tag, y’know?

I dunno, I wish I could talk myself into buying the expansion because I’m really bored and WoW being there has been a constant for my leisure time for so long, but there’s no bait for me this time. Maybe in a few months if a later patch turns out promising and the expansion goes on sale, but… meh. And it’s extra discouraging because it feels like a lot of the defenders for TWW say this is a good thing out of some perceived rebalancing that I somehow missed benefiting from in the past. :confused:

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This expansion isn’t only about the earthen.

I thought this expansion story was mostly the work of the previous team? The prominence of Anduin suggests Golden involvement.

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As for the quest about the earthen shutting down, AFAIK it’s meant to be a metaphor for losing a loved one to Alzeimer’s and as much as it sucks to have to say, I think including a forsaken character there for their own perspective would do nothing but water down the metaphor by trying to split the spotlight.

Nor is this conversation, but the example I brought up thanks to our conversation was just one example of how a Horde race (the Forsaken) and character (Faranell) could’ve been implemented in a satisfying way.

A few dozen more sprinkled throughout the example and perhaps it wouldn’t feel so tilted.

Another example coming to mind with be Gazlowe and, ‘Steelshanks.’ If that isn’t an ideal combination of characters to play off of one another, I don’t know what it.

Summary

The character of Steelshanks is a smuggler in Dornogol who provides the Earthen the contraband they need to follow their edicts at peak efficiency, with the caveat that smuggling in and of itself is a breach of Edicts. Councilward Merrix, whom seems to be overall in charge, is actually Steelshanks, in secret. He breaks the Edicts himself to see other Earthen given the resources they need to fulfill their own edicts.

If the “M’uru’s Sunwell bath triggered the Arathi emperor’s vision in Year 26” theory plays out into Midnight, or really if these half-elves are slated to contribute in that expansion at all, then the BEs probably should establish some kind of relationship with these guys. Faerin’s surname alone should provoke a minor scandal back in Silvermoon.

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I disagree. The Forsaken themselves all suffer that exact fate.

It’s no different than the Blood Elves empathizing with the Nightborne over magic addiction and withdrawal back in Legion.

In a way, including the Forsaken might have deepened it. As a race the Forsaken suffer that very fate, after all.

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