What class is going in the wrong direction?

I’ll just copy and paste this small note from WoWhead about the disc ramp-up phase, which is by no means exhaustive only covering burst healing and not even beginning the discussion of CDs, light damage patterns and the vagaries of atonement vs direct healing:

  1. Refresh Purge the Wicked and make sure Harsh Discipline is active before you begin applying Atonement.
  2. Cast Rapture.
  3. Apply 8-10 Atonements via Power Word: Shield until Rapture duration ends. Apply your last Atonement with Flash Heal as this will apply Atonement to you and your target thanks to the Binding Heals talent.
  4. Cast Power Word: Radiance, Shadowfiend, then the other Power Word: Radiance charge. Always good to cast one on melee and one on ranged.
  5. Extend active Atonements with Evangelism.
  6. Cast Shadow Covenant.
  7. Cast Schism.
  8. Cast Light’s Wrath.
  9. Cast Penance.
  10. Cast Halo.
  11. Cast Mind Blast.
  12. Refresh Purge the Wicked as needed.
  13. Cast Mind Blast.
  14. Cast Mindgames.

This brief ramp up includes 27 different spell casts for a very brief raid window AND those casts rapidly switch between non-targeted CDs, targeted DPS spells and direct (friendly) atonement applicators to add more confusion.

2 Likes

Evoker, augment was a massive mistake

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Sounds like this is raiding pov. I don’t raid, no comment.

I’ve noticed something kind of interesting with a couple of specs I play.

The one that comes to mind right off is hunter. I play marksman but also survival.

When I choose talents for survival, I’ve noticed that there are mm talents mixed in.
Maybe I’m reading the talent tree wrong or maybe because I don’t play survival very much or hunter for that matter, that I’m confused but I find it weird that I have talents in survival that I know I’ll need a bow for yet survival doesn’t use a bow.

There is a couple of spec choices where you can use your polearm weapon as a finisher for what used to be a mm talent but it seems there’s a few more that just doesn’t make sense to me. Idk, I just found that weird.

Same with warrior. Prot uses a shield, arms doesn’t yet arms has shield slam.
Why?

Yeah, I could see it being a completely different beast in M+ since you can get by with much easier atonement management and the direct heal options from FH, PW:S, penance and PW:Life. Assuming the group is good at mitigating damage and nothing too unexpected happens.

It’s very manageable in M+. Never tried Disc in raid but it seems annoying!

Monk our Class and Spec trees are a mess and they keep trying to push Mistweaver towards having a caster playstyle.

3 Likes

easily your 30th time posting this, still equally as untrue as the first time you posted it.

Evoker. It’s been a dumpster fire since launch.

1 Like

Idk about class, but Outlaw rogue for sure. Roll the Bones is an idiotic gimmick that they need to drop.

Warrior. BFA 8.3 with corruptions had the best version of Arms I’ve played so far. Fury has been stagnant since its rework in the Legion pre-patch.

Protection’s design quite good right now.

DPS warriors continue to suffer without 100% uptime, and Windfury (moreso for Arms), and it feels kinda bad to be a tryhard in the current era.

Right now… I would probably say that asking everyone’s opinion, it would be the class that they are currently playing.

Rogues are getting a rework, so until we see what that looks light, they are undecided.

Every other class/spec depending on who you ask, is going in the wrong direction.

My personal opinion, is first hunters, particularly Survival. I play it, and its not that bad, but it just feels like two different people designed it, and they didnt communicate to each other. Then half of each design was taken and mashed together. There is potential there. But mastery only affecting half or less of their dmg is a problem. MM hunter has had its niche chipped away at, which was AoE/Cleave. The spec itself has bones, but not a lot to flesh it out. And BM is in an odd spot. It can only perform so well, otherwise it will be too good, so it always hits a mid expansion plateau.

The main issue is their survivability and utility. The class as a whole really brings nothing that other specs cannot bring. But other specs of classes, bring utility and survivability. For this flaw to be ok, Hunters would have to do top S-Tier DPS. But they dont, so they are in a pretty bad spot.

The other Class I feel is going in the wrong direction is Monk. For some reason I just feel like none of the specs really work. Both thematically and functionally. WW monk’s design is both flawed and good. The problem is that they cannot figure out what to change or balance in order to have it have meaningful single target with less AoE, or Blasting AoE and less single target. It has an interesting mastery and utility. It has decent survivability. But it can either blast AoE, or sacrifice a bunch of AoE to do tank dps single target.

Brewmaster feels off. It feels like they just gave it every single monk button that they had. It is complex, but not in a good way. Its mitigation is great, but it feels like it poorly synergizes with its kit. In a lot of ways, it feels like the mitigation buttons and the DPS buttons are completely separate in their functionality and the two halves of the spec operate independently from each other.

And MW Monk, it probably in the best spot of the three specs. But due to it being a roller-coaster of performance tuning based on patch, and it not being a very forgiving healer to play make many avoid playing it. And when I say its unforgiving, I mean that it takes skill to play and utilize mana. You can go OOM very quickly. It has a good healing kit, but it doesnt really bring anything other healers dont. And its raid external does not compare to other classes.

