When the gilded crests were made available in M8 along with some other small adjustments we were told that was just the tip of the iceberg and more changes were coming. Crickets since then with the exception of the usual class nerfs. How the hell are you supposed to progress from 626 gear when you have 3 chances at M track gear from your vault? I did receive 2 useful items, but I also received 2 useless vaults as well. Why does M track gear not drop from 10 and above? That’s essentially the end game of M+.
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One piece per week has always been the standard. The hero track was closer in power level in DF S3/S4 and you are not too far behind with all hero pieces.
However, it’s not smart this season to upgrade past 4/6 unless you loot top-tier trinkets. Because they added 2 more steps to the myth track and the myth track gears from the vault are only 1/6. Many people hold 90 crests every 2 weeks to craft unless they looted best-in-slot items from a raid or vault.
Blizzard massively screwed over anyone that doesn’t mythic raid this season and you have to queue +10 for vault but you have to queue against 630s who do mythic raid. Your only choices are to join a mythic raiding guild or pugging up to 4/8 mythic bosses depending on how the group is going. Otherwise, you sit on your hands and wait for vault items (hope you don’t get unlucky).
In my opinion, pugging to the first 2 mythic bosses is easier than +10. M+ have way more problems than this. The key depletion system is more punishing this season due to Challenger’s Peril, AOE stop changes and the keyholder holds all the risk. That caused the people to be more picky with what they took and made it harder to get invites for 615-619. Unless you have a group of friends/guildies for M+.
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Higher keys don’t drop mythic track because they don’t have a lockout.
They could always say, add a dungeon ID based lockout and assign certain dungeons certain key levels to award a once a week chance at mythic track loot, reduced to 1 per 5 to match raids, for some parity.
Like a 10 mists and Arakara, then 11 Dawnbringer and CoT, then a 12 NW and siege, then finally a 14 GB and SV.
And you have to do the dungeons in that order, and once you clear the first dungeon you’re locked to that 5 man for all future dungeons that week.
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To the title key pushers and beyond, +10s are not high keys and certainly not end game which makes sense mythic gear doesn’t drop from mid range keys.
That won’t solve anything. The jump from +11 to +12 is daunting and creates a pressure/increasing toxicity environment. Mythic raiders will do +10 for vault slots and non-mythic raiders will still struggle to join +10. The keys are higher than +11, mythic raiders will only get invites. Failing a key is so punishing that people are more picky with what they take because the keyholder holds all of the risk and reduces crests reward from depleted keys.
Blizzard are shooting themselves in the foot for many reasons on M+ adjustments.
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slightly off topic here but - as a raider, do you think heroic raids on a daily lockout (similar to Remix) would be good for the game or PvE in general?
I have a feeling the “upcoming changes” were just the dungeon nerf notes they put out, which went live on a reset. Believe the crests change was a hotfix.
Don’t get me wrong… I hope they make more changes. But the way I read it, or maybe tried to lol because I don’t expect much, was that the “upcoming” changes were just their little tweaks which already occurred. The crickets say it all imo 
So, someone who raids AND does keys gears faster than someone who only does keys? So weird.
How about someone who raids mythic that doesn’t also do keys? Oh wait, that doesn’t exist lol.
I don’t know, since keys don’t have a lockout maybe it would be ok, but I feel like it would just lead to burnout.
Maybe try 2 lockouts per week?
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I think even twice a week would accelerate burnout too much to be good in the long term. There does seem to be a significant disparity in the reward structure that I don’t think is consistently reflected in the difficulty of mythic raids.
Perhaps mythic gear could be moved to a token system rewarded from clearing raid or M+, with a weekly cap. It immediately doesn’t sound as fun, with a much lower chance of getting overflow loot from traded drops, but it would at least create parity in the time-to-gear ratios.
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Bi weekly if they keep current rewards the same. That would be a huge step up.
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For M+ players without raid, upgrading the hero past 4/6 is a horrible idea unless you get S-tier trinkets or something. Because they added 2 more steps to myth and myth from m+ vault is only 1/6. You need to hold 90 crests every 2 weeks for craft.
The problem is that they won’t join 10s at 619-623ish because 630s will apply +10 and blow them out. They would be in LFG hell to join 10s or use their keys. Failing a key is punishing because the keyholder holds every risk and only 5 crests from depleted keys. Challenger’s Peril and Xal’atath’s Bargain can kill the keys. Xal’atath’s Bargain: Obvillion literally kill many keys with zero counterplay for example. Getting myth gears and upgrading them is insanely slow for M+ players.
You still are seeming shocked players who raid AND do mythic+ are gearing faster than those only doing mythic+ pugs.
You never compare against people who only mythic raid pug and don’t do mythic+ which is the applicable comparison. But it’s also because it’s a joke, that type of person doesn’t exist.
Also why can’t all these 619ish people just group with each other?
Because failing a key is so punishing, the current state of M+ encourages everyone to be very picky with what they take and take no risks. The keyholders (619ish) won’t want to take 619 to 10s.
10 ilvl gap between heroic and mythic track is quite big.
I talked about the hero track in DF, you were not behind with all the hero pieces in DF. This season, spending gilded crests on hero pieces is a terrible idea unless you loot top-tier hero trinkets from raid and this is 20 ilvl gap. M+ players hold 90 gilded crests every 2 weeks for the craft. That gap is too big and this is a problem.
If its a good group they will be taken. I usually see 615 to 626 on my 10’s.
Not everything is determined by IO or ilvl.
Players just need to be able to buy an item to upgrade their item track to the next tier instead of picking a vault reward.
Requirements:
- Mythic raid items: have at least killed a sum of 5 bosses that drop mythic track items
- Heroic raid items: have at least killed a sum of 5 bosses that drop heroic track items
- Normal raid items: have at least killed a sum of 5 bosses that drop normal track items
- M+ mythic track: have at least 10 dungeons timed on a track that rewards vault mythic track items
- M+ heroic track: have at least 10 dungeons timed on a track that rewards vault heroic track items
- etc.
Cost:
- Heroic → Mythic: 6 vault tokens, + 50 gilded crests, + 1200 valor stones
- Normal → Heroic: 4 vault tokens, + 50 runed crests, + 1000 valor stones
- LFR → Normal: 2 vault tokens, +50 whatever crests, + 800 valor stones
This way we can farm items in M+ if we want to and upgrade them. No longer will you be stuck with a lower tier item and never see the heroic or mythic version. You can’t willynilly upgrade your items because you first need to actually have finished the content to unlock the upgrade.
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You realize that +7s drop Hero track that can be upgraded via Gilded Crests to 626 right? You already have a way to get there from +8s.
Who promised more adjustments? Why do you feel we even need adjustments? Is it possible that the challenge you are perceiving is due to your lack of skill?