Welp my fellow bears, looks like BFA 2.0

With the next Beta/PTR build, we’re transitioning away from spending the majority of our time on the design iteration of the new talent trees, and we’re now primarily focused on fixing bugs and tuning the game.

I don’t want to cry Doooom, but unless they have actually overhauled guardian druids and haven’t pushed it to the PTR yet, looks like the last minor change was all they were willing to give us.

Disclaimer. I’m not saying bears are nonfunctional, or completely unable to do minor content, it’s just we have been glazed over for anything new or exciting to get me interested in the next Expac.

Tbh because I’m not looking forward to playing a alt, instead of my main, but if that means playing an alt I can help my group better achieve our goals, I will.

Because It’s beginning to feel like BFA all over again. In that expac, G-bears were literally ignored us for what like 8 months into the expac. Broken. Until they had nothing better to do , then they gave us a fix.

It also seems a few Bear twitch streamers are planning on changing class if this stays as is… so there’s that.


I don’t think those exist TBH. Care to link a few?

Well Nihillothebear’s been my favorite, though I’ll admit ive been absent off his twitch for a bit, I’ve watched Sha and Tactyks more so on youtube than twitch, there’s also Orphgamiing and Nevertorpid for RGB’s and of course Pumps the guide writer for WoWhead who is also on Dreamgrove Discord & youtube are the ones I generally watch if time allows.

Currently Sha is like…yeah…bear is a hot mess in compared to other talent tree’s that allow you to work around bad talents via side connections where as bears are forced into taking them no choice to get to the actual talent you want.


Is anyone surprised? The last blue post on bears was years ago.

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We got the ability to somewhat customise our enrage. Thats sorta something right?

Not in my book.

Paying multiple valuable points (3 to be exact) to get the same single power as it has always been before isn’t exactly a reward and feels punishing to receive a lesser version if you don’t spend the 3 points.

Just for example prot warrior have an awesome tree by the way, we need that dev to come over lol… .they can use points to diversify on multiple build(s) types depending on his/her needs for said dungeon.

They can go around multiple nodes they feel are underwhelming and still reach the same capstone goal. Its the way the nodes are set as a diamond that interconnects with other diamonds giving you more choice about your character’s final build.

Our two choices are do you want Laser bear or do you want Thrash/Maul bear… there you go. I suppose you could make a semi-thrash/maul lazer bear but that will mean you get zero capstones.

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Not gunna lie, having a blast with laser bear myself. I do see your point though

oh no doubt, just want to make it clear… bears will be functional for sure.

It could always be better and just a bit disappointed in it’s handling and lack of a change/feedback cycle that most classes got several.

I Suppose I could look on the bright side and say… the other classes needed several feedback loops, just because they were not in fact laser bears.

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Majority. Emphasis on the words that were actually said, right? Why is everyone such a doomer? Did we not get amazing changes for feral? fantastic changes for boomers? fantastic changes for resto? Come on team have a little common sense.

You’re making this blue post a black and white statement when it wasn’t. Nothing about this post means Guardians or the Druid class tree aren’t getting another pass. There are 36 something specs, and almost all of them are ready to move on to the tuning phase even everyone thinks their favorite spec deserves another pass.

Honestly, Druid class tree and Guardian spec trees are the only ones that need a second pass. That might trigger Paladins and Arcane mages and (insert your favorite spec that you feel has some glaring flaws here) but it is true.

If Blizzard only has 2-3 trees left to re-org, then saying they’re moving the majority of their time to bugs and tuning is obviously a true statement and was arguably true for the last two weeks too.

I don’t see the doom and gloom as warranted.

Sure, prot warriors are doing stupid DPS right now. I watched sha and was like “dang, 80k?” But there is basically no chance warriors get out of Beta that godly. I mean, they are just stupid right now. I expect their will get a healthy helping of the nerf bat to the face.

But the warrior talent tree is something to be emulated. multiple ways to get from left to right of tree and pick up good talents and adapt game play. Being able to pick stuff at the bottom, and not worry about the capstones because you can cross over effectively is what’s missing for druids. That, and actual useful capstones.

And the general druid tree to me is 75% useless for guardian. I end up spending tons of talents just to get a few items like astral affinity, typhoon, and the basic abilities.

I’m on the fence about guardian. I think its gonna be a solid A tier tank. Is it going to be competing on the key race? not right now. Is it competitive at 15-20 that the vast majority of us do? we’ll have to see, but I think it will be.

That said, it does need some work and I’m hopeful that with 3 of 4 trees having major overhauls, that guardian is close to getting its as well. Output is okay, but is lacking compared to the top tanks. But at least we aren’t prot pallies…now those guys need some serious love.

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Let me clarify. The doom and gloom is more a feeling a disappointment more than anything. I have said, bears will function but it’s still a disappointment.