And lastly… Warlock. I really like playing Warlock. But it just feels like they dont really know where they want the spec. Demonology keeps getting propped up by PI. And keeps getting the bulk of its DPS shoehorned into CD windows. Which makes the time in-between those windows pretty dull. And makes messing up one of those CD windows just feel awful.

Destro has a similar issue. Where it is fun during its CD windows, but outside of the infernal window, its dull to play. There needs to be a way to have more frequent ramps. Every min or so, there should be a fun dps ramp. Some more proc based gameplay to add a little spice to the spec. Its Destruction. It should feel a little reckless and dangerous to play.

Affliction. Malefic Rapture. Need I say more. It does not feel good to spend shards on it. And not being able to control shard generation, hinders how the spec feels to play. There needs to be a way to have the DoTs be the star of the show. To extend the DoTs through gameplay and have the ability to cause them to deal increased damage, without making them broken in AoE situations. Also ditch Observer. It is not an interesting CD. And cramming AoE dps into a 3min CD isnt fun or good.

These are my opinions. Not fact based. Just feeling based.

1 Like

Druid main here. Rdruids feel so awful that I’ve been playing my presentation evoker and I’m just bombing my team with heals while my druid is desperately trying to stack heals for a 16+. If anyone gots advice would love it. :cloud_with_rain:

All tank specs. Mass pulling mobs and aoe’ing them down is bad design and a jumbled mess.

3 Likes

Warlock. Easily.

Blizzard keeps making raid fights with more and more movement and swirlies and such, while they keep doubling diwn on Warlocks being tanky turret casters that can’t do anything while moving, but also at the same time frequently nerfs Warlock tankyness because apparently people don’t like Warlock not dying to a single GCD in PvP, so in the end, Warlocks end up being squishy turret specs with no mobility.

To make up for this, Blizz gives warlocks high damage profiles - which people end up hating because they’re sick of warlocks always being good in raids. Even though warlock just doesn’t really feel that good to play in a raid because they are at the merct of RNG.

Then there’s that whole Demo situation, where Demo has an insane burst profile, but it requires exactly the right trinkets, it requires a priest hitting you with PI, and it requires you being allowed to sit there churning out as many spells as you can in a good 20 or so seconds without any swirly or mechanic randomly targeting you and forcing you to move. If you don’t manage to get all this your dps tanks, and outside of your burst profile you do literally worse than Tank DPS.

Blizzard recently reworked demo talents in an attempt to fix this huge damage disparity, but all they ended up doing was remove fun talents and add in boring generic stat boost talents. The end result? Nothing changed. Demos damage profile remained exactly the same. It was just made less fun.

Destro will always suffer from Havoc. Don’t get me wrong, Havoc is a great spell, but its mere existence prevents Destro from being stronger in single target, because the stronger Destro is in single target, the stronger it’ll be in 2 target cleave. But that isn’t even its biggest issue. Rain of Fire is. Destro is now, to my knowledge, the only spec in the game that cannot AoE if the pack keeps moving around. In order for Destro to do good AoE damage, it needs 2 things. First, it needs the tank to stay still and keep the pack in the RoF. Not always possible, as certain pulls demands kiting, not to mention certain M+ affixes. The more a tank is forced to move and kite, the less desireable Destro is. And as with raiding, Blizzard is as always further encouraging more movement all the time.

The second thing Destro needs to AoE is a huge pack of mobs that won’t die too quickly. Since RoF costs 3 of the 5 shards we can get, we’re reliant of shard generation to AoE, and that means we’re reliant on the RoF damage ticks generating shards. The more mobs hit, the more shards generated, the more RoF we can layer down for even more shard generation and AoE damage. Under perfect circumstances Destro AoE is fantastic, but the moment the tank is forced to move (or moves for no reason) all of it is lost and has to be started all over again. And with bigger pulls, there’s much higher chances of the tank having to move.

As for Aff? I don’t play Aff, so I can’t comment. But I’ve not heard the Aff community be happy for a long time now.

So yeah, Warlocks are easily going the wrong direction. They just don’t really fit the game design anymore and are only ever actually good because of brute force rather than actually fitting in. It’s like putting the square peg in the round hole. It doesn’t fit, it’ll never fit, but use enough force and it’ll go in, just no one will like the results.

Yeah, this is what stresses me out when I try to play a Warlock in dungeons. I have no problems with Rogue’s combo points system, but Soul Shards and Holy Power are actually starting to piss me off when I’m on my Warlock and Paladin.

Also I wish they’d make Balance Druid gameplay more engaging. I actually fall asleep trying to play them for extended periods of time.

it’s a joke at this point.

You can literally lose ~70% DPS as 2H Oblit frost if your tank moves the mob 15 yards away.

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AGREED AGREED AGREED AGREED I am not enjoying any of the specs right now like it’s just too much too clunky and unfun relearnin shadow every expac I also just plain don’t enjoy the void-y aspect of Shadow Priest I miss the old old old Spriest

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Dev openly said it wasn’t a “Paladin tier rework, more like mage or balance druid” - which means… % based aura buffs, some talent tree changes. Nothing fundamentally improved.

and the class is quite literally unplayable in mythic raiding/20+ keys atm.

Well… I SAID WHAT I SAID!!! Its an opinion.

Go back to eating cut up boiled hot dogs for dinner jabroni