Liam chose to die in the place of his father. One son willingly gave his life for his father and his King.
Meanwhile, the Alliance wiped out a settlement, and forced its populace to flee into a death trap of wild creatures.
Liam could have sat by and possibly been spared. Sylvanas did spare the Crowley’s, and she kept her word with them.
The Tauren civilians had no such choice. They were massacred for being in the Alliance’s sights, or for fleeing their assailed settlement.
Well, yes, but I think your post was the exception, Aviala.
If I had to give MY most cringeworthy lore argument? It’d be trying to deny that the Purge was a significant and brutal action against the Blood Elves. Unfortunately, Blizzard also appears to adopt that stance what with the latest BfA developments.
Mental exercise- reverse time to pre-cata. Instead of being wiped out by Forsaken nonsense, Southshore is put under traditional siege. Honorable Horde commander leaves shoreline route open so citizens can flee and ground be secured with less loss of life on both sides.
Alliance elements that flee are killed by naga.
Well intentioned Horde commander later offed by vengeful Southshore survivor’s plan.
I’m not asking for a reply to this from anyone, because it’s only a question to ask one’s self. How do you feel inside, differently, about this situation?
When a horde player tell me that the alliance is as bad as the horde because at that one time that 1 or 5 people died justifies the mass murder of alliance civillains.
and i am like… yeah no. the alliance needs to do a lot before being at the same level of evilness.
And also when some ally players says “the horde abandoned us at broken shore” are you serious? if anything they all should have retreated sooner.
honorable mentions to people saying that tyrande was an evil witch for telling nightborne the true.
and also those who think that it was malfurion in valsharah crying.
When someone claims a race, class, or race/class combo must behave a certain way with no room for creativity or else they are “lorebreaking” (in other words, not RPing a cookie cutter archetype).
Oh. My. God. I forgot that bit. Look, I’m a big Horde fan. I look for those times when the Alliance isn’t a shining beacon of moral righteousness. But add up all those times, from WCIII to present, and the Horde under Garrosh did far more, far worse, and far uglier acts. Trying to imply Camp T is equal to Ashenvale alone, let alone Theramore or Darnassus, requires actively ignoring scale and the actual events.
Well… I mean, she’s a witch for saying it, but not because she wasn’t right. She’s a witch because time and place, girl! You’re recruiting forces to fight the Legion. Maybe don’t bicker until the fighting’s over. Save it for the after-party.
You can be right and bite your tongue.
Wait what? They had to retreat or die. It looks like a betrayal from the Alliance point of view but we know better from the omniscient point of view. Why did they make that claim? It makes no sense.
On topic: people saying Night Elves got their vengeance.
Of course, i would have really liked that the alliance did something of this “morally gray” in dazar’azlor so i wouldn’t be so angry at the horde and maybe be a little angry to my leaders but no, “the king wants to avoid civillians casualities” 
Really? why we are even caring about their civillians when they showed no mercy to ours?.
Not really, like, i think she asked a very fair question.
“how do i know that you are not going to be the next ellisand”
Does she even knows thalisra?
And she still supports them by sending her troops.
if she was truly a witch she would say “nah, screw you traitors scum i am going home”.
That Horde is not evil incarnate and must be destroyed.
Destroyed!
Destroyed I say!
I suspect people already know this, but because Blizzard will give us literally nothing to build grievances off of, Horde players have to either give up in despair or dig really, really deep to come up with something. It’s all we have, and when people try to take it away, it reads as people trying to dismiss any grievance the Horde has at all, which is incredibly unfair.
Everyone knows the ledger is already terribly unbalanced by the Horde’s actions. Trying to unbalance it further by erasing the Alliance’s actions feels even worse.
Because once they started working on Shadowlands, the devs decided everything was a part of Sylvanas’s master plan. Broken Shore? Master plan. Battle of Lordaeron? Master plan. That time you woke up with one shoe on, lipstick on the toes of the uncovered foot, wearing nothing but pieces of a Mickey Mouse costume? Master plan.
Clumsy retcons, got it. Even from Sylvanas’ point of view it was the sound decision. It’s dumb to try and shoehorn it in as something evil she did.
Maybe because these events are supposed to be…bad…and not just be shot down with a “But incident/event XYZ” was just as bad?
A response like this says you didn’t comprehend or chose to deliberately ignore the rest of my post.
Funny. I agree with you both.
If the Horde burned a thousand Teldrassils, a Tauren who lost his son or brother or wife at Camp Taurajo may still feel the need for satisfaction.
Even if one feels the Horde has been more exuberant in acquiring justice… they still committed wrongs. Same for the Alliance.
Just because the Horde burned Teldrassil, that does not make Camp Taurajo, the Purge of Dalaran, or the burning of Vulpera Caravans a good thing.
It cuts both ways, imo. A greater harm does not erase a previous harm.
My answer was not faction-specific, the incidents stand alone, that is what I wanted to say, they are not in comparison with each other.
Taurajo was no worse or less bad than Southshore. But has nothing to do with each other directly.
The number of these tragedies is higher on the horde side, yes, and the scale is many times bigger, yes, but it’s not meant that these events follow some kind of “balance”, but are supposed to represent tragedies that arouse strong emotions, that’s their intention with that.
thats what i mean 
Sure, putting a strict 50/50 balance quota on grievances makes things too predictable. My point was that this ledger is already far, far imbalanced in favor of the Alliance, such that we don’t also need people trying to erase what little Horde players have left to hold on to.
Of course Camp T is overblown, but that’s because Blizzard refuses to give us anything else.
But if you know for sure that these events stand for themselves, then why defend them instead of just saying: Yes?
You’ve never seen me deny that in Event X race/faction Y did something wrong when it was like that-no matter which faction-if it sucked, that it really sucked.
This is using a lot of words to say very little. What point are you trying to make? I am talking about Horde players having some sense of justification to hold on to, not whether or not events stand alone?
What I’m trying to say is:
Why defend it when you know it’s what happened, why not just admit? You have never - never - seen me, for example, deny a crime committed by a faction/Race in any way.
There are, of course, more difficult cases with different points of view, and where the lore is not clear enough to really support one side now, but…at the end of the day with the clear cases, instead of just discussing something dead or, as you say, justifying it, for real objectively, we should just stick to the lore given? I mean, we are not in the world, we are players, our chars don’t know everything, but we as players do.
Our characters can still scream at the top of their lungs For the Horde without us feeling exactly the same.