This is of course based on my history with my bear since BC and a repeat in similarities to BFA in this build up to Dragonflight. Granted the Devs still have time to renew my faith but with a history as such (below) I’m think my reaction is pretty much accurate & warranted

4-19-22 Dragonflight reveal
6-3-22 Druid/DK tree preview
7-1-22 Priest Tree Preview
7-8-22 Rogue/Hunter Tree Preview
7-11-22 Feedback Hunter Tree
7-14-22 Evoker Tree Preview
7-15-22 DK/Hunter Tree Feedback
7-19-22 Evoker feedback/Shaman Tree Preview/Rework on existing trees including G-Druid
7-22-22 Hunter tuning
7-26-22 Mage/Paladin tree preview/Priest Feedback
7/30/22 Hunter/Evoker Tuning
8/2/22 Warrior talent preview
8/3/22 Shaman Tree Feedback
8/9/22 Evoker, Warrior, Hunter, Paladin, shaman tuning/ Warlock Tree preview
8/12/22 Hunter Feedback
8/17/22 Monk Tree Preview/ Hunter, paladin, warrior, warlock tuning
8/19/22 DK/Shaman Feedback/ Hunter tuning & Feedback
8/22/22 Mage, Paladin, Warlock Feedback & Tuning
8/24/22 DH Tree preview
8/25/22 Major class tuning DK, DH, Evoker, Hunter, Mage, Monk, Shaman, Warlock, Warrior tuning
8/25/22 Ion Says Druids/Priest deserve better communication
8/26/22 DK talents & Feedback
8/27/22 DH Feedback
8/29/22 MW Monk Feedback
8/30/22 Priest tuning & Feedback
9/1/22 DK, DH (vengeance preview), Evoker, mage, monk, paladin, priest, warlock, warrior tuning
9/3/22 DH feedback, Resto/Feral druid Feedback, Hunter, Shaman tuning
9/7/22 DK, Resto/Feral druid, evoker, hunter, priest, shaman, warlock, warrior tuning.
9/9/22 H-paladin, DK, DH tuning & feedback
9/10/22 Hunter, Enhancement shaman tuning
9/13/22 DK, Balance druid, Evoker, hunter, monk, paladin, priest, shaman, warrior tuning
9/14/22 Priest Feedback
9/16/22 Rogue, Feral Druid Tuning & Feedback
9/17/22 Resto Druid, Rogue, Hunter, Ehancement shaman turning & Feedback
9/20/22 Warrior Feedback
9/21/22 Frost Dk, Feral Druid, Balance Druid, Resto Druid, Hunter ,Mage, Monk, Priest, Shaman, Warlock, Warrior Tuning/Feedback
9/21/22 Stealth change to two talents in G-Druid Tree, not even in patch notes.
9/23/22 Evoker Tuning
9/24/22 Evoker feedback.
9/28/22 Balance druid rework and some minor changes to DH, Rogue, Resto…does a reworked Mark of the Wild count as a G-druid rework? …

Incase you missed it, I highlighted the two times anything was mentioned about Guardian druids and the two times something had a minor change… even if one of them was without mentioning in patch notes.

So saying that other class/specs would request something just because we, the guardian druids would get our first feedback/major tuning phase since first announcement of Dragonflight would be a bit of stretch considering the history and so goes my sinking feeling we are not on the back burner… because we’re not even in on the current list.

I’ll just await for Activision to change my mind. If they do, I’ll be surprised. However I won’t feel wrong or apologize, because well as you can see, they said they would communicate, and they still haven’t… not even a “hey, we know you bears are still waiting”


I feel so famous.
Also yes, 116 days.
Thinking about playing Warrior again.

But i will agree with one comment above: Laser Bear is doing fat damage.

yes from what i have heard
bears frost mages
disc priest and ret are all
in the toilet

Key words in their post are “majority of our time”. Doesn’t mean they’re done yet, just less changes on that front moving forward. I’m confident guardian changes are well on their way and may even show up in the next beta build tomorrow.

Important thing to consider is that they havent started on tuning yet. Currently its the talent trees that are lacking…who knows what can happen to tuning when DF strikes.

If that happens, I’ll be happily surprised, along with the rest of you I’ll will rejoice, but I wont be apologizing for my lack of confidence as that is due to Activisions lack of any communication to the bear community which is only a repeat of BFA. Other than an open apology for the lack of communication only to be followed up by a lack of communication go figure.

Guardian Disco Bear build at WoWhead

That much is true, probably why i’ll stick with this build , the Standard disco bear talents which also has Incarn, all the major DR talents and the Incarn CDR. Then in the general tree, making sure to pick up the Nurturing instincts which synergizes with the disco bear.

The one point in renewal could be switched for one point in Natural recovery since it’s a 2pnt for 1pnt effect if you’re looking for more healing passives that feeds off the moonfires as well.

The capstones in the general tree are bad imo, natures virgil is the only good one as it would work with the disco bear but unfortunately that would require a 4 points to get to, if you go via the Sunfire route. Heart of the wild, I’d only take that if I was Owlvoking and Furor is hardly worth the point.

That’s the current build plan until if/when things change.

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Do people Only play Guardian Druid and not the other specs? Is there an actual Bear Community outside the husky LGBT Community?

I play Bear, but I play Tree, Moonkin and Cat just as much and swap depending on the content I am playing.

I dont think Doom and Gloom is ever a benefical stance, Im not gonna stop rubbing my bear nuts on trees until after release and given a few months after before things settle.

Sha (Farseer Sha on Twitch) is the first one that comes to mind. He runs multiple tanks, but bear is (was) his main.

at least bear 4 piece set bonus looks good

Its reallly not though when you actually think about it. Theres alot of problems with it and why its trash in reality.