It’s kind of scary how so many years after it’s been removed you kind of sit back and go “maybe hit rating really did server a purpose”
I miss hit, expertise and reforging for sure. I miss the whole wotlk min maxing meta
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Yeah I really miss hit
I feel like this 3 star system seems to be a little weird and yeah I didn’t count versa because it’s Maybe the most boring stat ever
Me too and i should add, pvp only stats… yeah i really miss those.
As demo, by the end of antorus I managed to stack 54% haste. It was nuts, felt amazing though.
I’d say more of attempt to make WoW an e-sport.
Bring back reforging and valor.
Know what the best thing about this…you have to hang onto that high ilvl item in ur bags that ur never gonna use so you can trade guildees the other worthless “upgrades” that u get
Primary stats used to have secondary bonuses for non-tanks. They took that away awhile back so now it’s just tanks I think who get an extra benefit, since primary stats otherwise would be mostly useless for them. I’m not sure if the whole “secondary stats are almost always better than primary stats” thing started before or after that change, but it certainly can’t help things.
That aside – Primary stats are a flat numbers boost. There’s not much synergy to be had there. Haste and Crit especially tend to have really good synergy with spec mechanics that result in more increases than the flat amount from a primary stat increase.
Maybe the solution is to just have Primary stats passively grant +All Stats as some small fraction of the whole? Boring, but would give it extra value that would be unlikely to be outclassed by secondary stats.
It has been true in wow’s history plenty of times. Back in the day when abilities scaled harder off Attack Power than they did anything else. That’s the issue. They don’t any more.
Lets look at it like this: at baseline for AP to be more powerful than any other secondary, it would have to scale at a rate in excess of 2.0 x Attack Power.
100% haste = skills going off 100% more (effectively hitting twice as often, doubling dps).
100% crit = hitting for 200% (effectively doubling DPS)
100% mastery is… a pita since it’s so diverse, so I’ll skip.
increasing ap 100% over baseline would have to have an impact greater than just 100% more dps than original to beat crit and haste. No idea how much, and secondaries would have to be way closer in terms of effectiveness for every spec, but they could just turn that AP scaling up to whatever is necessary to make it king stat for everyone.
I’m talking 10x scaling if they have to. “but bosses would be trivial!” buff their Hp to compensate. “But pvp would be 1 shots!” buff our hp to compensate.
Count the gem sockets.
They should have reduced secondary stat scaling and nerf gems by like 50%. But hey what does the devs know, their lead dev is healing with tectonic thunder on his rshaman.
I had I think a constant 70-75% haste as Enh during Ant since the haste proc from the artifact had basically a 100% uptime and gave like 21% haste with 6 points in it. I don’t remember though.
They thought they were going to fix everything by reducing the amount of secondary stats on the gear but all they did was increase the demand making them more valuable.
What you are trying to say it patently incorrect.
The choice is never and has never been between secondary stats Vs primary stats when upgrading gear. You always increase your primaries. You have no choice in this.
The reason for weighting stats against one another in the first place is to compare options. You are never in a position to chose Primaries over secondaries. Primaries are a forgone conclusion. Every piece has them. Secondaries aren’t always present, those hands will not always be Crit/Mast and therefore weighing them against Crit/Haste hands has a purpose.
The main reason a 400 piece could lose in terms of performance to a 415 piece is all to do with secondaries valued against each other. If both pieces include your best secondary stat the higher ilvl piece will invariably be an upgrade.
![:rofl:](https://d38bqls1q93fod.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/rofl.png?v=6" ":rofl:")
Circa Cata ability formulas were changed to use Srictly Attack power. Abilities scale more off of attack power now than they ever did at any point in the past. Weapon damage has completely been removed from most formulas and many don’t even include a base damage portion anymore.
The value of Haste, Crit, Vers, and Mast isn’t because abilities scale more off of them than they do primaries. The reason they are valued higher is the fact that over time many of the games mechanics have changed and quirks have been stamped out.
Rppm and just general class procs scaling off haste is a reason it is valued higher in the current game than the past. Every class also got Pandemic for dots following MoP. Tick break points were a large reason haste maintained a lower value when weighted against other stats.
Many past abilities were unable to crit and therefore didn’t benefit from it.
Hit, Expertise, Def, Parry, Dodge, Armor Pen, ect were removed from the game. Thus, while the item budget and rating formulas haven’t drastically changed there are less stat types occupying the space.
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Right and that’s what I take issue with. Secondaries should be a secondary consideration and a way of offering “well, now that I have my maximum achievable ilvl equipped, I can work on sorting out my secondaries to be perfect!”
I should always be using my highest ilvl gear first and foremost.
Also, secondaries aren’t ever just competing against each other. That’s why a 400 ilvl piece can be better than a 430 ilvl piece. Because, despite the primary stat increase being HUGE over the 400, the secondaries have such a high impact they can still be better for DPS.
Again, dumb design. So long as there’s discrepancies between two choices that are very appreciable, choice will be an illusion. In the context of wow’s game with casino loot, all that means is the person who god-rolls all their loot with correct stats from m+ chests and world quests, etc, ends up being more powerful for no other reason than they got lucky, and that is absolutely grade F bottom tier game design.
I’m not entirely opposed to this on some level, because it allows non-raiders different paths of gearing up, whether they intend to use that gear to raid or not. This is especially true for those of us who PvP, as PvP is more reliant on world quests, weekly chests, rated PvP drops, and warmode chests to gear up.
I don’t think it’s a problem that players are able to gear up to a Heroic raid level without raiding (although I know quite a few raiders who think otherwise.)
My issue is more with the fact that it has become very difficult to know if an item you receive, whether via a quest, a raid boss, Residuum, or a Mythic+ weekly chest, is, in fact, an upgrade in performance without running through a sim. While this doesn’t bother me, personally, it causes more casual players to suffer, especially when trying to get into Normal raiding or low Mythic+ keys, because they may be unwittingly scrapping/vendoring/sharding gear based solely on item level, even though that gear would provide a substantial improvement in their raid/keystone group’s performance. I think that it discourages some players from getting into raids/M+ key runs as part of the game, because unless they learn about how to maximize their performance with sims and stat weights, they get frustrated with why they can’t parse well or why they look so bad on details/WL charts.
This is the problem that happens when you squish numbers and don’t actually address the issue, yet continue to make such huge ilvl leaps per tier.
Main stat has not had any actual relevance in years. Int, Str, and Agi can all go away and we will notice no impact except on trinkets.
Part of the issue is that they nerfed a lot of the secondary effects that main stat gave HARD back in WoD.
Crit was nerfed for intel and agi, think the spellpower/ap was altered as well. I think by half.
Turns out that was a stupid idea, shocker.
This isn’t just 100% incorrect, it’s around 2000% incorrect.
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