Just logged into my outlaw rogue from DF, and it’s incredibly disappointing to see another survival hunter treatment with some abilities being baked into the kit.
Was it really so hard to press another button for ambush or having echoing reprimand be an active ability? Outlaw was praised for its complexity for a long time, but it’s feeling pretty bare-bones (pun not intended, remove roll the bones)
Idk who asks for these prunings, but it’s getting frustrating because it’s happened on ret, surv, and now my old outlaw.
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I think they pruned the wrong buttons to be honest. Full disclosure I am against any pruning because talents that are active are more often dwarfed in potency compared to passive talents. So pruning active talents feels overall bad.
Losing MFD, Sepsis, ER, Dreadblades, just is bad overall.
Ambush I still key bind separately along with SND because serious Rogue players still key bind these separately due to stealth/shadow dance stance bar changes.
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Yeah, I still have my ambush where I left it, but it takes away those niche situations where you might want to generate only one combo point after getting an ambush proc.
I can’t stand having to redo my bars, either. Hollow blocks where buttons I used to press went feels terrible every time it happens, and ret was the absolute worst offender for me when they reworked it.
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Everyone has their opinions as far as what abilities they enjoy using.
I don’t miss any of the buttons that were removed. Outlaw was bloated for sure. The only thing I miss is Dreadblades, but in this current Sublaw style of play, it’s not even necessary because combo points fill up so fast.
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“Bloat” feels like a term old gamers use to cope with their dwindling reaction time. I’m 32 and have no issues playing specs like enhancement shaman or blood dk.
Once you have over 36 keybinds, I can understand wanting some things trimmed down, but most specs in the game aren’t reaching that point, and outlaw never did.
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Bloat is a word similar to clunky or casual that can mean different things depending on who is using it.
To me, bloat doesn’t just mean too many buttons, but also that those buttons are redundant within the kit or are unpleasant to play with.
For me, things like thistle tea, echoing reprimand, ghostly strike, and blade rush were bloat. Why do we need separate attacks that increase our damage by 15% or make a few finishers deal extra damage? That isn’t worth an extra ability hotkey. Bloat is very subjective though I am not denying that.
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This lovely thing called skill expression that can widen the gap between a brand new player and someone who puts in the time to master their spec is the reason why.
If you can squeeze out extra damage by executing a perfect rotation, that gives room for improvement across all types of content, and that is why such things belong in games. The wider the distance between the floor and ceiling, the more impressive a flawless execution is.
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Skill expression isn’t an excuse for redundant and bland abilities cluttering up a spec and making it unappealing to a broader player base.
Macroing thistle tea with symbols of death and shadow dance is just silly for example. Two separate minor damage boosts with energy gains.
By your logic they should add 30 additional abilities to all classes that each do some flat modifier. That would be totally fun. Can you imagine the skill expression.
Clearly, there is a point where active abilities become excessive, but the more specs are trimmed down to current ret paladin levels with crusader strike being turned into auto attacks and wings being set and forget, the more bored people are going to get at the high end of play.
Reworks should function the way enhance shaman did by giving people options for more or less active abilities based on preference, where those who can manage the additional buttons are rewarded.
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100% agree. The way they handled Ice strike was as close to perfect as you can get in response to player feedback. The trick is balancing those options as to not create the illusion of a choice, which is something that they often fail to do.
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I can agree with that. What I don’t want to see are more hunter situations where core abilities get baked into others for increased output with less demand from the player.
If Warlocks could upkeep dots by spamming shadowbolts, for example, the spec would be completely bland to play.
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Aww but they had to bake Ambush onto one button, this way they could completely screw over anyone trying to make a castsequence macro.
It gave them plus one in their evil ratings.
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Completely forgot those existed, but didn’t they mess them all up in DF? Remember a ton of people having issues
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